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Tough choices.....

Jack Hass

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I'm a 1900 F/O with about 5 people ahead of me for upgrade.....our company is a lil shaky as are most out there.

I got a call from Chautauqua yesterday for a future class date, and was wondering if anyone from Chautauqua can lend some advice as to should i stay here or got to Chautauqua

Here being Commutair


I'm just looking long term here, and I welcome any advice any of you out there have



Thanks!
 

Cornelius

Where's Pancakes House
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I would wait and upgrade and get the good pay and keep a decent seniority number. I don't know too much about Chautauqua, but I heard they aren't all that stable either. I'm at a pretty unstable airline myself, Lakes, and if i had the chance to upgrade here I would. Now, if one of the top regionals offered me a position, I would be there in two shakes of a lambs tail.
 

mckpickle

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Commode air has been around for some time and will most likely continue to be. I'd hold out and get the PIC time. Shatwater has a very bad reputation for having hostile management. Plus, and someone please correct me, but i dont believe they have anything in their contract about flying "struck' work. As a preminition I think your going to see a lot of bad blood aimed at 5hitwater in the next few years. Im not condoning this just bringing it up.
 

Brother Francis

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No guarantees

That is indeed a difficult choice. No such thing as stability in this industry.

Commutair is a bird in the hand with your seniority and an upgrade coming soon and would be the safe choice.

I believe, however, that CHQ will offer a better long run opportunity for you; jet equipment, higher pay (in negotiations now), fast advancement, lots of expansion (with the caveat that the entire industry is in a state of flux).

I am happy to be here. PM me for more info if you want.

Mckpickle, you are again misinformed. A word of fatherly advice:

"Give every man thine ear, but few thy voice"-Hamlet: Act I, Scene iii

In other words, you should at least make a perfunctory effort to gather facts before you run your mouth.
 
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garrett

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May 16, 2002
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1900
You said you got the call from them yesterday. When was your interview and what's the future date?
 

mckpickle

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Re: No guarantees

Brother Francis said:
That is indeed a difficult choice. No such thing as stability in this industry.

Commutair is a bird in the hand with your seniority and an upgrade coming soon and would be the safe choice.

I believe, however, that CHQ will offer a better long run opportunity for you; jet equipment, higher pay (in negotiations now), fast advancement, lots of expansion (with the caveat that the entire industry is in a state of flux).

I am happy to be here. PM me for more info if you want.

Mckpickle, you are again misinformed. A word of fatherly advice:

"Give every man thine ear, but few thy voice"-Hamlet: Act I, Scene iii

In other words, you should at least make a perfunctory effort to


gather facts before you run your mouth.


I dont believe i stated anything to be factual that I was not sure of, ie the struck work clause. However it is public record of how CHQ FIRED people instead of laying them off. I stand by my earlier statement of hostile managment relations. Plus I personally know of people who have been fired. Not saying they didnt deserve it however, at a company with 2300 pilots for over 5 years I have only seen this once. As far as my opinion that CHQ might bear the brunt of other pilot groups "bad blood" I dont condone this JUST STATING that CHQ is not held in high regard by other pilot groups. This is in all probablity due to CHQ being the lowest bidder. However We like to think of ourselves as professionals and not subject to pandering to the lowest common denominator.
 

I.P. Freley

I like people food
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Enough
Pandering to the lowest common denominator? You mean like resorting to such intellectual midgetry as calling Commutair "commode air" and Chautauqua "5hitwater", for instance?

Practice what you preach, sporto.

It's kinda hard to get excited by "what the other guys think" when it comes to the rep of a company. With very few exceptions, it's the management, not the pilots themselves. If I were at Chautauqua and got the Evil Eye from the competition's pilots, well, tough noogies. I need a job, too, and if someone else's company priced themselves out of a market, well, that's not my problem. I have to pay the rent, too.

For the record, all the "fired" CHQ guys and gals were offered their positions back, and were given a four thousand dollar payoff for their troubles. Hell, I'd rather be fired and get a check like that than be furloughed and get squat. Sounds like a good deal to ME... Just ask any of the "I'm not fired, I'm furloughed" guys and gals at CoEx how great it is being on the street for a year.
 

Brother Francis

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Article16.D

"The Company will not transfer any Company aircraft or schedule any pilot(s) to fly any trips for airlines that are on strike unless mutually agreed to by the Company and the Union."

You have made assumptions based on incomplete information, the missing pieces of which you are either ignorant (not stupid, ignorant; there is a difference. Didn't want anyone to think I am calling names, which I most certainly am not.) or have chosen to ignore. Since your mind appears to be made up on the management relations issue, I will not confuse you with facts. Suffice to say that while it is not all bunny-rabbits and bottles of milk, it is far, far from hostile and is improving. Your perception of the state of labor/management relations is exaggerated and to declare as fact, then attempt to support, that there is a "very bad reputation for hostile management" recklessly exceeds the level of selective and anecdotal knowledge you have acquired.

With regard to the bad blood, I have to give you that one and will leave that debate for others. Sticks and stones. :D
 
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mckpickle

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Thank you for the clarrifacation on the "struck work clause" I do believe that I stated I was unsure of that fact. And for IP freely. Just look at how Delta and Comairs relationship has progressed. Very hostile twords one another. If CHQ starts flying around 145s on EAGLE routes I feel as though you will be the recipiant of some negitive attitude. DID I SAY THIS WAS PROPER. NO i dont believe I did, and nor do i condone such behavor. However when a pilot group gives complete control of a company to Managment, things will happen. IE lowest common denominator remark. If someone would want to fly for an airline that is looked upon that way thats fine and I wish them all the luck. But when Eagle guys start to go and CHQ guys are picking up the flying I think you can see where the conflict would arise. Im not flaming here and Im not saying that other companies do no have their problems, but some are a bit more proactive. I was simply responding to a question posed about Commute air vs CHQ, which in itself warrents opinionated responces. Oh and brother francis..easy on the big words im just a pilot.
 

Brother Francis

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Truce

Sorry I got snippy. I'll buy someone a beer (just one; outside the 12 hour limit, of course) and pretend it's you. You do the same for me and we'll call a truce.
 
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mckpickle

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Re: Truce

Brother Francis said:
Sorry I got snippy. I'll buy someone a beer (just one; outside the 12 hour limit, of course) and pretend it's you. You do the same for me and we'll call a truce.


Amen. Lets just make sure there are no TSA folks around.
 

I.P. Freley

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TSA folks?

You mean Trans States? Another ill-regarded pilot group, I guess, as they are "stealing" work from Eagle guys AND USAirExp pilots. :)
 

Jack Hass

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i was hired there back in august 2001
 

bobbysamd

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Seniority

Interesting tangents to the original thread.

In my .02, unless I were stuck in a truly dire, horrible situation (considering, of course, that most aviation situations are dire and horrible), I would never, ever, give up a seniority number. Even with horrible financials, seniority is still the name of the game. Five numbers ahead for upgrade isn't so bad. You are close. You'll get your chance. Why give that up for the uncertainties of a new job? Face it, there's always stress in starting any new job.

I like Brother Francis' Shakespeare quote. :)
 
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