Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

U.S. "blocks" DAL Pilot deal!

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web

spinproof

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 19, 2002
Posts
774
U.S. moves to block Delta pilot deal
Agency files suit, calls plan to possibly saddle the government with billions in pensions an 'abuse of the program.'
May 26, 2006: 9:50 AM EDT

NEW YORK (Reuters) - A U.S. federal pensions insurer has filed a court objection to a Delta Air Lines pensions deal with its pilots union, calling it an abuse that could cost the government billions of dollars.

The government's Pension Benefit Guaranty Corp. (PBGC) criticized bankrupt Delta Air Lines Inc.'s plan to compensate pilots for unfunded benefits by giving them $650 million in notes should their retirement plan be terminated.

It said the agreement with the Air Line Pilots Association "appears to pose a substantial abuse of the federal pension plan termination insurance program."
If the retirement plan terminates, "the federal pension insurance program will sustain a multi-billion dollar loss as a consequence," the PBGC said.

The pension insurer made its filing Wednesday in U.S. Bankruptcy Court in the Southern District of New York, which is overseeing Delta's bankruptcy reorganization.

Delta pilots criticized the agency for the filling.
"A government organization established to protect workers should now be supporting, rather than actively opposing, a fairly negotiated consensual agreement that helps ensure a future for Delta and jobs for 50,000 Delta employees," the pilot's union said in a statement. "It is in everybody's best interest - the airlines, our employees, the traveling public and ultimately the taxpayer that this deal be approved to allow Delta to successfully reorganize and exit bankruptcy."

Atlanta-based Delta (Research), which filed for bankruptcy protection from creditors in September, reached an agreement last month with its pilots union for concessions worth $280 million, as part of its plan to raise $3 billion in annual cost savings and revenue increases.
PBGC's objection to Delta's deal with the union comes after retired pilots at the airline also opposed the agreement.

The agreement "sets the stage for drastically reducing certain vested pension benefits of approximately 5,800 retired pilots," Delta's retired pilots said in a separate filing Tuesday.

But Delta's pilots again stood by the deal, calling it "vital to the successful restructuring of Delta and the long-term health of the airline" in a statement.
Delta is seeking the court's approval for its deal with the pilots, which was reached after months of negotiations, and is yet to be ratified by union members.
________________
 
Last edited:
I thought the PBGC was set up to protect workers. Lets get a Dem in the White House before this job is no longer worth having.....
 
Now why did the majority of pilots on this forum vote for Bush?

Because the Democrats didn't field an electable candidate.

If they had come up with someone who was even marginally electable, like Gephardt or Lieberman, they would have won . . . . which tells you something about the state of the Democratic Party . . . . it's being run by the fringes, not the center.
 
Green said:
I thought the PBGC was set up to protect workers. Lets get a Dem in the White House before this job is no longer worth having.....

Yea man! Lets put the party of appeasement in there. That way, when Osama strikes again we'll at least have our pensions when the industry crumbles.
 
Ty Webb said:
Because the Democrats didn't field an electable candidate.

If they had come up with someone who was even marginally electable, like Gephardt or Lieberman, they would have won . . . . which tells you something about the state of the Democratic Party . . . . it's being run by the fringes, not the center.

Ty nailed it.

Hillary is trying to mold herself towards the center but in my opinion unelectable and undesirable and she's the Republican party's wet dream for a candidate.

They really need to grab their party back from the loony left and give the American public an "electable" candidate for 2008.
 
Green said:
I thought the PBGC was set up to protect workers. Lets get a Dem in the White House before this job is no longer worth having.....

Yes by all means. Under the last Dem there was a mass exodus of jobs to China, et.al. neither party appeared to lift a finger to stop it. I speculate some of those people who eventually lost their jobs as a result were at one time a full fare paying PAX.
 
Ty Webb said:
Because the Democrats didn't field an electable candidate.

If they had come up with someone who was even marginally electable, like Gephardt or Lieberman, they would have won . . . . which tells you something about the state of the Democratic Party . . . . it's being run by the fringes, not the center.

I think Biden might be their best chance.

As for Hillary, forget it. Everybody on the right hates her, and the left will reject her for her hawkish stance on Iraq and now on Iran. She has ZERO chance to get back into the White House.
 
Kid Charlemagne said:
I think Biden might be their best chance.

No way. Biden comes across as an angry, ego-centric hothead. Remember his droning on and on during the Senate confirmation hearings? This guy would turn into a PR nightmare for the DNC in a national election.
 
Kid Charlemagne said:
As for Hillary, forget it. Everybody on the right hates her, and the left will reject her for her hawkish stance on Iraq and now on Iran. She has ZERO chance to get back into the White House.
Careful there buddy,,,

I was flying Lazio around on his Senate campaign against Hillary... they were saying the exact same thing.

Last second she rallied the minority vote like no one in this country has ever seen.

If the Dems actually put her on the ballot, it's going to be a LOT closer than you think. :(

Incidentally, everyone I think is losing sight of the big picture here. It's too late to change the leadership of the PBGC (which I don't believe is government-appointed anyway, could be wrong but I don't think so). If the PBGC is successful in getting the bankruptcy judge to deny the proposed agreement, DAL will be in a BAD position... bad juju for everyone.
 
It's not the governments fault that Delta can't and won't pay their bills. It's Delta's fault they are in the shape they are in. The taxpayers of this country should not have to bail them out. It's not the governments fault that New Orleans is below sea level. It's a sewer drain. If the people of New Orleans want to rebuild, then do it. Do not count on my tax money to do it for you. Hillary is a joke and would get her rear end handed to her along with every other liberal out there. The Democratic party is a joke and they have no answers. The best they can put forward is that idiot spokesman Howard Dean. What a peon. I am sure Osama and every other muslim terroist out there would love to see a liberal elected.
 
Last edited:
Delta Is Toast!!!!

This should put the final nail in the coffin of this pitiful excuse for a airline.
Management will yank the contract, pilots will strike, and then the company will liquidate.

FINALLY - THIS PIG WILL DIE!!
 
That Bill in the House looks as if it will pass. Then Delta would be able to amortize the short fall over 20 yrs. This might be worth waiting to see if the Bill gets through. You guys should stall this out. If you retire at 60 your PBGC annual payment will be $29,300 give or take a couple hundred. If the FAA pushes the retirement at 65, like Europe now has, it would be roughly $40,000. Either way, nothing remotely to what the grand "A" fund used to be. If this can be spread over 20 yrs at least you'll get much more than the PBGC will give ya, hell, freezing the fund would be better.
 
Lame Lizard said:
It's not the governments fault that New Orleans is below sea level. It's a sewer drain. If the people of New Orleans want to rebuild, then do it. Do not count on my tax money to do it for you.

A sewer drain huh? Lots of good things have come from this "sewer" as you call it.

Hopefully if your area gets hit with a tornado/earthquake/fire/super T-storm, my tax dollars go to rebuild your area.

Do not make assumptions on things you do not know about!

Lame Lizard, Lame says it all!

BigEasy
 
As a taxpayer, I am glad to see the PBGC throwing the BS flag on this deal.
In some countries they would throw the company management in jail for bleeding the company dry while lining their own pockets and failing to fund pension obligations.

In my opinion, in any bankruptcy, the first "creditor" to be paid should be anyone who is owed a pension. The last people to receive a dime should be the inept managers that got the company into bankruptcy in the first place.
 
180ToTheMarker said:
Yea man! Lets put the party of appeasement in there. That way, when Osama strikes again we'll at least have our pensions when the industry crumbles.

That's just stupid; to think that anyone from any other party would not defend our Country. "shut the heck up."
 
SkiFishFly said:
In my opinion, in any bankruptcy, the first "creditor" to be paid should be anyone who is owed a pension. The last people to receive a dime should be the inept managers that got the company into bankruptcy in the first place.

SkyFishFly for President!
 
Ty Webb said:
Because the Democrats didn't field an electable candidate.

If they had come up with someone who was even marginally electable, like Gephardt or Lieberman, they would have won . . . . which tells you something about the state of the Democratic Party . . . . it's being run by the fringes, not the center.

Gephardt is a fargin socialist, you czech idiot. Go back to eastern europe, it's still full of arseholes like Gep who think anyone who's successful has simply "won life's lottery" and it has nothing to do with hard work.
 
Gridlock

What the Red state blue state folks don't seem to get is it isn't about. Left or right it, it should be about gridlock.

See when ever one group gets the ENTIRE run of the store there is never any compromise. You let the "conservatives (that's pretty debatable)" run the shop and this is what you get. You let the "liberals" have it and you get the same, but the fact of the matter is we need both.

We need Conservatives to make sure we balance the budget and keep or economy growing. Tight controls. We also need a party that is concerned with labor and the middle class, art/culutre, and inclusion.

Balance folks and not the Fox News kind!
 
SkiFishFly said:
As a taxpayer, I am glad to see the PBGC throwing the BS flag on this deal.
In some countries they would throw the company management in jail for bleeding the company dry while lining their own pockets and failing to fund pension obligations.

In my opinion, in any bankruptcy, the first "creditor" to be paid should be anyone who is owed a pension. The last people to receive a dime should be the inept managers that got the company into bankruptcy in the first place.

Ditto.

I believe the issue here is that the pilots have negotiated away their pension for a 600 million note secured by Delta. This is not a default of the pension by the company. Therefore the PBGC has no real obligation to pick up the "failed" pension from Delta. In this scenario the pilots have mistakenly accepted a debt obligation that has very weak credit behind it.

The airlines have succeeded in skirting their pension liabilities during the Chapter 11 process in a calculated fashion. They have manipulated the seniority based employees into a corner culminating in the wiping out of all the sharholder's equity, drastic reductions in employee pay and benefits and finally violating every piece of legislation that has been passed to protect corporate pension funds.

Don't forget, if the PBGC goes into default then all recipients of payouts will undertake another cut in benefits to keep that entity afloat.
 
skystud25 said:
Gephardt is a fargin socialist, you czech idiot. Go back to eastern europe, it's still full of arseholes like Gep who think anyone who's successful has simply "won life's lottery" and it has nothing to do with hard work.


Maybe you need to pull your head out of your @ss so you can see what you're reading . . .

I didn't say that I agreed with ANY of those candidates, or not. What I said was that the Democrats failed to field a viable candidate.

I guess that was a little too deep and profound for your obviously puny little mind, or maybe you ought to stick to posting when you're sober.
 
BigEasy said:
A sewer drain huh? Lots of good things have come from this "sewer" as you call it.

Hopefully if your area gets hit with a tornado/earthquake/fire/super T-storm, my tax dollars go to rebuild your area.

Do not make assumptions on things you do not know about!

Lame Lizard, Lame says it all!

BigEasy

Lame Lizard is: Chuck Yogurt/Lawman/Einstein/Texas Jet Jock/Sky Fly/Boris Yelling.....
Please don't feed the trolls! Ignore this moron!
Besides his "area" is a trailer park somewhere in the hills of Wisconsin!
737
 
The DALPA has become the ultimate WHORE in the history of unions. Any Delta pilot that goes along with this POS TA and supports the union will surely get what he or she deserves.
 
Another MISLEADING TITLE - BIG SURPRISE....

Read the story again. The PBGC settled with United after requesting the SAME thing and they received $1.5 billion worth of new equity from UAL - A SIMILAR DEAL. ALPA and DAL knew that the PBGC would probably object - this was expected according to my Delta friends.

If you were a creditor, like the PBGC, wouldn't you object to the handing out of money to a union - it was expected - get it? And in a separate motion, the retired DAL pilots also want money but they knew what they were doing as they left and took half in a lump sum...

The title to this thread is misleading AGAIN. Perhaps the guy who posted it should focus on the facts - where does it say that the Government has already nixed the deal? WRONG AGAIN - it says "moves to" vs. it already nixed the deal.
 
Last edited:
Buckaroo said:
This should put the final nail in the coffin of this pitiful excuse for a airline.
Management will yank the contract, pilots will strike, and then the company will liquidate.

FINALLY - THIS PIG WILL DIE!!

This guy is a complete jealous idiot... Let me guess, couldn't get a Delta interview back in the day? Or you were rejected and now you are giddy like a school girl at the possible DAL demise. Classy. It won't happen. This is a classic ploy to get a piece of equity (similar to UAL deal). You're a piece of work - and I am sure a joy to fly with...
 
737 Pylt said:
Lame Lizard is: Chuck Yogurt/Lawman/Einstein/Texas Jet Jock/Sky Fly/Boris Yelling.....
Please don't feed the trolls! Ignore this moron!
Besides his "area" is a trailer park somewhere in the hills of Wisconsin!
737



Quit assuming that I am someone that I am not you moron. Get a life you freak on nature.
 
Goodbye Delta! I really do hope everybody lands on their feet. Good Luck.
 
Lame Lizard said:
Quit assuming that I am someone that I am not you moron. Get a life you freak on nature.
.


Hmmmm. . . . . start date 2 months ago, loves to call people morons, can't spell . . . . . . survey says . . . . . Chuck/Einstein/Lawman/Jockrot etc.

You did get one thing right this time, though, Chuckie, you are lame.
 

Latest resources

Back
Top Bottom