Update on Pinnacle Upgrade time

[i fly boxes]

Just to let all of you know, they just awarded an upgrade to seniority # 859. I am in the low to mid 900's and I have been here 1 1/2 years. If they don't lower total time required to upgrade and you have the time, upgrade could soon drop below 1 year for a while, especially when they have been hiring all these low time people who will be fo's for at least 2 years.

 

[Top Gum]

 Just to let all of you know, they just awarded an upgrade to seniority # 859.[/html[/SIZE]][/SIZE]
 
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]If this is true I stand corrected about PCL having plenty of FO’s with the time to upgrade.[/SIZE][/FONT]
 
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]Not sure if the site just hasn’t updated yet but I didn’t find any award posted that went so junior.[/SIZE] [/FONT]

 

[PCL_128]

It's an accurate number. With the further upgrades expected this year, I wouldn't be surprised to see us dip well into the 900s by the spring.

 

[BOHICAgain]

It's an accurate number. With the further upgrades expected this year, I wouldn't be surprised to see us dip well into the 900s by the spring.

WOW so J.M. wont be last, I though he was gonna be there forever.

My training date was DEC 04 and Hire date was FEB 05 I would have been the 3 most junior FO to hold it, but im short by >150. So hopefully by end of FEB i can bid..

 

[Grinder10]

As much as everyone seems to be against lowering the upgrade mins, it will become a necessity. The combination of more planes, even higher attrition when the majors start hiring, many large classes of new hires with a max of 500 total, and already abysmal captain staffing will cause this.

 

[WildBlue]

Lowering the minimums is NOT mandatory....not by a long shot. Pinnacle has hired off the street captains before and can do it again. Just hope they screen those fellas a little better. That first group had some pretty arrogant jacka..es.

 

[gnx99]

The 7 year Mesaba FO's must be loving this Oh well...

Just curious, what's the most junior MSP captain date of hire? I have numerous CFI friends that went their. Just interested in where they sit.

 

[Mesabi Miner]

We do.

 

[arthompson]

Most Junior MSP CA was hired in April of 05 (Street Captain)

 

[XJohXJ]

On behalf of all Mesaba FO's:


Ouch!

 

[another cfii]

As a fellow redtail brother from 9E, I have all the best wishes for our XJ brothers. And I know XJ will rise again, because NW can't stand having 1 regionals much bigger than the other, cuz it will not allow them maximum room to whipsaw against us.

And when XJ rises, upgrade will be back to normal. I still remember XJ used to hire low timers just like 9E does now, so it's just a matter of time before a bunch of 90 seaters parking outside gate C gates in MSP replacing the beloved Avro where it used to sit, with "Operated by Mesaba Airlines" on it.

I even told my newhire FO if they want to fly bigger RJ (not that i recommend it for the same crappy pay), bolt to Mesaba if they got the next batch, cuz 9E is gonna stall for quite a few years. In this industry, we all know, "When it rains, it pours"...

Fly safe

 

[EL10]

Most Junior MSP CA was hired in April of 05 (Street Captain)

Isn't the most junior CA award for MSP on the latest vacancy around the mid 100's in seniority? That has to be about 7 to 8 years of longevity.

 

[arthompson]

I don't know about the latest but RS starts UPG on 15 Jan and he's in the mid 400's. JM and JT are in UPG currently and were in the 400's just senior to RS. All 3 were awarded MSP CA. We have several CA's that base jump regularly or have been trying to get into a particular base for awhile because it's closer to home.

 

[Lear70]

Lowering the minimums is NOT mandatory....not by a long shot. Pinnacle has hired off the street captains before and can do it again. Just hope they screen those fellas a little better. That first group had some pretty arrogant jacka..es.

BINGO!

And your memory isn't entirely accurate about the first couple street CA classes in 2001. The company made sure they hired the best that was out there, guys with no issues, previous checkride problems, good HR backgrounds, then threw them into a training department that was, quite possibly, the worse I've ever seen.

The systems instructor wasn't a pilot. He was an ex-military grunt who wanted you to think was an Army Ranger "Caused he JUMPED off of TANKS and HELICOPTERS and KILLED PEOPLE DEAD!" (you had to be there to hear that little rant, it made the class SO much more fun to be able to razz on this guy.

This instructor had absolutely ZERO teaching ability or background. He had been pulled from being a baggage boy into the CEC and watched 2 initial classes go through, was handed the slides, and said "Go for it."

Nothing more irritating than to have to have your OWN class AFTER class is over for the day. And we did. Had 3 or 4 new-hire F/O's who had never flown a jet study with us in the hotel lounge at least 3 times per week to help them unlearn the crap he'd filled their head with.

Now if that makes us "Pretty arrogant jackasses" to put our foot down and say, "I know just enough to be able to say that is COMPLETE bull******************** and is not how the system works". Some people were more political, but at some point you gotta tell the guy he's just wrong or other people suffer - that whole law of primacy thing for learning going on.

However, the street CA plan, for the most part, worked out well for Corporate, and I'd be very surprised to see them go directly to lowering minimums before seeing what they could find in the available street CA pool first.

It happened that way 3 times while I was there, it'll probably happen again.

 

[DoinTime]

And your memory isn't entirely accurate about the first couple street CA classes in 2001. The company made sure they hired the best that was out there, guys with no issues, previous checkride problems, good HR backgrounds, then threw them into a training department that was, quite possibly, the worse I've ever seen.

Pinnacle has a sorted history of hiring street Captains that dates back to the 1980's. In recent times the street hiring started with regularity in late 2000 with a group of direct entry Saab captains that sprang from a checkered past of 135 freight operators, coorporate pilots, and high time flight instructors. Only one had prior 121 experience, all of which was in the right seat of the Saab. Except for a few of the applicants that turned out to be aces most of this group were about as worthless as tits on a bull. Most of that class has since been fired or they made lateral (or downward) moves to other carriers.

Mental illness seemed to the common link between many of the ones that got fired. It is unclear on if they were nutz prior to starting with PCL or if the years of reserve drove them insane.

 

[PinnacleDude]

BINGO!

And your memory isn't entirely accurate about the first couple street CA classes in 2001. The company made sure they hired the best that was out there, guys with no issues, previous checkride problems, good HR backgrounds, then threw them into a training department that was, quite possibly, the worse I've ever seen.

Actually, I remember you being about the worst there was. The place actually improved when you left. There are several street captains that went to AirTran and Continental that ARE standout guys. The street captains from Indy are excellent.

The only difference between the XJ and Pinnacle pilots is luck and timing. Every XJ pilot I have run accross has been very professional, courteous, and friendly. I wish you all the best and maybe you can get the good things you deserve when NWA takes over. I was inspired by your fight to uphold a fair contract and when the chips are down, I hope the Pinnacle pilots fight just as hard.

Dude out.

 

[Inconceivable]

The systems instructor wasn't a pilot. He was an ex-military grunt who wanted you to think was an Army Ranger "Caused he JUMPED off of TANKS and HELICOPTERS and KILLED PEOPLE DEAD!" (you had to be there to hear that little rant, it made the class SO much more fun to be able to razz on this guy.

This instructor had absolutely ZERO teaching ability or background. He had been pulled from being a baggage boy into the CEC and watched 2 initial classes go through, was handed the slides, and said "Go for it."

Harsh dude. You are neglecting a few positive points, like how you never had to stay seated for more than 8 minutes because that's when the next break would be--he had to run outside to suck on his cigarettes at least that often.

Some of my favorite moments include:

"Do not press the IDG DISC button--if you do, mx has to remove the engine from the wing to fix it and they WILL fire you."

Asking the female new hire (who had just told someone that she colored her hair) if her pubic hair was blond too....Greg F. nearly ripped his arms off that day.

The day he nearly got in a fight with Tom F. because he somehow thought it was a good idea to refer to all Marines as pu$sies who rape children. The major was not amused.

And this is just up to mid-2000. I honestly can't remember his name, I started calling him "DB" for dirtbag after the pubic hair incident.

 

[Lear70]

Actually, I remember you being about the worst there was. The place actually improved when you left.

Easy to say from the anonymity of your computer.

Have the balls to tell me who you are so we can discuss this like MEN instead of hiding and slinging mud?

I thought not...

Funny you say I was "about the worst there was", when it was PCL recommendations that got me my job here at AirTran. Seeing as there's only about 6 PCL pilots here I knew when I got hired and most of them gave me LOR's, guess you must be in the minority.

 

[n32jk]

Yawn!!!!

 

[psycho]

Hey lear 70,

I remember you from 9e and I was impressed by your knowledge of both the contract and company manuals.

I also remember that from a CRM standpiont you were one of the worst pilots we ever had. You can fly the shiite out of any airplane, but you are a rat. Any chance you get to write up a fellow crewmember, you go for it.

By the way, do not ask me to PM you so that we can deal with this face to face. You look like Beavis and you are built like him, so your method being an internet tough guy will not work with me.

 

[Lear70]

A rat? ME? LOL... ok, what you said.

Calling ME an internet tough guy?

You guys are the ones hiding behind your screen names, not me. So when you're done slinging mud from the cover of anonymity, give me a shout.

Incidentally, writing someone up after you've tried to work it out with them face-to-face and pro standards FIRST is your PROFESSIONAL RESPONSIBILITY. Safety comes before anything. Period.

Seeing as I only did so on a handful of occasions over a 5 year PCL career flying with literally HUNDREDS of F/O's while I was on reserve for 3 1/2 years, your assertion of me acting on "any chance to write a crewmember up" is assinine.

The fact that one was released after failing retraining and the other was fired for sexual harassment doesn't really count for anything either.

If you have PROOF I wrote people up regularly, please post it here. Otherwise, you can have a hot cup of STFU since I and those who know me are well aware that you're lying through your teeth.

Somehow I doubt you and the other guy have the balls to come out and confront me face to face. You internet tough guys are all the same, insults and taunts, but NEVER letting people know who you are.

Cowards, one and all.