Union at Flops?
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futurepizzaguy
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Not true at all. The majority of us see nothing good happening from sending the cards in. Couldve been a possibility though had something beneficial come out of all the negotiations, mediations, etc etc from the other guys. Waste of money with not much help in many of our minds. You read alot of "just sent my card in" on this board.....but you don't see many reasons why people do that.
beechjetpilot1
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Open Letter To Fence Sitters
To all of you who are don't want to send in your card, here are a few things to think about:
First, sending in your card does not mean you are voting "yes" to a union. It will enable an open discussion about the pros and cons of a union for a period of time. At a certain date, a vote will happen where everyone will have the chance to voice an opionion. If after all the discussion you want to vote against, go ahead. But without sending in you card, we won't even have the chance to openly discuss and have a option for organization.
Second, if anyone is unsure that we will all be forced to work the "flex" schedule in the future, they are crazy. Without the protection of a contrat...or status quo (meaning things can't change once we vote "yes" for organization), we can be forced into this at any time.....an example of this was the latest domicile policy changes. Everyone was told a year and a half ago that tier 3's will be grandfathered. Now look at it....no tier 3's. We need protection from the whims of management.
Third, right now some bean counter is adding up how much money can be saved by reducing our health benefits, our per diem and hotel quality. Sooner or later these things too will be reduced or taken away all together. With the protection of organization, we will have a seat at the table when these changes are being discussed.
I am not a gung-ho union guy. I have reservations about the long and troubled history of the teamsters. However, I believe at some point a union is a necassary evil. I don't want one, but I think we are at the point where we need some collective voice of our pilots in the process as our advocates. With the recent change of local unions at netjets and organizing under their own local, I believe the good now out weighs the bads of a union. I believe we will have some protection of quality of life issues, benefits and compensation. These things ARE on the chopping block in our current situation, and the only hope we have to having some involvement of what happens to us at Flight Options is to organize.
Please send in your cards to give us the chance of openly discussing if we should have a union. Again, you're not voting "yes" for a union yet, you're just enabling a chance for a vote later! This may be our only chance to have a say in our futures at Flops. If you have any questions about what I have written, PM me.
Those are my 2 cents
To all of you who are don't want to send in your card, here are a few things to think about:
First, sending in your card does not mean you are voting "yes" to a union. It will enable an open discussion about the pros and cons of a union for a period of time. At a certain date, a vote will happen where everyone will have the chance to voice an opionion. If after all the discussion you want to vote against, go ahead. But without sending in you card, we won't even have the chance to openly discuss and have a option for organization.
Second, if anyone is unsure that we will all be forced to work the "flex" schedule in the future, they are crazy. Without the protection of a contrat...or status quo (meaning things can't change once we vote "yes" for organization), we can be forced into this at any time.....an example of this was the latest domicile policy changes. Everyone was told a year and a half ago that tier 3's will be grandfathered. Now look at it....no tier 3's. We need protection from the whims of management.
Third, right now some bean counter is adding up how much money can be saved by reducing our health benefits, our per diem and hotel quality. Sooner or later these things too will be reduced or taken away all together. With the protection of organization, we will have a seat at the table when these changes are being discussed.
I am not a gung-ho union guy. I have reservations about the long and troubled history of the teamsters. However, I believe at some point a union is a necassary evil. I don't want one, but I think we are at the point where we need some collective voice of our pilots in the process as our advocates. With the recent change of local unions at netjets and organizing under their own local, I believe the good now out weighs the bads of a union. I believe we will have some protection of quality of life issues, benefits and compensation. These things ARE on the chopping block in our current situation, and the only hope we have to having some involvement of what happens to us at Flight Options is to organize.
Please send in your cards to give us the chance of openly discussing if we should have a union. Again, you're not voting "yes" for a union yet, you're just enabling a chance for a vote later! This may be our only chance to have a say in our futures at Flops. If you have any questions about what I have written, PM me.
Those are my 2 cents
FLYLOW22
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futurepizzaguy said:
Actually, there have been several situations that I think EVERY NJA pilot can say the group faired better on because a Union was on the property. In fact, any pilot at NJA that says we would be better off with NO Union has never spent time getting involved with the process.
**91K- Company doesn't bug me on my last day off.
**Crew meals- They are there as ordered (no out of pocket) or we go get something to eat in a car (regardless of schedule) in the interests of safety and blood sugar levels.
**Gateways- Not going anywhere. The company COULD close a gateway per the language but I think they know that the reaction from the Union and pilots would be swift and sure.
**Compliance to maintain contract items in writing regarding... well many things! Everything in the contract was enforcable last week. It is enforceable next week and will be enforceable until we vote in a sucessor CBA. At least we know that things can't get much worse without at least a reach-around. We know what our bottom floor is. The ceiling is limited by how far the pilot group is willing to go.
No one has even mentioned the benefits of having multiple Frax Unionized under one roof. Pilots need to take care of each other. Unionization is a great vehicle to reach that goal.
It took some time but hell... I just had $280 bucks put in my last paycheck that would not have been paid without a Union, a contract and a grievance process. Better late than NEVER.
Every little piece helps.
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beechjetpilot1
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I wouldn't say I "want" a union, but I believe we "need" a union and I will vote for one.
cosmotheassman
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No thanks. If company X goes on strike, why should company Y suffer for it? This would be the worst thing to happen in my opinion. I personally don't want someone at a different company than my own to suffer because my own company wont bargain with me. That's ridiculous to think that way. Netjets is fishing for anything at this point...
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jetwash
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You seem to misunderstand that if for example Ford workers go on strike the workers at GM don't go out on the picket line. When Ford settles a contract with the union then the union takes that contract to GM and puts it on the table until they accept it then the same contract (more or less) goes to Chrysler until they accept it. That way all the workers are more or less getting close to the same agreement.
If the pay rates and work rules were set at one Fractional then that would be a basis for a contract with the next Fractional.
This way labor costs at all of the fracs will be in line with each other so they can then go onto other aspects of the business.
Now the question is how good a contract can the union get.
If the pay rates and work rules were set at one Fractional then that would be a basis for a contract with the next Fractional.
This way labor costs at all of the fracs will be in line with each other so they can then go onto other aspects of the business.
Now the question is how good a contract can the union get.
cosmotheassman
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Ok that makes a little more sense; however, if it was all under the same union you're telling me that NJA wouldn't expect everyone else to strike with them? I think they would expect it judging from the talk I hear from their pilots.
Starman
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Cosmo -
You're mistaken. You've heard incorrectly. Each pilot group would belong to the union but would have individual contracts with their respective companies. If Netjets were to go on strike, the Flight Options pilots would continue doing their job at Options.
You're mistaken. You've heard incorrectly. Each pilot group would belong to the union but would have individual contracts with their respective companies. If Netjets were to go on strike, the Flight Options pilots would continue doing their job at Options.
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