State Funeral

[Dubya]

>Who defeated the Soviet Union without firing a single shot?
>
>Let me know when you figure it out.

Two answers to your question:

#1. The Soviets defeated themselves. "Gorbbie" had to change, as the USSR downfall began in the 1960s with ridiculous defense spending and economic policies. Reagan or no Reagan, revolutions usually occur from within...and the Soviet capitalist revolution was no exception.

#2. During the Reagan administration we tended to give support to brutal murderous dictators rather than even think about Soviet influence. Whether it be Central America, Angola or Afghanistan we supported contras, the Mujahadeen (fundamentalists, who advocated an Islamic State)...it really didn't matter, as long as they weren't communists. Collectively, millions of people died, along with plenty of missionaries. Without firing a shot? Hardly. Go down to Central America one of these days get a "feel" for the opinion of Reagan...I guarantee you it won't be positive.

Hindsight is 20/20, but I'd take the USSR over fundamentalist Islam any day of the week.

Good actor, bad president.

data....why do you think the soviets maintained "ridiculous defense spending"? Apparantly you are one of those people who like to ignore most of the important factors behind the downfall of the USSR. Reagan demanded a military stance that forced the soviets to maintain their defense. Their economic hardship was a direct result of that military spending. Had we blinked during all of this and let our guard down...the USSR would have marched into the REST of Europe without so much as a shot fired. Reagan made sure that this wouldn't happen. Go do some research and look at the speeches Reagan gave at summits. Read some of the comments he made to the soviets. We supported fundamentalists not having any idea that they would morph into the terrorists they are today. Oh, and i'm devastated that a bunch of drug cartels and their militant supporters died in Central America. Boo hoo.

As far as wanting to be facing off with USSR instead of a bunch of sniveling cowards who don't have an organized, nuclear capable military standing at Europe's back door....what exactly is your logic there? Wait, I can answer that for you......you have no logic.

If it weren't for Ronald Reagan...the world map would be different. Our country would not be as strong as it is today....and you might very well be ordering your loaf of bread in Russian.

W

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

Well, Tony, I'm bummed these guys can't put their political leanings aside and just see an impressive event for what it was. Geez, at least let them get all the dirt in the grave before you resume your silly catfight...

 

[Dubya]

Hugh...you are right...your comment about Margaret Thatcher naked was so much more appropriate.

Your attempt to sound "above" all the partisanship is pretty lame. I paid my respects to Ron and I am simply responding to attacks on his character and his record.

Get over it.

W

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

Your attempt to sound "above" all the partisanship is pretty lame.

Not "above", BESIDE. There are plenty of other threads for you to spout partisan propaganda. For all you know, I agree with what you write, but you are on transmit-only. Take the argument elsewhere. The point of the thread was to acknowledge an impressive day of pomp and circumstance. Too bad you and others can't see that. Perhaps you might get over the attacks on a man who held office over 3 terms ago.

 

[FlyFlyFly]

The Freeing of Nicaraugua

we supported contras

Which in turn freed Nicaraugua from the Sandinistas, which imposed rule by force, and installed a representative democracy that is still in place today. So tell me what is bad about this datafox?

Just who in Central America has a poor opinion of Reagan? I have been travelling the area extensively for 20 years and have never heard an ill word spoken, except by American ex-pats. Your source of info for that statement is pretty suspect in my book.

 

[Flywrite]

I watched the service from the National Cathedral from a pilot's lounge and had to choke back a tear when former President Bush stumbled in his speech, choking back his own tears.

The whole day was incredibly moving, but the sunset funeral looking out over Simi Valley...well if there is such a thing as a perfect funeral, this was it.

Ronald Reagan made me proud to call the United States home and Lady Thatcher's words made me proud of the country of my birth.

 

[flexlrpilot357]

Datafox is either an troll or another liberal clown. In either case, his statements don't deserve the dignity of a reply.

 

[ArcticFlier]

Apologies

My apologies to anyone offended by my turning this into a 'partisan propaganda' (that's history; facts; at least that's what I call it) argument. I was all for keeping this for what it was, a back and forth about the service for Ronald Reagan. I'm sorry I feel compelled to straighten people out about the facts. If that's 'partisan propaganda' then so be it.

AF

 

[FN FAL]

Ronald Reagan, American
[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]1:53 PM 6/07/04[/font] [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]

[/font][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]

Former President Ronald Wilson Reagan, who died Saturday, embodied American conservatism. Yet Reagan's enduring legacy is much more bipartisan and moderate than generally acknowledged either by his supporters or detractors. <

He talked about slashing entitlements, but he also saved Social Security from insolvency with a $165 billion bailout. Reagan slowed federal growth but didn't slash it. A disciple of supply-side economic, he raised taxes - at least four times. His 1986 tax reform package is recalled now for accomplishing a genuine cut in individual income tax rates, but it was also a surprisingly progressive tax reform package. <

He sometimes flouted conservative ideology, always to his credit. For example, he dubbed the Soviet Union as the "Evil Empire" but somehow found a way to sit down and find common ground with the Soviets on arms control - against the advice of hardline advisors. <

In his heyday, Reagan was pilloried - and praised by some - as an anti-FDR as he tried to dismantle the welfare state. And in American history, he does stand up in comparison to Franklin Delano Roosevelt in terms of impact - and even more so in the mythology that rose up around the Great Communicator and his administration. <

Reagan's human rights policy may have applied mainly to the Soviet bloc, but look at the results. His words sustained the dissident movements that helped break up Reagan's "evil empire" and brought human rights into the lexicon of a conservative movement that at the time was more concerned about might than right. <

He was, at heart, not an ideologue but more of a dreamer. At one point during arms talks, Reagan and Mikhail Gorbachev came within a whisker of the unthinkable - eliminating both Soviet and American nuclear weapons programs - before more conventional thinkers carried the day. Ronald Reagan, peacenik. <

A potent combination of spirituality and sentiment made Reagan a sort of common-sense philosopher. His vice president (and successor) George H.W. Bush once described Reagan as "a true American hero and a prophet in his time." <

His vision and inspiring words carried weight around the globe like no president since those storied years. With his actor's cadence and delivery, he could unite or incite a nation with a well-delivered line. Upon his election, it was "it was "morning again in America." At his inaugural, he set the tone: "Government is not the solution to our problem. Government is the problem." In Berlin in 1987, he bluntly challenged Gorbachev to "tear down this wall." <

Appearing in 1986 after the Challenger explosion: "We will never forget them, nor the last time we saw them this morning, as they prepared for their journey and waved goodbye and 'slipped the surly bonds of earth to touch the face of God.'" <

Unforgettably, standing with D-Day veterans at Normandy in 1984: "And before me ... these are the boys of Pointe du Hoc. These are the men who took the cliffs. These are the champions who helped free a continent. These are the heroes who helped end a war. Gentlemen, I look at you and I think of the words of Stephen Spender's poem. You are men who in your lives fought for life ... and 'left the vivid air signed with your honor'." <

Whatever you think of his political legacy, Reagan's personal decency and unyielding dedication to simple principles provide a solid model for political life that is mostly unobserved, perhaps even disrespected, in today's Washington. For shame. <

Yet his very name still energizes Republicans who revere his impact and legacy. In a farewell television address at age 77, Reagan told us how he learned what it means to be an American: "We absorbed, almost in the air, a love of country and an appreciation of its institutions. If you didn't get these things from your family, you got them from the neighborhood, from the father down the street who fought in Korea or the family who lost someone at Anzio." <

Or from the man in the Oval Office. In the 1980s, Ronald Reagan taught Americans what it meant to be Americans. <

Reagan's long and remarkable life - as actor, politician, president - faded to black Saturday, but his words still carry us onward. Nine years ago, Reagan issued a handwritten letter to "My Fellow Americans" revealing that he had been diagnosed with Alzheimer's disease. < "When the Lord calls me home, whenever that may be," he wrote, "I will face it with the greatest love for this country of ours, and eternal optimism for the future ... I know that for America there will always be a bright dawn ahead."[/font]

.........

 

[ArcticFlier]

"Hindsight is 20/20, but I'd take the USSR over fundamentalist Islam any day of the week."

You're kidding, right? What, inherently is wrong with Islam? You attach the word 'fundamentalist' to it. To me, that is just another way of saying 'true blue' or 'dyed in the wool'. It just means that they believe what they believe. By your definition, you are indicting most, if not all, of the population of Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon...........I think you get the point and it couldn't be farther from the truth. What you are afraid of is a handful of 'militants' that have misappropriated a religion for their own personal agenda. I'll take them over a bunch of nukes pointed at me any day.

AF