UNI-TED Strikes Again!!!

[flying4food]

Yet, another fine example of United's quality service!!!


Passengers stuck on plane all night

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July 11, 2004

BY LORI RACKL Staff Reporter






Passengers on a United Airlines flight to Chicago arrived at O'Hare Airport on Saturday morning not by plane but by bus, after spending the night stranded on the tarmac in Milwaukee.

Flight 256 from Denver to Chicago was supposed to land at O'Hare at 9:58 p.m. Friday. Weather in Chicago caused the plane, carrying 155 passengers, to be diverted to Milwaukee's General Mitchell International Airport.

But the only gate at the airport capable of handling the wide-body 777 was occupied by an Air France cargo jet, which also had been diverted because of weather, United spokesman Rich Nelson said. The Air France crew couldn't move the plane because they would have exceeded the maximum number of hours they're allowed to work, Nelson said.

With the help of Northwest Airlines, United eventually got a movable stairway to the side of the plane, allowing passengers to disembark around 5 a.m. United then bused them to Chicago.

"We're looking into why the airport was unable to make other accommodations for us so we could get passengers off the plane," Nelson said.

Dan Nettesheim, 58, was one of the passengers on the flight. He said United only had pretzels and water to tide them over. And once they landed at Milwaukee, the pilot told them that mechanical problems with the plane meant they couldn't take off.

"We were all very frustrated," said Nettesheim, who lives in Milwaukee but had his car parked at O'Hare. "A woman I sat next to had an 11 a.m. wedding in Chicago, and all her clothes were in her luggage, which they couldn't get to."

Nelson said the airline will be contacting all of the passengers and "offering them the equivalent of a round-trip domestic ticket."





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[flythere]

It's only a matter of time,,,, TED, the end of UNI-TED or Total Economic Destruction.

 

[AAflyer]

Weather in ORD this summer........UAL's fault

An AirFance CARGO jet using the only available gate (WTFO)....UAL's fault

Not having catered the airplane with meals for everyone knowing this might happen........UAL's fault

A MX on the airplane develops....Once again UAL's fault

Having the money and time to explain this to the average passenger. $91 bucks and hour.

Having to explain this to other airline pilots......Price less

AA

 

[Draginass]

Score another victory for the crack management team at UAL . . . . or is it the UAL management team on crack? I can never remember which.

The Captain should have told the passengers what was probably the truth . . . . "our management at United can't get it's act together, won't allow allow us to take off again for Chicago, won't get us a bus or a gate or air stairs to let you off the jet. If you're interested here's a phone number to call and complain right now while were waiting."

 

[Oakum_Boy]

Weather in ORD this summer........UAL's fault

An AirFance CARGO jet using the only available gate (WTFO)....UAL's fault

AA

What kind of decision between pilot and dispatcher to go to Milwaukee with a 777? Did they not consider handling capability?

 

[AAflyer]

Oakum,

Like so many other events that occur in our industry it is easy to throw stones when we were not in the cockpit, or in operations and know exactly what happened.

We can speculate all we want, but then wouldn't we be hypocrites? We can't stand it when the media does it after all.

AA

 

[embdrvr]

What would you guys have done differently?

The crew needed an alternate and MKE was suitable. Obviously noone knew some French freight dogs took the only gate.

Regrettable yes. Preventable? Let's be realistic.

 

[skykid]

And this has what to do with TED? Daginass - always smart to throw darts based on a article that is going to get about 50% of it right. I always like to second guess other flight crews, especially when the only facts I have are from the media. If it makes you feel good you can pretend United has the worst service in the business, but that is not what the gov rankings and customer feedback (at record levels for intent to repurchase) show.

 

[Draginass]

Say for the sake of arguement that they landed at 11pm, an hour after schedule due to weather. So I suppose that holding people prisoner on an airplane for six hours is acceptable service. It's not the crew's fault. I'm sure they were livid. Some bonehead in management should have had his butt out of bed in into that airport to get some air stairs up to that airplane and at least get the pax in the terminal.

 

[USNFDX]

They just should've blown the door and the airstair!

 

[Swede]

What would you guys have done differently?

The crew needed an alternate and MKE was suitable. Obviously noone knew some French freight dogs took the only gate.

Regrettable yes. Preventable? Let's be realistic.

If I'm driving around in a 777, darned right I am going to consider the airport facility for the divert. Unless they were on fumes or on fire, there are probably a few superior airports than MKE. STL, DET, MSP? Plenty of fields better than MKE for a big boy like the 777.

Available maintenance also comes into play if you have the fuel... it's always nice to choose an airport with your brand's maintenance on hand, especially if they can handle your aircraft type.

 

[skykid]

Swede, I always second guessed 777 Captains when I had 75+ hours, too. The good thing about second guessing pilots based on very limited information is no one will ever do it to you, right?

 

[buzzer]

I bet the pilots were livid too...just as pissed as the passengers.

 

[thruthemurk]

whatever

 

[CatYaaak]

Just another reason to hate the French.

 

[bandit110]

Unless they were on fumes or on fire, there are probably a few superior airports than MKE. STL, DET, MSP? Plenty of fields better than MKE for a big boy like the 777.

God, I'd love to see a 777 pull up to Murray in the Hood at DET. Maybe they could use the Pro Air gates.

http://www.airnav.com/airport/KDET


I know what you ment DTW, just made me laugh thinking about it.

 

[AAflyer]

Swede, I always second guessed 777 Captains when I had 75+ hours, too. The good thing about second guessing pilots based on very limited information is no one will ever do it to you, right?

Skykid,

Swede probably has over 7500 hours and flies the 767 on Int'l routes for a major US airline.

I know and agree it would help if we knew what was going on, but he does bring up a valid point. Was MKE the original alternate on the flight plan? Do UALs ops use airports for alternates that only meet the basic requirements, or are they specific for the aircraft. How much fuel did they have left (I know it is a 777, but the with the cost of gas these days I bet they had the minimum they needed.) So many questions, but too hard to judge or assume anything not being there.

AA
If you look at his ratings as a food boy movie critic, that is our word for Relief Pilots. Not that this really matters, just thought I would let you know he has more than 75 hours, unless we changed our hiring mins.

 

[embdrvr]

If I'm driving around in a 777, darned right I am going to consider the airport facility for the divert. Unless they were on fumes or on fire, there are probably a few superior airports than MKE. STL, DET, MSP? Plenty of fields better than MKE for a big boy like the 777.

Available maintenance also comes into play if you have the fuel... it's always nice to choose an airport with your brand's maintenance on hand, especially if they can handle your aircraft type.

Swede,
Judging by your profile I'm guessing you may not be a Part 121 captain. When you make the decision to divert you talk to dispatch. Unless the alternate is already on the release you'll need a fuel burn and some performance numbers. If I'm diverting I want to know as much information as possible about the options and if possible I'll take the aircraft somewhere convenient for the company (and pax). There's a lot to consider and not always a lot of time to figure it out. Whenever I've diverted I usually find myself with plenty of company. If a Cat 3 777 can't get in to ORD probably noone is landing there. So guess what sport? Lots of folks are calling bingo fuel and heading to the alternates. STL, DET, and MSP may have already had traffic stacking up or had wx issues of their own. MKE might have seemed like a good idea at the time. I wasn't in the cockpit with the crew. I don't know the wx or any of the specifics. Before I second guess a fellow captain I'd want to know a lot more information than what I read in the newpaper.

 

[Ty Webb]

Lots of folks are calling bingo fuel and heading to the alternates. STL, DET, and MSP may have already had traffic stacking up or had wx issues of their own. MKE might have seemed like a good idea at the time. I wasn't in the cockpit with the crew. I don't know the wx or any of the specifics. Before I second guess a fellow captain I'd want to know a lot more information than what I read in the newpaper.

Excellent points.

 

[climbhappy]

I think the assessment of thie situation at MKE as it unfolded was incorrect, due to the late hour and wondering what a foreign carrier could do. Then it turned into an hour then two , and finally let's get a bus.

One just had to think a gate would open up, but the in retrospect, a call for the bus at the first sign of trouble could have made this a non event.

One simply can't predict all of the intangibles on a situation like this. therefore, the call to go to MKE wasn't a bad one , but how they handled it when they arrived is the faux pas here.