UAL T/A and staple of UAL guys?

[HA25]

Reading the new UAL T/A, do I understand correctly that they intend to staple every furloughed UAL guy below all the CAL guys, Date of Hire be damned?

Also, is there a longevity pay protection for the UAL guys for the time they spent on the street?

 

[General Lee]

Reading the new UAL T/A, do I understand correctly that they intend to staple every furloughed UAL guy below all the CAL guys, Date of Hire be damned?

Also, is there a longevity pay protection for the UAL guys for the time they spent on the street?

That is true with mergers and arbitration. If you are not currently on the property, you are hosed. If you are hired after a merger announcement, you are also stapled. Any new hires at UAL/CAL coming up here will be placed behind the returning furloughees as well. How many are still out? And to top it off, it looks like they won't get longevity pay or credit for time out on furlough, which the FNWA guys did get. That can make a huge difference in pay.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[HA25]

then I have a friend who is going to be highly pissed! wow that sucks.

 

[General Lee]

then I have a friend who is going to be highly pissed! wow that sucks.

Well, there may be some leeway there if one guy came back who was junior to another who did not. Regardless, being out on furlough does not help their cause. I don't think DOH will matter, it hasn't in recent arbitration. Some of that remains to be seen because it hasn't really happened yet (mergers lately with furloughees still out), but guys on property will most likely do better.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[eaglesview]

The SLI (not related to the T/A) has not even begun. Any input here is pure speculation.

 

[jenks]

I'm not going to try to explain it, but this is not correct. The contract has nothing to do with SLI. It is likely that both UAL/CAL furloughed pilots will be stapled to the bottom of active pilots, but it has not been decided on how the furloughed pilots will be put together on one list. I doubt it will be DOH.

 

[densoo]

Reading the new UAL T/A, do I understand correctly that they intend to staple every furloughed UAL guy below all the CAL guys, Date of Hire be damned?

The integrated seniority list has not been arbitrated yet. That being said the Transition Process Agreement states, "5-B (i) b. Pilots on furlough status at the time the Integrated Seniority List is implemented may not bump or displace pilots in active status at that time..."

Without a contract the TPA expires in the spring.

Also aribrators can do whatever they want.

 

[densoo]

Dear United Furloughees,

There have been some emotions expressed over longevity for furloughees in the JCBA. Please allow me to explicate on how the negotiations proceeded.

There were two intents of many with respect to the JCBA – to create secure jobs for furloughees and to have a contract worth returning to and working under. These two intents were accomplished. Additionally, we achieved certain protections that will make it more difficult and more expensive for the company to furlough in the future such as removing seats from Express operations and lowering the construction caps in scheduling, among other things.

It should be obvious by now that the prospects of being recalled at legacy United were dim and getting dimmer. We are not receiving any new aircraft in the near future, there are indications the 757-200s will begin leaving the property in 2013, there was a very large system bid at CAL, and certain protections of the Transition and Process Agreement including block hour ratios are set to expire in March 2013. This would leave as our only protection minimum block hours for the airline as specified in 1-F-1 of the current CBA, and no restrictions on growth at CAL. We already have furloughees who have surpassed the ten year mark and are dropping off the recall list. The only available openings are at CAL, and they are prepared to hire new-hires off the street. These new hires would prevent any open vacancies that would prompt further recalls.

Full longevity for time on furlough was a high priority for us. The United Negotiating Committee fought hard for it, and it was one of the final remaining items as we concluded our AIP on August 2, but there was obvious resistance to it. We were able to secure some pay longevity for some of our furloughees, particularly those at the bottom of the list who need it the most.

In the final hours this weekend of negotiating final language, we were able to secure that longevity for our furloughees immediately upon date of signing, specifically that our furloughees at CAL would be paid at no less than the longevity provided by adjusting their longevity start date to 5/7/08 (or adjusting by the time spent on furlough, if less) at the new JCBA rates, not at the old CAL rates. The intent now is to get the furloughees who have bypassed at CAL to raise their hands and volunteer for openings before they are filled by new-hires off the street.

This provision will not affect the SLI process. If a furloughee’s seniority improves he will gain more longevity. And at no time will a furloughee’s subsequent pay longevity be reduced.

We share your disappointment in not achieving full longevity for time spent on furlough, though we did achieve some of it for some. But most importantly, we have a JCBA that will bring every furloughee back on property in the shortest amount of time with a contract that will bring prosperity and security back into his family. Ten years of longevity would have no value if there was no job to exercise it. As an aside, it took a subsequent contract to get longevity back for previous groups of pilots at United.

This explanation is not meant to be an excuse and may not alleviate some of the emotion out there, but it does tell you how our priorities began to shift as time marched on without a JCBA. Not every pilot got everything he wanted in this contract.

Attached is a document prepared to answer most of your questions on the provisions regarding furlough longevity.

I will see you on the line again soon.

Fraternally, Jay

 

[densoo]

"....there are 383 L-UAL furloughed pilots flying for L-CAL and they will be considered as part of the L-CAL distribution as they are currently L-CAL pilots. Their number will be based on the number of months they have worked here and the amount of money they have earned in that time."

 

[Ky.BrownBourbn]

Look who responded to the first response, SHE knows nothing about UAL/CAL, and nobody gives a crap about how it was done elsewhere...Everyone of these things has been done differently, as will all those that happen in the future.

SHE has no idea about anything it posts about! She's like Kit Darby, she will get one thing right ten years late and say "I told you so"

KBB

 

[General Lee]

Look who responded to the first response, SHE knows nothing about UAL/CAL, and nobody gives a crap about how it was done elsewhere...Everyone of these things has been done differently, as will all those that happen in the future.

SHE has no idea about anything it posts about! She's like Kit Darby, she will get one thing right ten years late and say "I told you so"

KBB

Hah! This from someone who liked giving his AT brothers the shaft! Had you not had your management stick their noses in and intervened with Herb maybe(?), you WOULD have gone to arbitration, and it would have looked the same as the recent arbitrated lists. But NOOOOO! You strong armed them, and they will remember that forever. You really have ZERO clue what YOU did. Almost as bad as the USAir East guys. Your "Daddy" stuck up for you. And the great thing is, you have NO response. An arbitrator would have been a neutral and decided the list on what was fair, that is their job. You didn't want fair, you feared it.



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Jetjockey]

You can run from the General, but you can't hide. He's everywhere on these boards. Would you expect any less from someone with 16,500+ posts? If he spent 10 minutes reading, and writing responses to each post that's like 114 straight days of being here of FI. WOW.

 

[General Lee]

You can run from the General, but you can't hide. He's everywhere on these boards. Would you expect any less from someone with 16,500+ posts? If he spent 10 minutes reading, and writing responses to each post that's like 114 straight days of being here of FI. WOW.

Thanks OBAMA! You Attack, attack, and have no substance to back it up. You can always put me on ignore, and I really don't care. BYE!



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Jetjockey]

Thanks OBAMA! You Attack, attack, and have no substance to back it up. You can always put me on ignore, and I really don't care. BYE!



Bye Bye---General Lee

Ignore you ???? I wouldn't dream of it Mitt. I find you very entertaining.

 

[jonjuan]

You can run from the General, but you can't hide. He's everywhere on these boards. Would you expect any less from someone with 16,500+ posts? If he spent 10 minutes reading, and writing responses to each post that's like 114 straight days of being here of FI. WOW.

Isn't she amazing? She has no idea that most consider her the biggest dou.che here.

 

[General Lee]

Isn't she amazing? She has no idea that most consider her the biggest dou.che here.

That's funny, your cellmate in prison says he is jealous that you are cyber stalking me. Quit it!


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Jetjockey]

That's funny, your cellmate in prison says he is jealous that you are cyber stalking me. Quit it!


Bye Bye---General Lee

Did you talk to his cellmate on a conjugal visit???

 

[General Lee]

Did you talk to his cellmate on a conjugal visit???

No, I was on a double date with your Mom and sister.



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Jetjockey]

No, I was on a double date with your Mom and sister.



Bye Bye---General Lee

Well, gosh.....that was a good one genital....Bazinga!!! He's here all week folks.

 

[Flyer1015]

Wait so is the General really a woman?