Timeline for all this ASA/Skywest ALPA stuff?

[sstearns2]

I was curious as to when all this stuff is going to happen.

When are ALPA cards counted for the Skywest pilots?

Assuming they collect enough cards, when will a union vote occur?

When is the election for a new ASA MEC?

I'll attempt to answer the first two. I'm sure that ALPA knows exactly how many cards are in at all times. They need 35% of the pilots to send in a card to petition the NMB for a vote. If they can get 50% ALPA can legally certify itself without a vote if they choose to (see #19 at
http://www.nmb.gov/representation/faqs-ola.html). None of the cards can be more than a year old when they present them to the NMB, but pilots are free to send a new card every year. There doesn't appear to be any limit on the length of a union drive.

I believe 35% will not be a problem, but 50% will be. I imagine ALPA would have a vote as soon as they have confidence they would be certified, but my current feeling is that there will not be enough cards sent in to give them that confidence. But, we shall see what we shall see.

Scott

 

[Speedtape]

Skywest voting in ALPA would benefit both Skywest and ASA. Think longterm!


It will take years to put together a contract and todays Comair is tomorrows ASA.



What happened to those negotiations for a rate on the 70 that you were promised about 2 years ago? Make yourself sheep, and you will be devoured by the wolves! You are at will employees only if you choose to stay that way!


Ya, I see guys getting terminated left and right, that's why we're in such a hiring frenzy.



Have you not received letters in the last year from Brad stating that the competitive landscape was changing and that MGMT hoped that they could maintain your present pay and benefits but that would depend on outside conditions? They are softening you up for something down the road.



If that was to be the case then why is Brad talking increased pay proposals even if it is just talk? I don't think the tone would be increase if he was trying to "soften" us up for a reduction.



Continental Express just got a 2 year contract extension with some nice pay bumps that put their 50 seat rates near or maybe above the 70 rate at ASA. For all you ALPA bashers, take note!


What are they going to fly after they loose all of their aircraft?




Your pay rates and ours will never change until we start pulling on the same end of the rope! There is strength in numbers. Even if kept apart, we could work together to improve working conditions and pay if you had ALPA. Otherwise, we will be whipsawed and that will keep downward pressure on pay and benefits.


I think a year from now there will not be 2 equal groups to work together. And as I've said before, even if we voted in ALPA today it would be years before we could be in a position to collaborate an advantage. The economic dynamics are so rapid today there is no way contract negotiations can keep up, and I believe that is by design.

I saw an old Wang computer on Ebay, and had to laugh. What was at one time a powerful industry tool is now a relic and basically useless.

I see ALPA the same way.

And where do you see your pay rates a year from now? How about 5 years from now? Don't be in denial!

 

[COOPERVANE]

I'm tired of all the bickering and shortsightedness. If there will be no unity and it is "us vs. them" and thats it, then I propose lowering our rates and take Skywest aircraft.

Hey, I have to think of myself first right?

 

[SuperKooter]

Skywest voting in ALPA would benefit ASA.

There I fixed it for you.

Only people who want Skywest to be Alpa are ASA and Xjt.

 

[bender]

If ALPA gets 50% + 1 then the union can come to the company and say "Look, the majority of your pilots want representation so you can either recognize us now or later." If the company refuses the demand then the NMB will conduct a vote.

 

[rickair7777]

I'm tired of all the bickering and shortsightedness. If there will be no unity and it is "us vs. them" and thats it, then I propose lowering our rates and take Skywest aircraft.

Hey, I have to think of myself first right?

Honestly, I have no real idea what the current ASA contract is like.

With that being said, how does it compare to SKW? Would it be feasible to ask for EXACTLY what SKW has, plus 70 & 90 rates? It would be hard for the company to refuse, and that would end the whipsaw business. Or would that be a big pay cut?

 

[FightingIrish]

Honestly, I have no real idea what the current ASA contract is like.

With that being said, how does it compare to SKW? Would it be feasible to ask for EXACTLY what SKW has, plus 70 & 90 rates? It would be hard for the company to refuse, and that would end the whipsaw business. Or would that be a big pay cut?

I think that is a great idea as do many ASA pilots. However that would come with PBS and dual qualification and without a retirement plan which some here at ASA are not willing to accept.

 

[wms]

Honestly, I have no real idea what the current ASA contract is like.

With that being said, how does it compare to SKW? Would it be feasible to ask for EXACTLY what SKW has, plus 70 & 90 rates? It would be hard for the company to refuse, and that would end the whipsaw business. Or would that be a big pay cut?

The pilots at ASA have let it be known that's what we want, but the impression we get is Jerry wants us to have less, because the company hasn't offered us anything like what the SKYW pilots have. In fact everything they offer is far less.

 

[FightingIrish]

The pilots at ASA have let it be known that's what we want, but the impression we get is Jerry wants us to have less, because the company hasn't offered us anything like what the SKYW pilots have. In fact everything they offer is far less.

That may be true for the pilots, but I don't believe that is ALPA's position. The Skywest pilots have PBS, dual qualification, no retirement and low 700 pay. ALPA won't budge on those issues. Maybe if ALPA budged, we could get something like what the Skywest pilots have and protect our jobs.

 

[ArcticFlier]

Oh please

If they can get 50% ALPA can legally certify itself without a vote if they choose to...................
Scott

Um...let's clarify that further...............................

19. Q: Can a union be certified by the NMB without an election?

A: Yes. If there is only one labor organization applying for representation, and the organization and the carrier agree in writing to a certification based on a check of authorization cards, the NMB can authorize the check of authorizations instead of an election. If a majority of the craft or class has signed authorizations, the organization will be certified without an election.​

​

Do you really think that will happen? Seriously.​

AF ​

 

[Rekks Inbound]

Although I don't have a 'dog in this fight', if JA is rejecting ASA's willingness to accept Skywest's rates and rules for their new contract, then his whole purpose is to then use those lower rates to drive DOWN the Skywest payrates and work rules. Of course, if Skywest were an ALPA carrier, or at least had a legally binding contract, this scenario would be far more unlikely.

Peace.

Rekks.

 

[bender]

What's this "no retirement at Skywest" stuff about? We have 401K options along with company match contributions.

Hey Rekks - Mesa is Skywest's most direct competitor. JA has never used Mesa to drive DOWN pilot compensation so why do you think he would use ASA?

 

[SkyNation]

then his whole purpose is to then use those lower rates to drive DOWN the Skywest payrates and work rules. Of course, if Skywest were an ALPA carrier, or at least had a legally binding contract, this scenario would be far more unlikely.

Peace.

Rekks.

Right, because of course ALPA carriers with legally binding contracts never have their pay and work rules driven down.

 

[ASARJMan]

Right, because of course ALPA carriers with legally binding contracts never have their pay and work rules driven down.

They have when their respective company entered bankruptcy which favors management. A judge can rule on their legally binding contracts under bankruptcy law dummy.

VOTED IN FAVOR!

 

[Rekks Inbound]

Bender,

The '99 for 50' seat rate you guys enjoy is in direct response to MESA's lower rates. If you don't realize that, then the rest of this discussion is hopeless.

Peace.

Rekks.

 

[Rekks Inbound]

BK judges can impose whatever they see fit, and it is normally otherwise what the company want's: read your airline and/or labor history.

The only difference is that without a legally binding contract(which you actually WOULD HAVE as soon as ALPA or some other union was voted onto the property, see the RLA re:your current "agreement") JA could impose without BK, if he and the board of directors of Skywest feel it is in the best interest of the stockholders.

Peace.

Rekks

 

[CFIT]

And where do you see your pay rates a year from now? How about 5 years from now? Don't be in denial!

I see them going up, with logevity, the rumored offer from managment, and the differential for flying the 66/70/76, about 8%. The XJT "grand" contract is only 2% more than what I make now, but hanging my hat on the charter concept would make me a little un-comfortable. Ask yourself; do you want to be at an airline that is growing or shrinking?

I'm not in denial, and after not paying ALPA, I'm doing better.

 

[ASARJMan]

Hereya go ASAdrivel, chew on this:


XJT contract extention
I just wanted to let guys that care know that our MEC has approved a contract extention. If ratified it will take effect on Dec 1st and be ammendable on Dec 1st 2010. It also contains a comprehensive charter flying section.

The pay rates are as follows.

(The first line is 145 pay, the second is 135 pay Sorry it's kinda hard o read)
YOS 12/1/04 12/1/05 12/1/06 12/1/07 12/1/08 12/1/09
1 57.28 58.71 60.18 61.68 63.38 65.28
1 50.63 51.90 53.20 54.53 56.03 57.71
2 58.99 60.46 61.97 63.52 65.28 67.24
2 52.14 53.45 54.78 56.15 57.71 59.44
3 60.77 62.29 63.85 65.45 67.24 69.25
3 53.72 55.07 56.44 57.85 59.44 61.23
4 62.58 64.15 65.75 67.39 69.25 71.33
4 55.32 56.71 58.12 59.58 61.23 63.06
5 64.47 66.08 67.73 69.43 71.33 73.47
5 56.99 58.42 59.88 61.37 63.06 64.95
6 66.40 68.06 69.76 71.51 73.47 75.67
6 58.70 60.17 61.67 63.21 64.95 66.90
7 67.72 69.41 71.15 72.93 74.94 77.19
7 59.86 61.36 62.90 64.47 66.25 68.24
8 69.75 71.50 73.28 75.12 77.19 79.50
8 61.66 63.20 64.78 66.40 68.24 70.29
9 71.84 73.64 75.48 77.37 79.50 81.89
9 63.51 65.10 66.73 68.39 70.29 72.40
10 74.00 75.85 77.75 79.69 81.89 84.35
10 65.42 67.05 68.73 70.45 72.40 74.57
11 76.22 78.13 80.08 82.08 84.35 86.88
11 67.38 69.06 70.79 72.56 74.57 76.81
12 78.51 80.47 82.48 84.54 86.88 89.48
12 69.40 71.13 72.91 74.74 76.81 79.11
13 80.86 82.88 84.96 87.08 89.48 92.17
13 71.48 73.27 75.10 76.98 79.11 81.48
14 83.29 85.37 87.50 89.69 92.17 94.93
14 73.63 75.47 77.35 79.29 81.48 83.93
15 84.95 87.08 89.25 91.49 94.01 96.83
15 75.10 76.98 78.90 80.87 83.11 85.61
16 86.65 88.82 91.04 93.32 95.89 98.77
16 76.60 78.52 80.48 82.49 84.77 87.32
17 88.39 90.60 92.86 95.18 97.81 100.74
17 78.13 80.09 82.09 84.14 86.47 89.06
18 90.15 92.41 94.72 97.09 99.76 102.76
18 79.70 81.69 83.73 85.82 88.20 90.85
EMB-145/135 First Officer
YOS 12/01/04 12/01/05 12/01/06 12/01/07 12/01/08 12/01/09
1 21.50 22.04 22.59 23.15 23.79 24.50
2 32.00 32.80 33.62 34.46 35.40 36.47
3 33.99 34.84 35.72 36.61 37.61 38.73
4 36.25 37.16 38.09 39.04 40.11 41.31
5 37.34 38.28 39.23 40.21 41.31 42.55
6 38.46 39.42 40.41 41.42 42.55 43.82
7 39.62 40.61 41.62 42.66 43.82 45.14
8 40.80 41.83 42.87 43.94 45.14 46.49