Transponder check out of date, how do you fly to the location?

[Rally]

I have a aircraft with a transponder check and IFR check out of date (I know I don't need the IFR for VFR) I am based under a Mode C veil. (not in B) Basically all the shops I've called say to do the transponder check that (now) they need to have the entire aircraft. I remember a time when they would the the transponder as a unit itself. How do I do this properly? Ferry Permit? ATC waiver?

Thanks

 

[USMCmech]

Ferry Permit?

There's your answer.

Ask the transponder shop to help you fill one out and you're all set. It'll take you about 10 minute, and you probably won't need an A&P to buy it off in this case.

The FSDO will useually aprove one in this case without any fuss. The aircraft is not leagaly airworthy due to misssing a required inspection. However there is nothing physically wrong and it is SAFE to fly to the repair facility.


Giving ATC a heads up when you do the flight would be a good idea too.

 

[satpak77]

well, I know what I would do if it was good WX and the transponder was still putting out a correct signal, if out of date on paper....

 

[Rally]

According to Part 91 can't I just call the ATC facitlity and ask for a waiver with times to move the aircraft? I think I can. ooooh brainstorm. God forbid we do that on FI. Boooya

Correct me if I am wrong.

(2) For operation of an aircraft with an inoperative transponder to the airport of ultimate destination, including any intermediate stops, or to proceed to a place where suitable repairs can be made or both, the request may be made at any time.

 

[USMCmech]

According to Part 91 can't I just call the ATC facitlity and ask for a waiver with times to move the aircraft? I think I can. ooooh brainstorm. God forbid we do that on FI. Boooya

Correct me if I am wrong.

You're worng. How's that? JK

Once any inspection goes out of date, the ENTIRE aircraft becomes unairworty in the eyes of the FAA.

Again go to faa.gov, download a ferry permit, fill it out, fax it to the FSDO, they will aprove it, make the flight under the conditions of the permit. It's quite painless. In this case it's doubtfull you will even need an A&P to sign it.

As opposed to taking off, and getting ramp checked when you land at the other airport. Or even just worrying about that happening.

2) For operation of an aircraft with an inoperative transponder to the airport of ultimate destination, including any intermediate stops, or to proceed to a place where suitable repairs can be made or both, the request may be made at any time.

If the transponder itself was only broken, you would be fine with just calling the TRACON. But this is not the case, it is perfectly fine, only out of date therefore causieng the whole aircraft to become unairworty.

Stupid logic, I know, but that's the FAA. They care about paperwork, not safety.

 

[bocefus]

Huh? So if your 30 day VOR inspection is out, you need a ferry permit to check it? BS. Simply ask for the waiver and fly to the shop

 

[USMCmech]

Huh? So if your 30 day VOR inspection is out, you need a ferry permit to check it? BS. Simply ask for the waiver and fly to the shop

30 day VOR check is required for IFR ops only. You can do a dual VOR check on the ground in most cases anyway.

Transponder and pitot static checks are for VFR and IFR.


I agree the whole thing is stupid, but risking a violation because I didn't take 10 minutes to fill out a form seams foolish to me.

 

[bocefus]

Transponder checks are not required if you are operating in airspace that does not require a transponder, simply turn it off, ask for and receive the waiver. A ferry permit is one way to do it, but simply not required, it is doubtful that the Avionics shop would be able to issue you one anyway as it requires an A&P, which most repair stations would not have.

 

[USMCmech]

, it is doubtful that the Avionics shop would be able to issue you one anyway as it requires an A&P,

The shop dosen't issue a ferry permit, the FSDO does.

Ferry permits do not always require an A&P signature. Especially in this case of simply being out of an inspection cycle.

http://forms.faa.gov/forms/faa8130-6d.pdf

Fill out sections II and VII, Fax it to the FSDO, and they will aprove it.

 

[bocefus]

Suit yourself, the FSDO folks will be laughing their arses off.

 

[Rally]

You're worng. How's that? JK

Once any inspection goes out of date, the ENTIRE aircraft becomes unairworty in the eyes of the FAA.

Again go to faa.gov, download a ferry permit, fill it out, fax it to the FSDO, they will aprove it, make the flight under the conditions of the permit. It's quite painless. In this case it's doubtfull you will even need an A&P to sign it.

As opposed to taking off, and getting ramp checked when you land at the other airport. Or even just worrying about that happening.



If the transponder itself was only broken, you would be fine with just calling the TRACON. But this is not the case, it is perfectly fine, only out of date therefore causieng the whole aircraft to become unairworty.

Stupid logic, I know, but that's the FAA. They care about paperwork, not safety.

You know what? For some reason the transponder won't turn on and the light won't work (jk) so its inoperative. Boooya Calling the ATC facility and getting a waiver. The airport is 7 miles away.

 

[satpak77]

You know what? For some reason the transponder won't turn on and the light won't work (jk) so its inoperative. Boooya Calling the ATC facility and getting a waiver. The airport is 7 miles away.

NEGATIVE GHOSTRIDER, USMCMech will not allow that. Full compliance with all regs is mandatory and we will not have showboating here. The rules are not flexible, nor am I.

Do you understanding that Mav?

 

[TrafficInSight]

Pitot static is for IFR only, and every time I've sent a transponder out it comes back with a fresh transponder inspection... I don't see their reasoning for needing the whole plane.

 

[erj-145mech]

They need the whole aircraft for the mode C portion of the test. They need to run the reporting up to check for accuracy within parameters. They also need to check the output power at the antenna to see that is is within specs also.

 

[bocefus]

Pitot static is for IFR only, and every time I've sent a transponder out it comes back with a fresh transponder inspection... I don't see their reasoning for needing the whole plane.

You may have gotten the transponder back with a "fresh inspection", but you didn't get one back with a 91.413 sign off, you know, the one required every two years. ERJ is correct, the requirement is to check the entire system, ene to end.

 

[USMCmech]

You know what? For some reason the transponder won't turn on and the light won't work (jk) so its inoperative. Boooya Calling the ATC facility and getting a waiver. The airport is 7 miles away.

I did some reserch and I was incorrect, the airplane can be flown. The only requirement is that the transponder must be OFF untill it is inspected.

 

[Rally]

I did some reserch and I was incorrect, the airplane can be flown. The only requirement is that the transponder must be OFF untill it is inspected.

With a waiver and calling the ATC facility. Right? (I am under a mode C veil, not within B, B @ 3000.) This is so stupid being that a cub can fly around all day long w/o a transponder. But regulations are regulations, I guess this is the reason for flight info---exchanging arguing, butting heads, throwing beer bottles about ideas on aviation.

 

[TrafficInSight]

You may have gotten the transponder back with a "fresh inspection", but you didn't get one back with a 91.413 sign off, you know, the one required every two years. ERJ is correct, the requirement is to check the entire system, ene to end.

I'll have to go look at the card again, maybe it's only good for part of the 91.413 inspection, but it specifically mentions it.

Also, Part 43 Appendix F (c)(1)(ii) seems to suggest that the tests can be done without the transponder in the airplane... I'm not an avionics expert by any stretch of the imagination though.

Anyway, we have a guy that comes out to our airport and does the checks, perhaps there is someone in the area that does that.

 

[bocefus]

(b) Following any installation or maintenance on an ATC transponder where data correspondence error could be introduced, the integrated system has been tested, inspected, and found to comply with paragraph (c), appendix E, of part 43 of this chapter.


Erm, you installed it after you got it back from the shop right? When did you get the integrated system tested?

 

[TrafficInSight]

got it.