Tards of NetJets!

[Voice Of Reason]

"Voices of Reason", was the name given to a divisive group of pilots that were trying to stop a job action at The Allied Pilot's Association. The Year was 1998, and the American Airlines pilots were ordered back to work by President Clinton anyway.

Did you get that tactic out of the Sun Tzu manual as well? Interesting theory...Strangely no internet search brings it up...Nice attempt at diversion, though.
Believe it or not, all people that disagree with you aren't management, as much as you'd like to make your zombie followers believe it.

 

[Lrjet55]

Did you get that tactic out of the Sun Tzu manual as well? Interesting theory...Strangely no internet search brings it up...Nice attempt at diversion, though.
Believe it or not, all people that disagree with you aren't management, as much as you'd like to make your zombie followers believe it.

Once again, a statement with no substance, purpose or meaning.

You have to give us something better than that. Sad, just plain sad.

 

[Voice Of Reason]

Once again, a statement with no substance, purpose or meaning.

You have to give us something better than that. Sad, just plain sad.

Just pointing out the old, used up tactics...Don't look to me to be your savior and tell you what to do...All I can say is get a job where you are happy, and don't be led like a zombie for the next ten years or so

...BTW any of you think about how old you'll be in ten years? Really, think about it. Why wait for something that MIGHT happen 10 years down the line, when you can do something NOW. FLOPS will get what they deserve when they lose all their good people, and owners/business starts dropping like crazy. When all they are left with are 19 year olds that would have otherwise been at Mesa, NO ONE will want to be in the back. THAT's "sticking it to them" Why stick it to YOURSELF and play their games and the IBT's games? Look at how long NetJets has been working on this and STILL nothing! Do FLOPS pilots really believe that they'll just "latch on" to Net Jet's contract? Get real...You will start ALL OVER...from the beginning as a NEW entity. After all over your efforts, after several years IBT will get you to accept a cr@p contract with the typical "It's just a first contract, that's the best you can get" babble. GET REAL people!

 

[netjetwife]

Not to mention hypocritical

Believe it or not, all people that disagree with you aren't IBT handles, as much as you'd like to make your zombie followers believe it.

Just replacing one word in your sentence, proves what a double standard you have, Voice. I know many NJ pilots that are HAPPY with the JOB, just not the pay. But they are working to change that.

 

[Publishers]

Green, you called the UAL strike a success???? It sufficiently weakened the company to where they could not stand the adversity when faced which led to the employee/ownership losing all their stock value and stock itself.

 

[Lrjet55]

Voice of Reason,

I have no doubt you have a miserable job in an industry you arent even suited for. Your probably to old, to slow and to upset because you were never hired or recruited for anything substantial.

You have rationalized your ineptitude and skill to champion for mediocracy. We on the other hand are attempting to change something that directly affects each and everyone of us on a daily basis. Thinking 10 years down the road is exactly what we are thinking of. You have missed the point, the boat and the whole conversation. There is a fight to fight and thats what we are doing. Your ingnorance or arrogance is simply pathetic.

Some people never take a chance. They sit back and criticize those who do. Your hindsight is impeccably 20/20 but your foresight makes you legaly blind.

Don't bother posting a response because I can't get back the 20 or so seconds of my life it takes me to read your blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

 

[gunfyter]

Green, you called the UAL strike a success???? It sufficiently weakened the company to where they could not stand the adversity when faced which led to the employee/ownership losing all their stock value and stock itself.

They got Dick Ferris canned did they not? That was a success in itself.

 

[Voice Of Reason]

Voice of Reason,

Your probably to old, to slow and to upset because you were never hired or recruited for anything substantial.

You have rationalized your ineptitude ...

Don't bother posting a response because I can't get back the 20 or so seconds of my life it takes me to read your blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

....And I'm "inept"?????
Oh, and you sure "got me" on that description, lol.
Don't bother posting a response, huh? Typical

 

[Publishers]

Heh Gun, suicide bombers kill people too and seem to think they are winning. Just ask one????

 

[gunfyter]

I have read hundreds of your posts on every section of this message board. One thing is consistant.

You consistantly discourage any pilots who who think they may be worth more than a management wants to pay. You consistantly blame Pilot's and their unions for every difficulty a carrier encounters. You consistantly discourage pilots by saying the economics of aviation won't support good salaries and work rules.

You are consistant.

It could not possibly be that Managements are at fault for poor performance could it?

No offense to any FLOPS folks intended... Now I do not have a first hand knowledge. But a few FLOPS pilots I have bumped into in hotels and FBOs have made it sound to me like they don't believe they'll be in business another year. Now I just CANNOT BELIEVE this! There is no Pilot's Union there to screw things up for management. So it just cannot possibly be true.


If it is true, I think management needs to ensure a Union gets in ASAP so they will have someone to blame other than themselves... don't you?

 

[netjetwife]

Excellent post, Gunfyter! I just have one question:
Was it directed at A) Voice B) Publishers or ... C) both

 

[gunfyter]

Bravo.

Voice is another type of animal IMO

 

[Publishers]

I do not -- if you read all those posts find management particulary great in this industry, especially compared to many others.
What we have is a difference in philosophy that says, if you do not like things, leave and find something else.

I believe that most pilots of companies have little real sense of the economic s and the business section they are in and consequently misjudge management and how the company works.

People on the high side are over paid and the bottom side is way underpaid.... just like at Netjets.

 

[j41driver]

Comair was out for 89 days...but the work rules were horrible

Compared to what?

 

[netjetwife]

"People on the high side are over paid and the bottom side is way underpaid.... just like at Netjets."

Which is exactly why the industry is overdue for a correction. It is up to the pilots to force the issue. I believe that many of them DO understand the economics involved, particularly when it comes to the massive waste the NJ pilots witness on a regular basis. Furthermore, we all understand that wages are a cost of doing business.

PILOTS ARE PROFESSIONALS AND SHOULD BE PAID AS SUCH

A RISING TIDE SHOULD LIFT ALL BOATS

 

[Hawkered]

Voice of Reason- I'm sorry that your geeky approach to life without meaning has yielded you no findings of the peculiarities of The Allied Pilots Association. Your arguments have no sense of direction or purpose. Do you go to work everyday reciting the words of Phyllis Diller in, "The Antz"

"It's not a lot, but it's a life!" ?

How about you grow a backbone and make yourself stand up and be counted? Or is it better to stand around FBOs muttering in repetition.

"We're all doomed...."

What people have done to airline pay in this country undermines the very premise of safety that the travelling public have come to expect. If you continue to work in an industry where only peanuts are paid, we will come to expect monkeys applying for the job.

Unionism has stopped child labor, unlawful terminations and unsafe work practices. Yes, I know you will counter with all the alphabet organizations that are part of government, but unions are where society first felt this need.

ALPA dropped the ball on the Replacement Jets, we all know that. It's up to the rest of the industry to fix this mistake. If we continue to allow passengers with caviar tastes, use our services at McDonalds pricing, we are doing this entire country a disservice!

 

[netjetwife]

Like he said! Excellent post, Hawkered!

 

[Hawkered]

Voice of Reason, just to let you off the hook somewhat. I have been known to very anti-Teamster myself. This is not a matter of The Teamsters or ALPA or SWAPA. This is a matter of dutiful representation of our interests.

My belief is that The Teamsters better get this right, or they'll never represent a pilot group again in this country. We are a "boiler plate" case, no question about it.

If they screw this up, we will be independent, it's as simple as that!

 

[gunfyter]

Voice of Reason, just to let you off the hook somewhat. I have been known to very anti-Teamster myself. This is not a matter of The Teamsters or ALPA or SWAPA. This is a matter of dutiful representation of our interests. !

This is true. I think we went at it once before on this board.

I am pro Teamster because thats what we are. I am for US.

 

[Voice Of Reason]

Lol...Oh, I get it noooowwww....

Voice of Reason, just to let you off the hook somewhat. I have been known to very anti-Teamster myself. This is not a matter of The Teamsters or ALPA or SWAPA. This is a matter of dutiful representation of our interests.

My belief is that The Teamsters better get this right, or they'll never represent a pilot group again in this country. We are a "boiler plate" case, no question about it.

If they screw this up, we will be independent, it's as simple as that!

....Okay, so I'm wrong until you decide to think that way too.... Interesting