SWA delays -800s till 2017

[Daddy]

Which merger? Airtran or dash 2?

 

[Skywest Pylot]

Nice. Very original

Just stating how I see it.

Oh please, do tell, a skywest pilot knowledgable on the SWA ETOP's certification.

I left SkyWest long ago and I am Intimately familiar with ETOPS. You've got a loooong ways to go.

For the record, I like SouthWest. Your pilots and employees are all very pleasant. I just think you are headed for trouble. GK is no HK.

 

[Lear70]

Think about it. The -800's are not suited well in SWA's route system for the domestic only flying (maybe a route here and there, but not overall). If the FAT guys cannot use them to fly "international", and if ETOPS is stalled for a year, why spend the $$ for an aircraft that is too big for the system? There's really no conspiracy here. Not to worry, when the merger is complete, they'll start coming. Until then, cash is king ....

^^^^^^ This. ^^^^^^

With the re-shuffle of AAI 737 flying to international destinations increasing throughout the rest of this year and next, they will have plenty of international flying at AAI to feed with the domestic 737 flying at SWA.

The big question mark here is the future of the 717. If they go away before 2015 and 737 deliveries are postponed, we will have an awful lot of people sitting around on reserve if GK's promise of no furloughs holds true.

The AAI vacancy/displacement section was completely replaced by the SLI flush bid, so if they move a pilot out of the 717, he goes to Southwest, NOT to AAI 737.

 

[Citrusflyer]

...
The big question mark here is the future of the 717. If they go away before 2015 and 737 deliveries are postponed, we will have an awful lot of people sitting around on reserve if GK's promise of no furloughs holds true.

My guess, either they have a plan to retain a majority of the 717's until a short time after 2015 ... or the first furloughs in SWA's history will occur by then ...

 

[Dan Roman]

You're right.

But giving away the jobs that fly those folks, 50% of your jobs, is whats wrong. It was you senior eating your junior.

Well not at my airline, but I know what you are saying. I think once DAL went higher than 50 seats the cat was out of the bag.
Obviously we weren't there, but I have to wonder if the reality facing the negotiators was the perception that the flying was going away no matter what. Allowing feed would create jobs, not cost them. What they may also have been facing, would be if they negotiated a lower rate for, say 76 seat A/C they would ultimately undermine the entire pay scale across the board.

I really don't know, I just know reality and public opinion are often 2 very different animals.

 

[Dan Roman]

My guess, either they have a plan to retain a majority of the 717's until a short time after 2015 ... or the first furloughs in SWA's history will occur by then ...

...I remember when DAL used to be the airline that had never furloughed. Hard to believe but it wasn't that long ago when DAL was the industry leader in employee relations.
We all live in glass houses.

 

[Citrusflyer]

...I remember when DAL used to be the airline that had never furloughed. Hard to believe but it wasn't that long ago when DAL was the industry leader in employee relations.
We all live in glass houses.

Yup. Math beats rhetoric 100% of the time.

 

[waveflyer]

THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT I AM WORRIED ABOUT! It may be AA or something else in the mix, hopefully it is something positive.

As old a pilot group as AA is, I'm less worried about them than I am us buying another younger company like jetblu- there would be so much movement in the next few years if we bought AA- it would just be tough to transition them to our culture-
I'm the one person who thinks its possible though

 

[Dan Roman]

As old a pilot group as AA is, I'm less worried about them than I am us buying another younger company like jetblu- there would be so much movement in the next few years if we bought AA- it would just be tough to transition them to our culture-
I'm the one person who thinks its possible though

Wave, you really think all those AA employees could become SWA "warriors"??
Really?

 

[waveflyer]

Don't you Dan??

 

[Dan Roman]

Don't you Dan??

I'd be pretty skeptical to say the least, you're right about whatever form AA ends up in after their reorganization they will have massive retirements and anyone junior will not be so for long.

 

[FlyinGuy]

I have a feeling that AA will not survive as a stand alone carrier. It is very possible that it will be sliced and diced among several players. How that plays out is anyone's guess. That being said, best of luck to all those at AA.

 

[texman]

As old a pilot group as AA is, I'm less worried about them than I am us buying another younger company like jetblu- there would be so much movement in the next few years if we bought AA- it would just be tough to transition them to our culture-
I'm the one person who thinks its possible though

Could you imagine. It would be crazy.

 

[waveflyer]

Could you imagine. It would be crazy.

Cheap uniform costs...

 

[texman]

Cheap uniform costs...

Yup, did you see the new DL rates on the other thread? Nice if true.

 

[General Lee]

I'd be pretty skeptical to say the least, you're right about whatever form AA ends up in after their reorganization they will have massive retirements and anyone junior will not be so for long.

If AA merges with USAir, do you know who will eventually win? The America West guys. The East pilots are mostly old, and the AA pilots have old Captains and a lot of old FOs. The AWA guys deserve it though, for all of the stuff they have had to put up with at USAir with USAPA etc.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[waveflyer]

Yup, did you see the new DL rates on the other thread? Nice if true.

Depends on scope. Believe me, I wish and will be so happy when delta resumes a solid lead on pay- but pay with bad scope is a place we've been before- that hurts wages in the long run as sold out pilots are more than willing to accept lower pay rates that are a step up-

Sell scope and mgmt knows whatever pay they offer will be a temporary raise as natural pressures emerge.

This is not to say I view scope in black and white terms- I don't- it simply must be controlled.