True Whores

[SUNDOWN]

Most of them are in favor of this rule change so there will be no standing up by them anyway.

Where did you come up with this data?

 

[pilotyip]

Not about rest

If they went with the traditional heavy crew, a third pilot in the cockpit to jump into the seats it would be legal. However, it would have nothing to do with rest. There is no rest in the cockpit jump seat. In fact, the pilot's seat may be more restful. Wasn't there something that if there was a 3rd crewmember, i.e. FE or navigator in the cockpit, you could go 10 hours in the pilot's seat. In addition, this was early steam dial days. A two-legger 10-hour day in a bus is a lot less tiring than an 8 hour, 6-leg day in Be-31. So do not go with the rest argument.

 

[sleepy]

I don't see the big deal here. Our Part 91 flight department can go up to 12 hours of flying in a 14 hour duty day on international flights. It is pretty easy flying.

 

[Rob M.]

The problem is some dirt bag company will fly you 10hr/14legs if the rule is changed or they can get a waver.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

I think what ALPA is going for here is simply stopping this before it does become status quo. If jetblue pilots can safely fly 10 hours over two legs, maybe it'll be ok for a Brasilia pilot to fly 10 hours (10 or 12 legs) some day. It has to stop somewhere.

Sounds like the Metro days at SKYW

 

[GogglesPisano]

My 2 cents

FWIW: I think a bigger battle is increasing our rest periods. If it's a quid pro quo, I'll take up to 9 hours of flying, provided the FAA throws the "reduced rest" BS in the can.

12 hours of rest minimum, no exceptions ever.

 

[General Lee]

I don't see the big deal here. Our Part 91 flight department can go up to 12 hours of flying in a 14 hour duty day on international flights. It is pretty easy flying.

Did you also marry your sister? What other "rules" would you like to break Sleepy? How about the 30 in 7 rule? How about the 1000 in 1 year rule? Let's just make it unlimited in everything. The jetblue guys can change or set anything. They already set the new 100 seat pay rate.(and subsequent 50 and 70 rates....)


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[murfdawg998]

I don't see the big deal here. Our Part 91 flight department can go up to 12 hours of flying in a 14 hour duty day on international flights. It is pretty easy flying.

you can say that again!!! East Coast-West Coast and back or vice versa is a piece of cake. What's so bad about these guys wanting to be more efficient for their company??

 

[General Lee]

you can say that again!!! East Coast-West Coast and back or vice versa is a piece of cake. What's so bad about these guys wanting to be more efficient for their company??

Murf,

Thank gawd you and Sleepy are "Chuck Yeagers."


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[jetexas]

The problem is some dirt bag company will fly you 10hr/14legs if the rule is changed or they can get a waver.

Good point. What might be an occasional pain for Jetblue crews will become status quo, daily ops for regional crews, etc. if this rule is changed. Sadly, The FAA will most likely bend to the whims of companies on this, kind of how they've not changed archaic rest rules over the years to accomodate the ATA.

 

[cforst513]

Actually considered it. For 1 to 4 units, you need a minimum net worth of $200,000; and $250,000 per restaurant in liquid assets or available financing.

Where was I gonna find 200 grand ?

Wait a minute. I thought you were a pilot!!? You mean you don't make $200,000/year?

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Dizel, Im sorry but your avatar has been bothering me and now I have to say it

Is that a transvestite? I mean look at her..Thats not a woman thats a MAN BABY!!

Yeah big tits (fake) but her face YUCK looks like a dog

Surely you can find someone a lot hotter than that

Actually, since Dizel has downsized the pic it distorts the image. The other pics that go with this one that make up the gallery defintely indicate all woman.

 

[Dizel8]

Most definitely

 

[ShyFlyGuy]

ouch!
(from ky)

dated my cousin once...
actually.. dated her for six months..

(cousin by marriage)

Timeless!

Shy

 

[N2264J]

Give me a break. If you move to Kentucky can you marry your sister? It is the status quo there.

Gee - Comair is based in Kentucky...Oh, I get it. You're dissing Comair pilots again!

I guess your constant reminders that Comair pilots have no chance of ever being hired at Delta wasn't getting the groveling, suck-up responses you wanted so you decide to slander everyone in the state of Kentucky.

Somehow, noone seems to understand the influence Delta pilots have over management in the hiring process considering all the influence over management they've demonstrated in their recent consessionary bargaining.

Slamming jetBlue and Comair pilots in the same sentence though - that was clever.

 

[sleepy]

Did you also marry your sister? What other "rules" would you like to break Sleepy? How about the 30 in 7 rule? How about the 1000 in 1 year rule? Let's just make it unlimited in everything. The jetblue guys can change or set anything. They already set the new 100 seat pay rate.(and subsequent 50 and 70 rates....)


Bye Bye--General Lee

Well General, I don't have a sister. I don't want to break any rules. I have not broken any rules. Should the rules be updated every now and again? I say yes. The exemption is for JB only, right? I like the fact that they are trying to be more competative, to lower cost, and to increase quality. That saves my company $$$$. Everything that affects our bottom line increases the value of our shares, which makes my stock options worth more. I you DAL pilots don't want to do it, then don't compete with them. Keep your work rules and be happy.

We are Part 91, so we make our own rules, and follow them. I just don't have a problem with a crew of 2 pilots flying a 12 hour leg in a 14 hour duty day in international long-haul operations. It is easy flying, you know that don't you?

It is much easier than doing 5, 1 hour legs in an E-120 in a 14 hour duty day, but I guess you wouldn't know anything about that General Lee?

 

[HughBeamont]

I think what ALPA is going for here is simply stopping this before it does become status quo. If jetblue pilots can safely fly 10 hours over two legs, maybe it'll be ok for a Brasilia pilot to fly 10 hours (10 or 12 legs) some day. It has to stop somewhere.

Right now I do 8 legs, 6.5 hours of flying on a typical day in the 1900.

8 legs / 6.5 hours = x legs / 10 hours

x = 12.3 legs / day

Let's just cut to the chase and make things easy. Everyone does transcons non-stop, 24 hours a day for 4 days on crank, then spends their 3 days off sleeping.

 

[sleepy]

Right now I do 8 legs, 6.5 hours of flying on a typical day in the 1900.

8 legs / 6.5 hours = x legs / 10 hours

x = 12.3 legs / day

Let's just cut to the chase and make things easy. Everyone does transcons non-stop, 24 hours a day for 4 days on crank, then spends their 3 days off sleeping.

Go look at the duty time limits for Part 121 non-scheduled. What you wrote about describes it. It's not much fun, but crews are doing it every day.

 

[filejw]

Having done 7 yrs on the Dc9 and 6 on glass A/C I can tell you Rockwell is right.The big trouble is that ALPA wants the status quo and the FAA is just too paralyzed to move.The FAR's are what... 60 yrs old.The new rules if they are ever drawn up should consider type of A/C number of legs and the duty day.The duty day should be rolled back to a max of 14 hrs.Sitting around for 4 to six hrs in the duty day should be a penalty too.Its just as bad as flying as far as fatigue. I'm a long time ALPA member but we need a better way to do the work.Alpa should be taking the lead on this not yelling at Jet Blue.But seeing how they handled the RJ's over the yrs ????????

 

[mdanno808]

The problem with work rules is that changing one is opening pandora's box. What makes you think that the FAA will change a rule only for jet blue? FAR's are there for safety. If the FAA finds it safe for jet blue to fly longer hours, then they will eventually (granted Jet Blue doesn't have an incident which is attributed to the longer flight day) determine that it is safe for the rest of us to ditch the IRO and fly a two man crew for an extended ammount of time. I agree with many of the counter arguments that have been posted earlier. I have flown Metroliners for ridiculous ammounts of time, as well as Chieftains, 402's, etc. In fact, I am now flying a 757 for a supplemental carrier that will tack on a tail end ferry once your barely legal work day is complete. I know that scheduled 121 carriers have it a lot easier than the 135/non-sched 121 carrier's do. This is no reason to change the regulations which currently govern flight time limit's and rest. There are many reg's which are outdated, and ridiculous, but flight time limit's aren't where the ammendments should begin. By the way, before we all start bitching about how bad we all have it flying 135/91, etc. we should talk to some of the guys who flew for places like Zantop, Flemming, and some of the real crappy outfits of the past. Our industry, and the rules we must follow as airmen have come a long way, and it would be a shame to allow a backslide.

A sidenote: In this day and age of price slashing, don't think that your carrier won't be next to ask for this exemption should Jet Blue's request be granted.