telluride

[acat]

I may have a trip coming up to telluride, CO. I have no mountain flying experience and was wondering if anyone had any advise for flying into telluride? Is there anything tricky about getting in and out of there? Where should I look to gain some mountain flying knowledge before the trip? Do many turbo props fly in and out of there? I will be doing it in a cheyenne.
thanks

 

[matchthehatch]

The first thing that comes to mind is this...Be slow and be prepared to descend, whether you are shooting an instrument or a visual approach.

Also, I would suggest that you set your own higher minimums, or set a MAP more restrictive than the published 1 DME (just don't forget to continue on the course until the published MAP before turning if you do miss). Do this long before you have begun the approach and stick to it during it.

And finally, if a missed procedure has to be flown, don't do what a FLOPS crew did. They accelerated to some ungodly speed during the MA procedure and nearly hit the mountain south of the runway. They followed the procedure correctly, but their speed was so high, and thus their turn radius, they flew well outside of protected airspace. That incident is a good lesson to us all to remember to fly the correct missed approach speed.

 

[Knob]

Seriously, if the wx is at mins, have analternate that has an ILS. Anybody that flew the 1900 or Dash 8 in and out of TEX will be able to tell you, hopefully they'll give their 2 cents worth. TEX is in a box end canyon and there is a pretty good dropoff at both ends of the runway that can be pretty interesting on windy days. Its probably one of the best visual approaches in the western part of America-have fun.

 

[The_Russian]

Try not to hit the mountains!

HEHE

 

[FL420]

Here are some good resources:

AOPA’s free online Mountain Flying Course
http://flash.aopa.org/asf/mountainFlying/flash.cfm

AIM 7-5-6. Mountain Flying
http://www.faa.gov/ATPubs/AIM/Chap7/aim0705.html#7-5-6

AIM 7-5-7. Use of Runway Half-way Signs at Unimproved Airports
http://www.faa.gov/ATPubs/AIM/Chap7/aim0705.html#7-5-7

Good blog on Mountain Flying
http://www.fergworld.com/articles/article_mountain_01.php

CDOT Aeronautics Division Telluride page
http://www.colorado-aeronautics.org/Telluride.htm

Watch your engine temps on takeoffs and go-arounds.

 

[avbug]

Download and check your performance, then download again. Consider taking off light and going to Grand Junction for fuel, then heading out from there.

Your approach will look flat. It is. Don't be too flat. Don't go in there on instruments. If you can't see it, don't land there. That doesn't mean scooting in beneath the clouds after flying an approach to Telluride. It means a good solid visual approach. Especially if it's your first time. Don't count on great performance when going missed or going around, and though Telluride doesn't look it, it can be a one way strip. It can sucker you in.

The runway goes downhill, then uphill again. When you think you have it made, it keeps dropping away from you, resulting in landing long and fast...which the uphill end helps make up for. When taking off, just when you think it's time to go fly, the runway climbs up toward you. You get instant altitude off the end if you need it, but you have to clear the fence at the end...which has caught folks unaware before.

Be sure you don't compromise yourself with frost on departure. Be sure you have a slot and room to stay if you're planning on that. Plan on realistic alternates, especially if you're used to flying in the East. Alternates aren't as plentiful, and may close down quickly. Consider Grand Junction or Montrose.

Take a good look at your single engine capabilities. You may not have much of a choice if you lose an engine, and if you lose one going in, you may have no choice but to get it right on very marginal performance. Be prepared for rapidly changing conditions.

Landing at Telluride isnt rocket science...if you fly sensibly and know your performance, you'll be fine. If you get ice and can't shed it, you can't go down to lower to find warmer; there's terrain in the way. Same for executing a missed approach on limited performance, and definitely don't go hunting for the runway or airport with low conditions. It's a little hard to spot unless you know where it is, unless you're well above it. If you come have a look high, you can set up and come back around...but give yourself adequate ceiling and visibility to do it. If the weather is down, rather than push yourself, be prepared to land at Grand Junction of another choice and drive up in a rental car. Good luck.

 

[kansas]

Do many turbo props fly in and out of there? I will be doing it in a cheyenne.
thanks

Great Lakes flies the 1900 in there all the time. I haven't had a chance to do it myself, though.

 

[AerroMatt]

Spot on advice

Download and check your performance, then download again. Consider taking off light and going to Grand Junction for fuel, then heading out from there.

Your approach will look flat. It is. Don't be too flat. Don't go in there on instruments. If you can't see it, don't land there. That doesn't mean scooting in beneath the clouds after flying an approach to Telluride. It means a good solid visual approach. Especially if it's your first time. Don't count on great performance when going missed or going around, and though Telluride doesn't look it, it can be a one way strip. It can sucker you in.

The runway goes downhill, then uphill again. When you think you have it made, it keeps dropping away from you, resulting in landing long and fast...which the uphill end helps make up for. When taking off, just when you think it's time to go fly, the runway climbs up toward you. You get instant altitude off the end if you need it, but you have to clear the fence at the end...which has caught folks unaware before.

Be sure you don't compromise yourself with frost on departure. Be sure you have a slot and room to stay if you're planning on that. Plan on realistic alternates, especially if you're used to flying in the East. Alternates aren't as plentiful, and may close down quickly. Consider Grand Junction or Montrose.

Take a good look at your single engine capabilities. You may not have much of a choice if you lose an engine, and if you lose one going in, you may have no choice but to get it right on very marginal performance. Be prepared for rapidly changing conditions.

Landing at Telluride isnt rocket science...if you fly sensibly and know your performance, you'll be fine. If you get ice and can't shed it, you can't go down to lower to find warmer; there's terrain in the way. Same for executing a missed approach on limited performance, and definitely don't go hunting for the runway or airport with low conditions. It's a little hard to spot unless you know where it is, unless you're well above it. If you come have a look high, you can set up and come back around...but give yourself adequate ceiling and visibility to do it. If the weather is down, rather than push yourself, be prepared to land at Grand Junction of another choice and drive up in a rental car. Good luck.

Avbug nailed it on this post. Middle of the runway is about 80 feet lower than either end. I used to instruct in Montrose and flew into TEX on a weekly basis some years ago. I also recall a Baron pilot that drove his plane onto the dropping-away runway and collapsed his nose gear. If the weather isn't severe VFR, consider landing at MTJ and having the passengers take a shuttle bus (only 65 miles by highway, and worth it). Then see about getting together with a local CFI for the short trip to TEX and he can show you the ropes of getting in and out of there safely. If you check with the local FBO, they'll recommend the same thing. They've had to scrape too many dinged airplanes off that runway that were pranged by pilots unfamiliar with the unique-ness of the airport.

This time of year, Density Altitude shouldn't be too much of a factor, but consider that an ISA standard temp at TEX is 28F. This will be a factor if your pax plan on an afternoon departure.

Other than that, enjoy the flight! Telluride is an awesome sight any time of year, and a great place to hang out at. Wish I was going there again.

 

[MauleSkinner]

The runway goes downhill, then uphill again. When you think you have it made, it keeps dropping away from you, resulting in landing long and fast...which the uphill end helps make up for. When taking off, just when you think it's time to go fly, the runway climbs up toward you. You get instant altitude off the end if you need it, but you have to clear the fence at the end...which has caught folks unaware before.

I would just add that you're probably going to want to evaluate your engine-out-on-takeoff procedures based on the runway slope as well...I think it's about a 2% grade on both ends, which means that if you normally plan on flying if you're airborne and an engine fails, you're going to need a pretty good single-engine climb rate just to outclimb the runway.

I used to get into this discussion with a guy who flew in there in a 414. He claimed the "great single-engine performance" of the airplane would get him out if he lost one at rotation. The 414 has performance corrections for gear down, prop windmilling, and cowl flaps open. His "great single-engine performance" would have had him descending at about 600 FPM until he started cleaning the airplane up. Don't be like this guy...he died in a takeoff accident.

Don't get me wrong. Telluride won't kill you. Just don't make assumptions about performance based on bad information.

Fly safe!

David

 

[cheyflyer]

Just go to Montrose and dont worry about it. Its only an hour drive and IMO much safer if you're not a regular. I have been to Montrose 3 or 4 times in the last year in the Cheyenne (pax staying in Telluride) and found Jet Away Aviation to be a great place to park the plane for a few days. Nice digs and heated hangar.

cf