Squinting on the flight physical

[sheep44]

Here's the deal, I am scared to death about taking the flight physical because of my eyesight. I'm about 20/80-20/90, but if I squint just a bit, I can get down to 20/30-20/40. I have heard both that it is not allowed and "I did it, and it was just fine." My refractive error is within limits. Corrected and near vision is just fine. Does anyone have more details on this? Has anyone done it and passed?

Thanks.

 

[chawbein]

Squinting

You are not supposed to squint, but let me say that it doesn't matter on the big vision question. When you take the vision test on the machine they test on near vision and depth perception and some other stuff. If you are thinking about your refractive error (the correction necessary to make you see 20/20), that is determined by cyclopegic refraction. They numb the muscles in your eyes so that they cannot focus, and no amount of squinting will help. Just some food for thought.

My advice is to just go with it. You can't change your vision without surgery (expensive and a waiver is necessary) or doing something like the see clearly method (minimal improvement at best).

For more information, I suggest you go to this forum on Baseops.net

http://www.dynamictruth.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum;f=3 .

I would do a search on vision or waivers or PRK. There is lot's of good info there.

 

[weekendwarrior]

Here is the problem with that. They diolate your eyes for another test. Cyclorefractive something or another. They put a viewing device in front of you and change these filters. Your pupils are extremely diolated at this point, and you can't cheat. I asked the doc why they do this, and he specifically told me, "It so people don't cheat on the eye test"

If you don't have 20/50 correctable to 20/20, (Army standards anyway) then you won't pass with the new test. I have 20/20, but was told by the test that I have slight astigmatism and might go worse as I get older! They can tell simply by the shape of your eye with this test.

 

[sheep44]

Hey thanks for the info. That is pretty much what I had thought.

This is what I understand the eye portion to be:

First they have you look into some kind of box device, right? That is for distant vision? Then they numb your eyes and the doctor looks at them to measure your refraction. Is that kind of how it works??

Thanks for the help, hey Chawbein, aren't you off to UPT soon?

 

[weekendwarrior]

Yeah, there is a test like that, but they also numb and diolate as well. When they diolate your eyes, you can't see sh!t, so it's kind of funny that they can tell how well you can see when you can't see!

They did a map of my eye, the glaucoma test where they put that annoying puff of air in your eye, and all kinds of stuff. Yet, there are older pilots out there with 20/200 and glasses that are flying. They just make the initial tough to make sure you eyes aren't going to go too bad to quick I guess!

 

[sheep44]

So then not only do you have to read the chart with your eyes un-numb, but also after they put the numbing junk in there?

 

[weekendwarrior]

They have special machine that they put up to your eye that puts different filters in front of your eye to help the image to appear in focus. He say, "is this in focus?" "how about this one" Based on your responses, they can tell the condition of your eye, because the variable of you straining is gone.

 

[chawbein]

Here's the jist of how the eye portion of my exam went:

1. Give the guy my glasses so that he could read them.
2. Look into the OVT machine and test near vision, distant vision, and depth perception (those circles DO suck).
3. Test accomodation in each eye.
4. Do the red lens test for night vision
5. Puff of air for glaucoma
6. Sit in the chair and get the drops that numb and dialate your eyes (they are way strong, and last for HOURS)
7. Wait 15-30 minutes for the dilation to take effect.
8. Sit in the chair (just like at the eye doctor's) and they put the big plate over your face. Then he asks you to read a line and if you can't he adjusts it until you can just barely. Then he adds correction until you can read the 20/20 line. It's just like going to the eye doctor.

I have a sponsorship and am going up to the September reserve board as long as my medical gets approved. I'm about a year off from going to UPT.

 

[mudkow60]

I failed to meet pilot standards on the first precom physical, and asked for a new one while on my Midshipman cruise. I somehow pass that one...

I squinted thru my test at NOMI. The dock said that I failed, but to come back tomorow for a retest. I did, and squinted my ass off. I read the 20/30 line, but not by much. He asked what sports I played in High School and I said Football and Track. Odd I thought. The doc then said he was gonna' pass me, but if he ever heard that I was flying without my glasses, he would ground my ass. Go figure.

During all this, I was doing what were called 'Eye Exercises'. Don't know if it worked or not, but the results worked fine. Ask around.

Good luck, and PM me if you have any more questions or need advice.

 

[rumorhasit]

is there a test where they can determine if you have corrective surgery or not...I have a friend who is looking to go the mil route who had the lasik who is afraid of getting a waiver...

 

[chawbein]

The Air Force does not allow LASIK for fliers. The only corrective surgery you can have is PRK. If they can't tell in the initial physical (which they probably won't) then they absolutely CAN tell when you have to go to Brooks AFB for additional flight screening (MFS is right before UPT). They do an eye topography that looks for keratoconus and also will easily show if someone had eye surgery. Your friend could potentially get into some trouble for lieing on his medical forms as well as being barred from flying in the AF.

 

[weekendwarrior]

On my eye exam there is a section that says "No evidence of RK or Surgery". I wouldn't mess with it, they can tell if you have had it.

 

[sheep44]

Thanks all for the help and info. I am trying the eye excercise thing, and it does seem to work, albeit very very slowly, so we'll see what happens.


Thanks again.

 

[414Flyer]

I have heard of people using Orthokerotology rigid contact lenses to for a flight physical.

You dont wear it into the physical, but wear it at night and supposedly the eye will retain the shape of the eye during the day

 

[Pistlpetet]

During the last couple of flight physicals I had before leaving the military last year, they had me look into this new computer operated machine. No drops or anything. With in about 30 seconds this machine would determine every imperfection with your eyes. I have perfect vision, and this machine said I had a slight astigmatism in one eye. Nobody's eyes are perfect, all are a little off. I was amazed how quickly this machine could tell all. Definately high tech.

But just go for it, the worst they can do is say Sorry.

Personally I think if any standard should be maintained, it should be vision. It is hard enough for a guy with perfect vision to operate under NVGs or FLIR, let alone someone who is lacking. These are also the guys who will be flying formation with you, and can kill you.

Pete

 

[THT]

During the last couple of flight physicals I had before leaving the military last year, they had me look into this new computer operated machine. No drops or anything. With in about 30 seconds this machine would determine every imperfection with your eyes. I have perfect vision, and this machine said I had a slight astigmatism in one eye. Nobody's eyes are perfect, all are a little off. I was amazed how quickly this machine could tell all. Definately high tech.

But just go for it, the worst they can do is say Sorry.

Personally I think if any standard should be maintained, it should be vision. It is hard enough for a guy with perfect vision to operate under NVGs or FLIR, let alone someone who is lacking. These are also the guys who will be flying formation with you, and can kill you.

Pete

I have to agree with this. So many people are trying to beat the system. The standards are there for a reason, and it's safety of flight. I don't want to be flying form with someone who cheated his way through the tests and can't aquire my aircraft from 2000 feet for a rejoin.

 

[Big Duke Six]

THT - I highly doubt ANYONE would get to the point of doing formation work and not have glasses on if they weren't 20/20. Once you get past the first physical, getting glasses is no big deal. Only a moron would try to go through UPT with marginal vision, so your example is pretty weak.

FWIW, in my UPT class, I would guess about 40% of the guys were wearing glasses on the first day of Academics. I didn't take a survey to see who had vision waivers to pass their initial flight physical, but I do know it was very difficult to get vision waivers back then. I could imagine that 1 or 2 may have had waivers, but certainly not all 10. Yet, there they were, first day of UPT, wearing glasses. Hmmm. One of them went on to be the Distinguished Grad of the class and got an F-16.

My 2 cents - If you think about it, I think you're safer flying form with a guy wearing glasses (who you thus KNOW is seeing at least 20/20, maybe better) than a guy who, for all you know, squinted through his tests and doesn't have the nerve later to say "Hey, I think all this studying is finally getting to me, and I think I need a pair of glasses".

Get through the tests if you can, then be smart and get glasses at flight screening or UPT.

 

[sheep44]

I think that's some good advice. I know that I have to wear glasses. That's just the way it is going to be for me. Fortunately, my corrected vision is 20/20 at least and maybe a bit better. Uncorrected? Well, that's going to be a close one, but I'll just have to cross that bridge when I get there.

Thanks everyone for the replies, I really appreciate it.

 

[satpak77]

circles test

I took that once in college for some sort of sports physical and I didn't get all the circles, I told the doc it "just aint happening". I recall some floated, some did not. Or maybe vice versa

however I managed to catch footballs, make a few baskets, etc with no problems

oh yeah, I fly in real life

I don't think that test in-and-of-itself is a deal breaker, but I am not a flight surgeon nor do I sit on the FAA Medical committee. I do hold Class 1 and have for 17 years however, never had this issue come up

good luck to you

 

[Pistlpetet]

Big Duke,

Let's agree the initial Military flight physical is an Anal Process (No pun intended). The military will dis-Qualify a guy for the most obscure reasons, maybe some bad blood chemistry, maybe a past injury, maybe for being unconscious for too long at one point. Some of which probably will not cause a guy to be a bad pilot, or a flight safety risk.

What I think Myself and THT would like to imply, is that if the military is going to be so anal about certain issues, the most glaring and important asset to a pilot, his vision, should not be watered down.

Just because you had a bunch of guys sitting in your flight class with glasses, does not mean it is the best way to do business, or for that matter is right. That is just how the system has become weakened by the lowering of ALL standards, to be kinder and gentler. That is another whole other HUGE discussion.

Bottom line is that a guy has less eye issues who has 20/20. He does get junk caught between his contact, and he does not get distortion, glare, etc from looking thru numerous lenses. I know I have been in situations at night where I wish I had better vision, and I already do.

I have a lot of friends with bad vision flying, and they are great pilots. We are just trying to stand up for some principals, and understand the glaring inconsistencies in the whole process. The world is not perfect, and neither is the system.

Pete