SWA bases and seniority

[easydoesit]

I will be pretty much be a junior FO at SWA when all this is said and done. How senior is the MCO base for FO's?

 

[jp1030]

The bottom couple of guys DOH Jan. 26 2011

 

[Capn Butthead]

The other thing with mco and seniority in general is that you can't use our current doh to determine that. We all forget that our current numbers are based on SWA aircraft only. We are adding almost 150 aircraft overnight. So that will lower seniorities for everything. And correct me if I am wrong (guilty of that often!) but your mco base is very small? You still overnight significant crews there? If we keep our present model with no layovers in bases the mco base will grow by 30% if not more based in the number of overnighting a/c aai has...I see the base growing by a lot! I am a 6 1/2 year fo in mco. I luv the base! You will also!

 

[Lear70]

With the average seniority loss, about half of our CA's can still hold MCO (it's a very senior CA base). 4 of our F/O's on the 737 could... on reserve. The rest of us can't hold it at all, myself included, I did the math yesterday.

Assuming most of us senior folk stay on the AAI side as long as possible to maximize the quality of life, when we transition to the SWA side and can bid bases, if there's an opening in MCO, about half our currently-MCO-based 737 F/O's (assuming 200-300 new-hires a year and planned attrition) can hold an MCO line. A very JUNIOR MCO line, but a line nonetheless. Another 25% of the existing MCO F/O's could hold reserve in MCO.

A few of us commute, most of our base lives there. We overnight 5-7 crews per night in MCO above the based pilots, some of those are 717 crews overnighting. Not sure how that will factor in, hopefully you're right in that it translates to a bigger base.

 

[elcid]

With all due respect, how does anyone know what line they'll be able to hold when they haven't seen the agreement yet?

That said, back before hiring stopped a junior buddy of mine was able to hold MCO quickly (like within a few months of starting at the bottom). He lived in Dallas and was trying to work his way up to living in base. He a month or two in OAK, maybe a month or two in PHX, then decided to go to MCO because he could hold a line there and give away trips and pick up out of DAL. So if growth happens, which they tell us it will, I wouldn't think it would be too hard to hold. Right now, in order, the junior bases are LAS, OKA, PHX. MCO is the next most junior, but it's a pretty close tie between MCO, MDW, DAL, BWI. Those figures come off of the SWAPA seniority snapshot for my seniority (5 yr, which is mid level). It might be slightly different at different seniority.

As far as reserve goes, I bid it all the time if it gives me weekday three days. If they use me, oh well, I get a weekday three day trip. If they don't, bonus. Sometimes you get hosed on reserve, but most times it's just a regular trip, and you get enough days where they don't use you to make up for it IMO.

 

[densoo]

1974 pilots and flight attendant in ops.

http://www.blogsouthwest.com/blog/flashback-fridays-our-first-dispatch-office

 

[Lear70]

With all due respect, how does anyone know what line they'll be able to hold when they haven't seen the agreement yet?

You're absolutely right, I was going off the AVERAGES of where we fall on the ISL that came out during the initial "information battle" inside our MEC and the CURRENT MCO domicile list that I have a copy of courtesy of a SWA buddy. It's only a rough guestimate, I should have mentioned that, but I was into my Scotch and it was late, sorry.

Of course, nothing's a given except our placement on the list; everything else in terms of the future is in flux. The base could become a huge Caribbean gateway within the next 2-3 years it takes to get everyone trained over and your reservation system able to handle the international flights and everyone would be holding lines by the time they cross over, you just never know.

The only certainty in aviation is change. Just trying to prepare for it...

 

[Daddy]

.... and your reservation system able to handle the international flights....

Now THERE'S the hard part

 

[Skyboy722]

Lear,

Would you mind explaining your math in regards to the MCO base? When it's all said and done, I really couldn't imagine the base being smaller than the sum of both crew bases (SWA/AT), so I'm not understanding why you don't think you'll hold it. Did I miss some info?

 

[chris69]

Something inside me thinks that 2 to 3 years from now we all may look back on this and scratch our collective heads as to why we all got so worked up about this; having had so much anxiety and stomach churning sleepless nights. At that point, it will be absolutely moot as to who came from where. In my vision of the future, the 1/2/3's flow freely, the new stews have passed the harness, uniform fit and isle walking tests adequately and we are overnighting in places only conceived of.

 

[Lear70]

Lear,

Would you mind explaining your math in regards to the MCO base? When it's all said and done, I really couldn't imagine the base being smaller than the sum of both crew bases (SWA/AT), so I'm not understanding why you don't think you'll hold it. Did I miss some info?

Actually, I shouldn't have posted last night since I was asked to "shut my howling screamer", so I'll have to apologize and defer that question until the full agreement is posted, as it relies on info that leaked during the "damage control" sessions that is no longer on our internal boards, is only partially-complete, and may or may not be accurate as the math I used is affected by a couple other pieces of data that we just don't know yet.

As others have said, the picture is incomplete and we don't need to theorize on what we do and don't have. Sorry I brought it up, my apologies. :0

Something inside me thinks that 2 to 3 years from now we all may look back on this and scratch our collective heads as to why we all got so worked up about this; having had so much anxiety and stomach churning sleepless nights. At that point, it will be absolutely moot as to who came from where. In my vision of the future, the 1/2/3's flow freely, the new stews have passed the harness, uniform fit and isle walking tests adequately and we are overnighting in places only conceived of.

You're probably right... :beer:

 

[Red Baron]

As others have said, the picture is incomplete and we don't need to theorize on what we do and don't have.


I think it is wise to do just that. It is a process that is going to take some time. I realize a lot is riding on it from both parties involved. Soon, we will all have the facts and can make our decision based on those, not perceptions or rumors.

RB

 

[bladeusa]

i was told that at swa the number of pilots on reserve is aprox 8%. -and then another 5% of blank lines on top of that. -i assume a blank line is like a build up line. -gets filled with trips left over, vacation drops etc. -and then if any remaining days are reserve?
does that all sound about right?

I saw a chart that shows DOH of the bottom pilot. but was trying to ballpark a guess on what it would take to be off reserve as an FO as well. (i realize the numbers will change as you hire this year as well as when/where they add AT 737's and crews to some or all of your current bases.)

Does anyone know the total current numbers of FO's in each base?
and aprox doh of bottom line holder? (8-13% up that list)
Thanks.

Base Hire date system seniority %
BWI 2/11 98.7
DAL 6/08 94.6
HOU 7/08 95.3
LAS 2/11 99.8
MCO 1/11 98.5
MDW 3/11 99.5
OAK 3/11 100
PHX 2/11 99.4

 

[SWA/FO]

HOU is our Ugliest base by far! :blush:

 

[SWA/FO]

Lear, when is your UNION going to give you the info.? I think we are getting close to seeing something, soon. Official, non rumor stuff.

 

[john cocktosen]

HOU is our Ugliest base by far! :blush:

i heard it was MDW. 3G's!!!!!!

 

[Red Baron]

i was told that at swa the number of pilots on reserve is aprox 8%. -and then another 5% of blank lines on top of that. -i assume a blank line is like a build up line. -gets filled with trips left over, vacation drops etc. -and then if any remaining days are reserve?
does that all sound about right?

I saw a chart that shows DOH of the bottom pilot. but was trying to ballpark a guess on what it would take to be off reserve as an FO as well. (i realize the numbers will change as you hire this year as well as when/where they add AT 737's and crews to some or all of your current bases.)

Does anyone know the total current numbers of FO's in each base?
and aprox doh of bottom line holder? (8-13% up that list)
Thanks.

Base Hire date system seniority %
BWI 2/11 98.7
DAL 6/08 94.6
HOU 7/08 95.3
LAS 2/11 99.8
MCO 1/11 98.5
MDW 3/11 99.5
OAK 3/11 100
PHX 2/11 99.4

Blade,
The blank lines are just what you have been told. I don't know if it is 5% of the total lines, but it sounds about right. Some of the blank lines will have no days of reserve.

As far as the total # of FO's in base as of August 11...
BWI 416 junior guy hired Jan '11
DAL 300 Jun '08
HOU 288 Jul '08
LAS 365 Feb '11
MCO 313 Jul '08
MDW 540 Jan '11
OAK 330 Mar '11
PHX 435 Feb '11

As far as figuring out line holder, I would say a safe bet is about 8% from bottom of list because some guys like bidding reserve in hope of not getting used. Some guys like the blank lines as well, so they don't necessarily follow seniority. Sorry I don't have specifics for you on the bottom line holders. Have a great weekend.

RB

PS...June '11 new hires not assigned to bases yet so these figures do not include them.

 

[Red Baron]

Oops, most junior guy in MCO hired in Jan. '11. Sorry for the typo.