Traffic Pattern Altitude

[dhc8ap]

Ok, stupid question here.

Traffic Pattern Altitude, 1000' agl or 1500' agl?

 

[pilotpat]

Not a supid question at all. However, it's kind of silly when you stop to think about it. 1000' AGL is the recommended pattern altitude unless otherwise established (AIM 4-3-4). In AC 90-66A, it suggests that Large and Turbine Powered airplanes should enter the pattern at 1500' AGL. You can usually find pattern altitudes in the A/F Directory. Here's where it gets fun. I wouldn't want to be the 172 at 1000' following a heavy jet who's at 1500'. Can you say wake turbulence? Also, don't forget...is there an FAR that states what pattern altitude should be? What if the clouds were overcast at 1300', but VFR below? Would you fly a 1000' AGL pattern and bust the FAR that specifies distance from clouds? Or would you fly your pattern at 800'? I know that's kind of ludicrous, but that's the only thing I could come up with to try to make a point. The cloud clearance IS the regulation. The pattern altitude is not.

Just my .02 if anyone else has more clarification.

 

[VW Pilot]

Yeah, REGS wants you to stay clear of clouds in VFR.....kind of a trick situation there....wouldn't be a problem if you have an instrument rating....Also when guaging altitudes for traffic patterns look at sectionals if handy for the elevation and add that to the 1000ft. Don't worry if it says 110ft...just add another 100ft.....if you can hold within 2 to 5 feet or even 10, your're and ace PILOT.

 

[Big Dog]

Traffic Pattern Altitudes are RECOMMENDED locally and are NOT regulatory. They are based on a number of things including noise abatement, runway setup, traffic flow, terrrain and obstacles. ect. I suppose patterns and procedures established for noise abatement are somewhat more regulatory. In the absence of other guidance, the AIM makes some recommendations. If the TPA isn't listed for your airport in the A/FD, I recommend the AOPA Airport Directory. When it comes down to it, you will get in much more trouble going VMC into IMC or finding some jet wake than flying a different TPA.

 

[pilotpat]

Traffic Pattern Altitudes are RECOMMENDED locally and are NOT regulatory.

Yeah, see... Didn't anyone read the second post where the guy gave the AIM and Advisory Circular references. Oh, wait a minute. That was me. Sorry.

 

[AC560]

Traffic Pattern Altitudes are RECOMMENDED locally and are NOT regulatory.

For large/turbine powered aircraft in class D, C, B airports it is regulatory under 91.129.

 

[Big Dog]

For large/turbine powered aircraft in class D, C, B airports it is regulatory under 91.129.

Point Taken.

 

[pilotpat]

For large/turbine powered aircraft in class D, C, B airports it is regulatory under 91.129.

Actually, 91.129 is for Class D only and it still states:
(1) A large or turbine powered airplane shall, unless otherwise required by the applicable distance from cloud criteria, enter the traffic pattern at 1500' AGL......

Neither Class G, E, C, or B (91.126, 91.127, 91.130 and 91.131) specify any pattern altitude. So technically, even .129 allows you to be below 1500' in your jet for cloud clearance (if you're silly enough to be VFR in a jet/turbine aircraft with ceilings that low).

 

[AC560]

Neither Class G, E, C, or B (91.126, 91.127, 91.130 and 91.131) specify any pattern altitude.

Sec. 91.130 Operations in Class C airspace.

(a) General. Unless otherwise authorized by ATC, each aircraft
operation in Class C airspace must be conducted in compliance with this section and Sec. 91.129. For the purpose of this section, the primary airport is the airport for which the Class C airspace area is
designated. A satellite airport is any other airport within the Class C airspace area.

Sec. 91.131 Operations in Class B airspace.

(a) Operating rules. No person may operate an aircraft within a
Class B airspace area except in compliance with Sec. 91.129 and the following rules:

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Traffic Pattern Altitude is also what you fly when you do a go around while on a visual approach back up by the ILS.....

 

[Amish RakeFight]

1500 for ME and 1000 for SE - check AFD for local requirements.

 

[Ray Finkle]

and dont forget if you LEAVE the pattern below pattern altitude of 1000' and you are over the city/town (congested area), you have the reg 91.119 (b) that requires a minimum of 1000' above highest obstacle and 2000' horiz. depending on the airspace around your airport, in the pattern 800-900' fine, but you cant leave and stay there. this is good one i teach to my students, it always gets them! in a good way, i mean.

 

[flyf15]

and dont forget if you LEAVE the pattern below pattern altitude of 1000' and you are over the city/town (congested area), you have the reg 91.119 (b) that requires a minimum of 1000' above highest obstacle and 2000' horiz. depending on the airspace around your airport, in the pattern 800-900' fine, but you cant leave and stay there. this is good one i teach to my students, it always gets them! in a good way, i mean.

§ 91.119 Minimum safe altitudes: General.

Except when necessary for takeoff or landing,...

 

[AC560]

§ 91.119 Minimum safe altitudes: General.

Except when necessary for takeoff or landing,...

That is why he put "LEAVE" in capital letters I would think.

 

[PURPLEHAZE21]

All good points... I thought tha AIM recommended between 600ft agl to 1500 ft agl or as depicted, listed, etc... ?

 

[DrewBlows]

Traffic Pattern Altitude is also what you fly when you do a go around while on a visual approach back up by the ILS.....

You wouldn't believe (actually you probably would believe) how many guys I fly with who brief the missed approach altitude for a visual as the ILS missed altitude. Thankfully ATC usually makes a go-around a priority and issues you an altitude. I'd hate to get violated for a lesson that is taught in the second flight lesson.

 

[PURPLEHAZE21]

We brief the MSA to prevent...well the obvious, as a minimum. This helps if it is not "good" vmc conditions. However, it depends on the day and actual weather. An ounce of prevention prevents alot of pain...