Tentative agreement reached

[BID]

Any info with regards to scope, is SkyWest going to fly the 90 seat aircraft?

Did they at least save the pensions or is that still up in the air?

 

[michael707767]

So the ask was 19% and the TA is 15%. How did DALPA suddenly slide that far.

The ask was for 19.5% on the pay rates, DALPA TA'd 14%.

The total ask was for 325 mil, of which the 19.5% pay cut reprsented about two thirds. DALPA TA'd a deal with a 14% pay cut and 1% in other savings (still wondering what that will be).

Not saying its a good deal, I agree, how did DALPA slide that far. But, wanted to put out the correct numbers.

 

[michael707767]

Any info with regards to scope, is SkyWest going to fly the 90 seat aircraft?

Did they at least save the pensions or is that still up in the air?

noting on scope, nothing on pensions. Those are among the many items to be worked out. This is just an interim agreement pending a deal on the full contract.

 

[L'il J.Seinfeld]

12 year MD88 CA $160/hr... minus 14% = $137/hr and change...

That's roughly close to what a SECOND year FO at UPS/FedEX will be making shortly (as already offered up by the respecive mgts).

 

[Networ-King]

ddddduuuuuddddeeee you must be smoking some good stuff....

wish I could believe you on those pay rates.......

now puff puff give .... you fu@kin up the rotation......

 

[StaySeated]

Just curious, are you saying that this TA contains a provision that includes binding arbitration? Please tell me that I read that wrong. Before 2001 and after the NWA 98 strike and UAL slowdown a few senators wanted to rewrite some laws and get rid of the RLA so they could impose pay and work rules with binding arbitration (they used pro ball players as an example to fool us into thinking we were going to get athlete coin). I am very afraid that they have figured out a way to include arbitration into a standard RLA negotiation. Imagine this outside of BK, you have a 4 year contract, add 2.5 to negotiate a new one, and then throw in binding arbitration language that basically negates everything that was negotiated during the last 2.5 years AND eliminates self help. Oh my, can you say totally fcuked.

 

[L'il J.Seinfeld]

ddddduuuuuddddeeee you must be smoking some good stuff....

wish I could believe you on those pay rates.......

now puff puff give .... you fu@kin up the rotation......

I said close duuude. Point being that this Delta TA is horse****. BTW current FedEx second year FO widebody (which is everything they have except the 72) is already $117!

 

[Captain Overs]

You know it's a sad state of the industry when Delta pilots bend over. They have been the strongest for a long time. I think we may all be in trouble.

 

[michael707767]

Just curious, are you saying that this TA contains a provision that includes binding arbitration? Please tell me that I read that wrong.

here is the exact wording from the code-a-phone.

"Finally, in the event a comprehensive agreement cannot be reached, the TA commits both sides to a neutral third party panel for a binding decision on management's 1113 motion. This neutral panel process is subject to court approval. The panel includes two members of ALPA's choosing and one of Delta's. All panel members have extensive experience with labor relations in the airline industry."

Doesn't use the words binding arbitration, which I think is a spin job on the part of the union, but thats what it is. Amazing isn't it?

I don't object to the 14% pay cut, it's about what I expected. I also knew there would be some other give backs. But to agree to arbitration with big items like scope still on the table has got to be the worst move I have ever heard of by a pilot union.

Only thing left to do is vote no and hope the pilot group realizes just how crazy this would be.

 

[~~~^~~~]

But to agree to arbitration with big items like scope still on the table has got to be the worst move I have ever heard of by a pilot union.

It makes sense if you consider that ALPA has no leadership on the issue, no moral authority and a lawsuit hanging over their heads. This way no one is responsible or accountable. Plus ALPA pays their folks trip drops so they get a lot of nice dinners and bar tabs in swanky hotels without having to blow their own money.

 

[737 Pylt]

It makes sense if you consider that ALPA has no leadership on the issue, no moral authority and a lawsuit hanging over their heads. This way no one is responsible or accountable. Plus ALPA pays their folks trip drops so they get a lot of nice dinners and bar tabs in swanky hotels without having to blow their own money.

Fins:
While I have absolutely zero love for alpa, if you think that the rjdc lawsuit has anything to do with a "fear tactic" for negotiating scope, you are even more stupid than I give you credit for!
737

 

[FDJ2]

oh, we just agree to let a third party decide whether or not the company can throw out the contract if we don't reach a full deal by March. That gives away any strike threat and leverage we had. I am beyond belief that our union we even talk about this, let alone TA it.

Michael, read section 6.G. If I read it correctly, if the third party nuetrals reject our PWA, we still retain the same rights as if the court rejected our PWA through the 1113 motion, with the exception of certain appeals processes. Those rights I believe include the right to strike if our PWA is rejected. It's also my understanding that ALPA got to choose 2 of the 3 nuetrals.

Let me know if you draw the same conclusion.

 

[Networ-King]

I said close duuude. Point being that this Delta TA is horse****. BTW current FedEx second year FO widebody (which is everything they have except the 72) is already $117!

Yeah....yeah.... I know could you not see the sarcasm oooozzzzing out of your computer when your read my post? . I can only hope second year pay will be that nice at big brown with the new contract, but we don't have different equipment pay and the monthly guarantee is also different.....ssssoooooooooo. Not really holding my breath, time will tell.

by the way.... second year pay for the widebody is 117, but with the international overide its 121.50. So you were even closer then you though.

 

[9rj9]

so....

you take a 15% pay cut now and agree to binding arbitration. Better hope the arbitration goes your way, you cannot strike if you agreed to it.
Management's way of getting you guys to eat the giant crap sandwich a little at a time. Seems management is much smarter than we thought.

 

[ultrarunner]

Imagine this outside of BK, you have a 4 year contract, add 2.5 to negotiate a new one, and then throw in binding arbitration language that basically negates everything that was negotiated during the last 2.5 years AND eliminates self help. Oh my, can you say totally fcuked.

Makes you wonder what's the point of the union in the first place. But hey, the memberships keep ratifying what their MEC's are thowing at them, so only themselves to blame on that, IMO. I think unity is a think of the past.