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[310Driver]

I had a guy ask me today about purchasing an airplane and getting me to fly it for him today. My problem is his price range is going to fall in the piston twin range to possible kingair 90 range and I was just wondering what you guys thought along the lines of a corporate piston twin what would be the best suitable canidate? I have lots of 310 time but as you guys know it can be rather loud are any of the other ones any better?

Navajo?
Baron?
Duke?

I thought about a 421 but I have herd there kinda expensive to keep up.

 

[Rick1128]

Stay away from 400 series. There is a wing demate requirement that is very expensive. I know we have 4 421s. A Duke is not a real good choice. Look at this person's travel requirements first. Way too many first time buyers set a fixed purchase price without knowing what their travel requirements really are. And having not enough airplane hurts as much or more than having too much airplane. So keep that in mind. Personally I prefer a Navajo in the piston line. A straight Navajo (-310) or a CR (-325) are better options than the Chieftain. They are less expensive and a majority of the Chieftains are high time charter buckets.

On the T/P side, beware of early 90s. Many have their engines on the MORE program. It is a TBO extension program. PWC will not look at a MORE engine. It is my understanding that the engine is basicly a throw away engine when it is finally done. I wouldn't go with anything earlier than a B model. Also look at straight Cheyennes and Cheyenne Is. And stay the !!!! away from MU2s. They are cheap, but insurance requirements are a major bear and expensive.

 

[KINGAIR PIC]

I can also vouch for the Navajo's myself. But I on the other hand like the Chieftains, because they are not as underpowered as the 310's or 325's. They are great aircraft if you're going to be carrying a lot of people.

The Baron's are also great aircraft. But they are fairly expensive to purchase and maintain if something breaks (remember it's a Beechcraft).

 

[celloman]

I would only know about Cessna

Yes the 400 series have a big inspection that is coming. I also know that spar caps have to be put on some of them. We have completed 2 414's so far. I am not sure if the 340 is going to need it as well. If not, the 340 wouldn’t be a bad choice.

 

[310Driver]

Thanks guys!

 

[Desiday]

Just wondering on the same level as the last question, but I'd like to know about jet aircraft, purchase prices, operating costs, etc.
Thanks.

 

[Rick1128]

A straight -310 without wing lockers is a good performer. Biggest issue I have with a Chieftain is that the only ones I see on the market right now are all very high time charter buckets.

And I would stay away from a Chieftain with the Panther mod on it. I used to fly one. After the mod it flew worst than before the mod. The C or CR benifit from the additional power.

 

[P3-Adub]

Aerostar ??? Pressurized, fast, small, noisy, pilot's airplane to fly ?? Anyway, don't discount other choices, 340s are quiet but have little useful load. P baron, Baron 58TC, Commander 500B, ??? MU2 ? Pilot's ability ? Cheyene ? A90 King Air, the possibilities are endless. Ask questions like how much do you want to spend on maintenance, insurance, training, cost per hour for fuel ete... Pilot pay ???? Is the owner also a pilot ?

Any idea of where and when the guy needs to travel ? Mountains, Icing, Range, Payload, ete...... Some of the suggested aircraft are better suited for some missions than others.

Good luck to you ! Hope it works out for some more multi hours in the logbook !!!

 

[Conquest Driver]

414 RAM VII

I used to fly a 414 with a RAM VII conversion. It has one locker tank and holds 160 gallons of fuel, which is good for about 3 hours and an hour of reserve. (about 500 nat miles) The neat thing about it is it now has a useful load of 2,200 lbs or 1,200lbs with full fuel. You can fill all six seats and take full fuel and luggage. The extra 25 ponies a side makes a large differnece is both climb and cruise (it added about 20 knots). I know there was a NPRM about the wing inspection but has it become a rule yet? A few years ago the FAA issued an AD about the exhaust system but it was not nearly as expensive as the NPRM intially was indicating. I would suspect the same might happen here. Please tell me if I am way off base here.


If you wanted to go really crazy you could buy a 441. It has a 1700NM IFR range and cruises at 300 KTAS with the -10 conversion. I usually fly between FL290 and FL270 on a typical trip. It can climb up to FL350 but I usually only go that high to get over weather. Just a thought


CD

 

[banned username 2]

Re: 414 RAM VII

I used to fly a 414 with a RAM VII conversion. It has one locker tank and holds 160 gallons of fuel, which is good for about 3 hours and an hour of reserve. (about 500 nat miles) The neat thing about it is it now has a useful load of 2,200 lbs or 1,200lbs with full fuel. You can fill all six seats and take full fuel and luggage. The extra 25 ponies a side makes a large differnece is both climb and cruise (it added about 20 knots). I

Its been a LONG time, but I thought the C-414 was closer to a 5 hour airplane. I thought it carried about 1200 lbs of fuel and burned about 200 lbs/hr (total)... Of course this was a C-414A...

I flew a Liquid Cooled C-414A (350 HP) and I think the Ram VII (335 HP) is probably a better deal, the liquid cooled one was heavy and kinda doggy... Plus when you get out and see green fluid on the ground under the engine you end up riding home on the airlines...

 

[Conquest Driver]

Tip tanked 414

This one was a tip tanked 414. With the 335 HP Ram VII engines running at 65% to 75% the airplane tends to be a little more thirsty then the stock version. We typically burned about 40 to 45 Gallons per hour which if I do the math right is about 250 pounds an hour. Like I said we only had one locker tank so we only could carry 160 gallons or about 995 lbs. However the engines gave us very little trouble and with the larger A model nose bowl cowling we installed the engines ran very cool. 425 in climb and 375-400 in cruise with cowl flaps closed and the engines leaned properly.

I have often wondered about the liquid cooling and why that mod never caught on. Were their lots of problems with it? It sounded like from what you said that their were.

 

[banned username 2]

I only flew one liquid cooled C-414A, and that only for about 25 hours or so... I wasn't impressed... Not too sure about further problems they had (I flew with an owner/operator until he was comfortable and the insurance req. were satisfied)... I don't think they kept that plane very long.

I think a good C-414A with the RAM VII (335 HP air cooled) would be the way to go. The C-414A was a nice plane, just needed more power, which the RAM VII gives it. Also I would add the Vortex Generator kit to the plane, I would imagine the RAM mod probably does that too...

 

[jergar999]

The 414 is a great airplane. Stay away from 421s, they hate engines and kill them any chance they get. Remember, a hump in the cowling means quitting time.