training contracts?

[supsup]

About 2 1/2 months ago i took a temp job flying a caravan. I was told that i would fly through the end of august. About a week ago i got a job flying a metroliner. For the sake of my career and some much needed health insurance i took the metro job. I took this job knowing that i was breaking my contract and that i would have to repay some money. I was just wondering if any of you have had similar experiences? How binding is this contract? Is there any chance of paying off my training cost in payments? Your thoughts and experiences.

supsup

 

[js31pilot]

By the time they take you to court and get a judgement against you it will cost MUCH more than the initial training......do NOT sweat it....they won't go after you.

On the legal side.....any lawyers help me out on this one, but if you sign a training contract it is considered under duress and not legal. Why?.....cuz if you did NOT sign it then you would not of gotten hired. As a condition of emplyment with a company they can't require you to sign a contract. As an upgrade....that is another ball of wax.

My advice.....check with an aviation lawyer in your state and he/she can guide you.......good luck and congrats on getting a job with benefits------sad we have to even SAY that.....

 

[Smoking Man]

Training Contracts

Regardless of any financial or legal impacts on you, IF one day maybe the world changes again and you are fortunate enough to land an interview at your dream job, and you are filling out all of the paper work that will include all former employers how will you explain the fact that you did not live up to your end of a training contract? Do you want to take that chance? Possible employer (dream job) pending background check, calls the caravan operator to ask the standard questions about you as an employee. How do you think they will respond if you just give them the bird (and disregard the contract), or if you offered to find a way to settle the contract, I have a feeling that they will work with you.

Just something to kick around.

Smoking Man

 

[Dirk Diggler]

supsup

Sup,
As for training contracts, I am no expert. I have heard that they are not worth the paper they are written on. I have known alot of people to leave a job with a contract and not hear a single thing. My thoughts on any company with a training contract is that they must not be that great of a place. Why would a company need to hold you hostage to a piece of paper unless they really arent that desirable to work for. I see you also had a post addressing Berry Aviation, but I wont get into that. Thats a whole other can of worms for another day. Good Luck.

 

[A Squared]

>>>>>>but if you sign a training contract it is considered under duress and not legal. Why?.....cuz if you did NOT sign it then you would not of gotten hired.

I'm not completely sure what constitutes duress, but I'm pretty sure that this is *not* duress. If so, that could be said about any contract, a lease for example: you could use the same rationale that you aren't obligated to honor a lease contract because if you didn't sign the lease then you wouldn't get the apartment, therefore it is duress. I think that you will find that a little more is needed to make a case for duress.

Maybe you should sit down with your employer and try to come to a mutually agreeable deal. Beter to try to work things out that bail without a word and leave an unhappy former employer.


regards

 

[English]

Be careful...depending on the state, employers CAN and WILL persue legitimate legal action against you...

 

[js31pilot]

I guess the current consensus is


TALK TO A LAWYER


(I have experienced workplaces that have training contracts and employees have gone in good faith to that employer to resolve the sit. They find out you are trying to get a different job and cut you loose immediately and bad mouth you for not being loyal....even though they KNOW their benefits suck)

Good Luck Man

 

[de727ups]

my story

I was once in a similar situation. I left early and the employer gave me a bad recommendation which later cost me a better job. At the same time, I say screw em....you need to do what's best for you at the moment. If you are worried about the recommendation, I'd say be honest with your ex and offer to pay them some small amount each month to work towards fullfilling your contract. That shows a good faith effort on your part at making good the contract while not costing you much dough.

 

[Skaz]

supsup, I've been in a similar situation, was flying 206's in the bush and got wind of a job in neighbouring country, ops with C208, F406 etc. Had 5 day's to move, so gave my employer at that stage 2 days notice and gapped it.
The CP was a snotnosed little brat with no backbone and even less of a personality, he took it personally, the owner of company was a little more realistic. After I explained to him why I'm leaving, we parted amiably.....sort of anyway.

Even if the guys you are flying for now are the biggest A-holes in the galaxy, and you would like nothing more than to F them over by leaving, or similar.....DONT! not if you want to use them as a reference later on. Swallow your pride (hopefully nothing else !) and try to part on the best terms possible.
In the long run, somewhere down the road a prospective employer will phone them up for a yarn or two. The aviation community is a lot smaller than we think sometimes, believe me.

 

[WrightAvia]

I think Skaz and js31pilot got it right.

Get a lawyer.

Don't forget about future job references.

I got a buddy that was flying corporate in jets. Good paying job. They sent him off to go get typed in the jet and when he came back from training, they wanted him to sign some type of training contract...he said no. Then he took a job with a national airline, Midwest Express (that's what they were called at the time). Well, he's been furloughed from Midwest Express twice since 9/11 and that airline is suffering right now and I don't think he'll be called back.

So now the guy can't get his old job back cause he hosed em on the type rating and he now flies a little part time in the right seat as a fill in co pilot somewhere. I would figure it looks bad on a resume when you just get typed and then go and quit a job. Imagine how that's gonna look to some employer up the road.

Aviation is a dog eat dog world...you have to cover your bases AND do what you think is best for yourself.

Good luck and get a lawyer to go over that piece of paper with you...then give two weeks notice and take your new job. Don't burn any bridges behind you.

 

[supsup]

thanks

Thanks guys for replying. I feel a little bad for bailing so soon on my contract but i've got to do it. I will most likely do whatever i can to keep things cozy between me and my current CP. Thanks again.

supsup

 

[Publishers]

contract

A contract is a contract. I you want to change it, then you try to mitigate it.

The fact is that these contracts are a function of the fact that aviation is a high turnover profession where people jump ship all the time to the next best deal. Companies came up with these to defend themselves from paying for a rating from which they think they are going to get good service from over a period of time.

When they do not get that service, they have the right to collect a portion of that back for the inconvenience and expense you have caused them.

Pilots who disregard that contract show no respect for contracts and the associated ethics. Not someone who I would want to hire.

 

[Typhoon1244]

Re: contract

Pilots who disregard that contract show no respect for contracts and the associated ethics. Not someone who I would want to hire.

Sounds harsh, doesn't it? Publishers has been on the management end of things, so take his words to heart. You don't want this to become a major issue at your next job interview.

The good news is that I imagine it would cost the Caravan operator more to sue you than it would just to eat the remainder of the contract...but I wouldn't want a reference from them.

Oh, on that note, remember that there are very strict laws regarding what a past or current employer can tell a future employer about you. I don't know all the details...anyone else know about this?

 

[bobbysamd]

Contracts

I dunno about the duress defense for breaching a contract. I think that duress would be very hard to prove. I agree with the others that you might see a lawyer about the contract.

I also agree wholeheartedly with Pub and the others about fulfilling the contract. I would try to work out a deal and pay it off. It's worth it to maintain your good name in the business. What's more, it's the honorable thing to do.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

If U signed a training contract, and leave before your contract is up, you should simply pay it back.

We had one of our pilots leave early, several years back. He paid what he owed, and everyone was happy.

Cliff
GRB

 

[jergar999]

The company I work for had me sign one. The D.O. told me they wouldn't come after me if I left early (I didn't, I wouldn't have signed if I didn't want to stay). He said that the company could write it off as a loss if I left.

 

[varicam]

First, let me say I've never reneged on a training contract and so far I've signed two. I have walked away from a couple of jobs where there was no contract. With that said, I see no dishonor in breaking a training contract if one sees a need to get away from an unforeseen bad situation. Training contracts are stacked in favor of the employer. A pilot can be fired for any reason or no reason at all. The working conditions, aircraft maintenance, etc may or may not resemble the picture described by the employer before the contract was signed. If I ever encounter such a situation, the contract will assume a very low priority. On the other hand, if a pilot leaves early merely to accept a better job, I believe paying off the contract is the right thing to do.