Strobes?

[kmox29]

Just wondering...As I was holding short at night, the aircraft in position and hold sat there with strobes-a-flashin'. Is this common practice for many of you? I usually don't turn on strobes at night until takeoff clearance has been received. I think it's a common courtesy thing, but maybe I'm waaaaay off. Kinda sucks to sit there being flash blinded every .5 seconds or have to duck below the glareshield like I'm taking cover from an incoming round.

 

[mwmav8r01]

Company policy... On the runway strobes on... you will notice a lot of airlines crossign a runway will turn strobes on... Remember the E120 squashed by the 737 in LA?

Matt

 

[propsarebest]

Company policy... On the runway strobes on... you will notice a lot of airlines crossign a runway will turn strobes on... Remember the E120 squashed by the 737 in LA?

Matt

It was a SA227 (the meeeeetro)

 

[chperplt]

Company policy is to turn them on when we take are on an active runway. They may annoy, but they can save your life.

 

[mwmav8r01]

Thanks for the correction (what airline was it?). I was really young when it happened

 

[kmox29]

Right...I know it's company policy, but so might turing on landing lights when taxiing into position and hold, but if there is an aircraft positioned across the runway from you, most folks delay that item. I don't think one way is right and the other is wrong, just looking for opinions.

 

[AbOvo]

Some companies leave it up to captain discretion, including the one that got squashed. IIRC they were squashed on the takeoff roll so they probably had their strobes on.

I think UAL requires them to be on when taking the active.

 

[BlackPilot628]

When I was at Corpex we normally the strobes and landing lights off on the runway until cleared for T/O. All-though we always had on our Taxi light when in position. I think it was left up to the Capt's discretion!!

 

[PoorJetDriver]

It was US Air.

 

[chperplt]

they were squashed on the takeoff roll so they probably had their strobes on.

If you're still talking about the US Air and Skywest accident, they (SKYW) were not on the take off roll. They were in pos and hold...

The female controller that was kicked out of the military for mental problems forgot she put them there. She also thought they were at a different runway intersection and didn't realize she cleared another airplane to land on the same runway. At the same time, the SKYW crew didn't hear her clear the US Air 737 to land, nor did the US Air crew hear the SKYW crew make a few calls to the controller reminding her (didn't help) that they were pos and hold.. Sad story for all involved on many different levels.

 

[Z28_Pilot]

If you're still talking about the US Air and Skywest accident, they (SKYW) were not on the take off roll. They were in pos and hold...

The female controller that was kicked out of the military for mental problems forgot she put them there. She also thought they were at a different runway intersection and didn't realize she cleared another airplane to land on the same runway. At the same time, the SKYW crew didn't hear her clear the US Air 737 to land, nor did the US Air crew hear the SKYW crew make a few calls to the controller reminding her (didn't help) that they were pos and hold.. Sad story for all involved on many different levels.

I didn't think it was Skywest......was it?

 

[CRJDog]

I didn't think it was Skywest......was it?

Yes it was Skywest and USAir.

 

[airjackson]

If someone is holding short directly opposite from you as you TAKE THE RUNWAY, I would delay some of the forward facing lights, i.e landing and conspic lights. However, once I am in position, on an active runway, at night especially, you better believe I am WELL illuminated, and if that means you need to put the sunvisor down or look the other way, tough s--t.

 

[kmox29]

I made it a point to mention that I don't believe one way is better than another AirJackson. But thank you for your opinion. By the way the last comment "tough s**t" adds a real touch of class to your post.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

When the controller tells us to "position and hold, traffic on x mile final" I always start my timer and of course the TCAS is on. If there was a lost comm or blocked freq situation I wouldn't hesitate to taxi clear of the runway. Also I wouldn't accept a position and hold clearance from an intersection at night.

 

[Beechnut]

Then you'd never takeoff in O'Hare.... until sunrise anyway.

S.

 

[DirkkDiggler]

If the FAA is on board, they'd have something to say about you taking the runway without turning on your strobes. According to an FAA bulletin, one of their biggest issues during line checks is pilots not turning the strobes on the cross an active runway. Anytime you're on an active runway, you're supposed to have them on. They're really not that bright guys!

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Then you'd never takeoff in O'Hare.... until sunrise anyway.

S.

Point taken.

I am not familiar with ORD ops.

Back to the strobes issue. I'm a bit cautious at uncontrolled fields. I like to leave myself well illuminated whenever we cross a runway. Back taxiing is another time for good illumination. When we have to back taxi on the runway I always remain off centerline with the plane as well lit as possible. I think you're far more visible when you're off the centerline.

 

[TIGV]

Strobes on the active, all other lights after takeoff clearance received, taxi and strobes on when crossing an active runway.

I feel your pain, if holding short, number one I make sure I stay pointed down the taxiway fairly close to the grass so it requires a fairly tight cut to make the 90 degree turn to make the runway when takeoff clearance is received this cuts the strobe irritant to a minimum.

 

[Dodge]

My personal fav is the dorks taxing with their taxi light on all the f___ing time. Its real nice to have that Airbus or 757 taxi light right in your face when you're in a little Saab.

So, I now taxi with every light switch on. All the time. It's much safer for me, and that's all I care about.

 

[CptOver]

Hope the FAA doesn't bust me in the Avro. Strobes only come on weight off wheels. Come on, use some sense, turn on lights and be illuminated thats fine. But have some common courtesy for the aircraft that has to depart behind you
(with the starry spots still impairing their vision), and think a little about their safety and not just your own. Not to mention, if I am told to cross downfield and that the aircraft in position is holding, and you have you all lights/strobes lit, than I am assuming there was a screw-up in the clearance and you are rolling.


It takes about 15 to 20 minutes in low light levels to regain night vision.

 

[EagleRJ]

Then you'd never takeoff in O'Hare.... until sunrise anyway.


S.

Maybe one of the ATCers on here can tell for sure- I think it's no longer allowed to clear an aircraft into position and hold downfield at night. ORD has several waivers to the usual rules, since the runways used for takeoff are not the same used for landing, and the parallels are far enough apart the chances for confusion are reduced.

If you've never heard the ATC tape from the USAir/Skywest accident, it will make you wince. Link
It's always good to pay attention not only to ATC calls to your aircraft, but to other aircraft as well. This happened before the Metro was required to have TCAS, but if I was that crew, I'd be extremely nervous hearing another aircraft cleared to land on my runway as I was sitting there!

 

[BlackPilot628]

They did it in STL all the time. Pos and Hold and then cross down field clearing the Parallel at night.

 

[FlyChicaga]

Technically they still put people into position and hold at an intersection in EWR; however, the intersection is before a displaced threshold.