Staying in class B on a Vis app

[pilotdiscretion]

There are about a dozen airports around the country that have this problem. If memory serves me right ... DTW / SNA / PHL / LAS are on the list. ATL was on the list but the FAA did something crazy to fix the airspace when the new runway opened last year. CLT will be on the list when their new runway opens. I don't know where the plans are to correct their class B.

Changing a class B airspace is a very long process. You have to get through all of the environmental impact regulations then you have to go up against AOPA. These guys fight like wet cats to keep restrictive airspace like a class B from growing.

As several of you mentioned, you gotta stay sharp with the 10-1 charts to keep from getting violated by some disgruntled FAA guy.

 

[luv2fly]

So fly the GS 1 dot high....

And if the GS takes you out of the Bravo airspace....then the person that designed the ILS is an idiot.

I am not asking how to avoid flying below the class B, Duh!

I was just stirring discussion about compiling a list of suspect app/airports. Just for fun and informational purposes.

I agree that the people that designed some of the stuff we fly are idiots. My favorite are two degree heading changes on departures out of PHX. Or those non-prec stepdowns of 100'.

I find it funny that some 10-1 pages show the class B pictorial and it would be impossible to identify using conventional navaids. Most are dme arcs and radials, but some seem to defy those parameters.

 

[Jim Smyth]

It was rumored that back in the day some guys got violated for going below the Class B because they were still doing 250 kts. Its knida funny though. At MDW if your below the floor at O'hare and you slow the controller will ask you why you slowed. Or he will ask you to maintain the 250 kts. YMMV

 

[wscrj]

It was rumored that back in the day some guys got violated for going below the Class B because they were still doing 250 kts. Its knida funny though. At MDW if your below the floor at O'hare and you slow the controller will ask you why you slowed. Or he will ask you to maintain the 250 kts. YMMV

Been there, seen that. However, ATC cannot clear you to violate a FAR.

 

[SWA/FO]

Been there, seen that. However, ATC cannot clear you to violate a FAR.

Yeah, only YOU can choose which FAR to break.

 

[Mach 80]

The Class B airspace thing needs a complete re-do. You have very busy airports such as Midway that are under and not included in Class B and others such as HOU, that aren't any busier that are included.

At airports with Class B, I find myself not doing visuals as much as I otherwise would simply to let the controller worry about keeping me in Class B airspace rather than me.

 

[wscrj]

Yeah, only YOU can choose which FAR to break.

Well yeah, they have to give enough rope to hang yourself with, right?

 

[Nocturnal1]

Interesting thread, although this seems most appropriate for departures rather than arrivals since at most of these airports, approach is pretty directive with speeds. MDW is the first that comes to mind but I've never gone in there without being told what speed to fly. SRQ is interesting when you arrive from the north over/along TPA. When you land south, you go below TPA's Class B and the speeds apply (theoretically). Was bored one late night, the freq. was quiet, so I asked the TPA approach controller about it and after a long pause they said that it hadn't ever been discussed. We brought it up since you're typically at 250 kts. and then get the slam dunk as the last arrival. At ATL when the downwind gets very strung out, the controller will say that you're exiting class B airspace. What does this mean to me? Nada! I'm doin 180 kts or less (directed). Doesn't mean anything w/ wx either since we're IFR.

 

[Jim Smyth]

Been there, seen that. However, ATC cannot clear you to violate a FAR.

YMMV = Your Mileage May Vary

Its all how you play the game!

 

[Motown]

Been there, seen that. However, ATC cannot clear you to violate a FAR.

Isn't that what the "Unless otherwise authorized by ATC" is for?

91.131(a)(2) Unless otherwise authorized by ATC, each person operating a large turbine engine-powered airplane to or from a primary airport for which a Class B airspace area is designated must operate at or above the designated floors of the Class B airspace area while within the lateral limits of that area.
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