Southwest is a PFT'er.

[texman]

I am a life long member of the PFT'ers. It's is a long list at all 91,91K,135,121,125 operators. My brothers and I are proud of are accomplishments.LOL

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Funny how you NEED those tickets to get the FAA minimum to get hired at an airline....you don't need a TYPE RATING to get hired at an airline.....except at SWA.....just because.

It's stupid and pointless and "an investment?"....sure, if that is what makes you happy.

 

[rajflyboy]

Didn't all civilians pay for a:

Private
Instrument
Commercial
Multi-engine
CFI
CFII
ATP (most)

ratings to qualify for any position as an airline pilot?

The few people who consistently look at this PFT issue are obviously grabbing at something that they have done themselves. To those irrational people, this is called being a

H..Y..P..O..C..R..I..T..E..

Not true at all.

Those are the guys that actually were man enough to pay for their own training and not use the taxpayers as saps.

Also these are the guys that can fly IFR in nasty weather better than anyone on the planet. Airline pilots fly IFR last I checked.

 

[Jim Smyth]

The type rating requirement shows a potential Pilot's ability to "REALLY WANT" to work for Southwest Airlines. That's what most people on the outside don't understand. We all know you can train a monkey to fly an airplane (I am living proof) but they are looking for people in all positions to go above and beyond whats required for any job within the company. They are looking for leaders and over achievers. You can either accept this or disregard it, your call.

 

[Tripower455]

I just completed 15 years of service at WN, and have never paid a dime for any training nor ever heard of anyone paying for any training. In fact, I've been PAID for every bit of training I've had at WN.

I'm not sure where this is coming from, or why some of you geniuses continue to bring it up so often on here, but WN is no more of a PFT outfit than any other airline.

That's the facts.

 

[Ty Webb]

Pay for Training (PFT) is not the same thing as earning your ratings, or getting a type rating, which is "portable" from one airline to the next. It is paying the airline or reimbursing the airline for the expense they incur when they provide the FAA-mandated training (Indoc and Initial Qualification on type).

Some companies that were PFT in the 1990's included Comair, ASA, COEX and others, and they charged the pilots between $6,000. and $12,000. for the "privilege" of going through newhire training.

 

[FlyinGuy]

Paid cash for mine.....now I have the greatest airline job I could ever ask for. PFT? Call it what ever you want.

 

[Ty Webb]

Just for clarification, SWA is not PFT. SWA does not charge pilots for their SIM training, which is what the PFT companies do (or did).

Valujet, on the other hand, did require PFT, although that ended before they merged with AirTran. . . . You'd have to ask one of those guys about it, that was way before my time. Probably only 10% of current AAI pilots were hired during the Valujet days.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Yeah but you had to pay to be type rated......NO OTHER AIRLINE DOES THIS. that's what you guys don't understand. You just shrug your shoulders and think it's ok to let a PROFITABLE company put this on you.

I didn't need to be typed in the airplane to get hired where I am at.....then again, I'm not stuck on the same plane and same routes for my whole career.

Jim had the best rational discussion in this thread and he gets it.....that's a legitimate argument but some of you should tell Gary, enough is enough.....it's an outdated model as if you were still banging around the Texas Triangle just cutting your teeth. Then again....VNAV and Autothrottles are new there so I wouldn't expect much in the way of quick change.

 

[Tripower455]

Yeah but you had to pay to be type rated......NO OTHER AIRLINE DOES THIS. that's what you guys don't understand.

It's a hiring requirement. If you don't meet it, you don't get hired. I don't and have never agreed with it, but I certainly don't regret meeting that requirement. When NO one else was hiring in the early to mid '90's, SWA was hiring like gangbusters. It's by far the best investment I've ever made in my career and it's been paid back for about 14 years now. I make what my type cost in less than 6 working days now. My only regret is that I didn't do it a year or 2 sooner. Sure, I could've waited another year or 2 for the economy to get better in the mid '90s, (all the while making poverty level wages at DHL after my last commuter went T.U.), and then gone to DAL, UAL, AA, CAL etc., or I could have PFT at Valujet, or some of the other "invest in the company for your job" schemes (not a chance). I shudder when I think that I almost didn't get the type because I didn't want to spend the cash.

FWIW, I don't even know (or care) who you work for, because I wouldn't trade places with you.

You just shrug your shoulders and think it's ok to let a PROFITABLE company put this on you.

You're right, I don't care. My paycheck and QOL are and have been so much better than it would've been had I not gotten the type.

I didn't need to be typed in the airplane to get hired where I am at.....then again, I'm not stuck on the same plane and same routes for my whole career.

Awesome.... I didn't need to be typed at any of the other airlines I worked for either. I wouldn't go back to any of them.

Enjoy your choice. I'm loving mine.

Jim had the best rational discussion in this thread and he gets it.....that's a legitimate argument but some of you should tell Gary, enough is enough.....it's an outdated model as if you were still banging around the Texas Triangle just cutting your teeth. Then again....VNAV and Autothrottles are new there so I wouldn't expect much in the way of quick change.

Actually, I discussed this with Gary in December during his lounge visit, and mentioned that in the spirit of "fair and equitable", that the trannies be required to be typed before the SLI. He thought it was a great idea!

You do what you need to do for your career. Criticizing other's choices says a lot more about you than it does about the ones being criticized.

You know how many times I took the friggin FE written, because it was a hiring requirement? Complete waste of time, effort and money, but you do what you gotta do.

FWIW, I've got 5 type ratings, and I paid for one of them out of my pocket (not a dime of which went to WN). Which one do you think has served me best?

You make your choices and live with them. I am fine with mine.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Not really Tripower

I used my FE ticket flying planes other than a 737......so not a waste....

Maybe to you, but that written cost me the price of a meal. Not a couple of mortgage payments like your type rating.

You are right.....I wouldn't trade places with you either.

 

[say again]

Bill, give it a rest because now you just sound foolish. Do you understand what PFT is? Seriously. Did the pilot pay SWA for their sim training? No. Did they pay SWA anything for any of their training? No. I don't understand why it's so damn hard for people to understand this.

 

[Sy-bill]

If every airline required PFT, would this be an issue?

Some head hunters charge many thousands of dollars finding jobs for some.

I don't get the heartburn. We all have choices.

 

[Kharma Police]

It's a hiring requirement. If you don't meet it, you don't get hired. I don't and have never agreed with it, but I certainly don't regret meeting that requirement. When NO one else was hiring in the early to mid '90's, SWA was hiring like gangbusters. It's by far the best investment I've ever made in my career and it's been paid back for about 14 years now. I make what my type cost in less than 6 working days now. My only regret is that I didn't do it a year or 2 sooner. Sure, I could've waited another year or 2 for the economy to get better in the mid '90s, (all the while making poverty level wages at DHL after my last commuter went T.U.), and then gone to DAL, UAL, AA, CAL etc., or I could have PFT at Valujet, or some of the other "invest in the company for your job" schemes (not a chance). I shudder when I think that I almost didn't get the type because I didn't want to spend the cash.

FWIW, I don't even know (or care) who you work for, because I wouldn't trade places with you.





You're right, I don't care. My paycheck and QOL are and have been so much better than it would've been had I not gotten the type.



Awesome.... I didn't need to be typed at any of the other airlines I worked for either. I wouldn't go back to any of them.

Enjoy your choice. I'm loving mine.



Actually, I discussed this with Gary in December during his lounge visit, and mentioned that in the spirit of "fair and equitable", that the trannies be required to be typed before the SLI. He thought it was a great idea!

You do what you need to do for your career. Criticizing other's choices says a lot more about you than it does about the ones being criticized.

You know how many times I took the friggin FE written, because it was a hiring requirement? Complete waste of time, effort and money, but you do what you gotta do.

FWIW, I've got 5 type ratings, and I paid for one of them out of my pocket (not a dime of which went to WN). Which one do you think has served me best?

You make your choices and live with them. I am fine with mine.

If you guys are so content about your decision with regards to the 737 type then why do you feel the need to constantly defend it? I personally could care less if you did, it's your choice.

 

[Tripower455]

Not really Tripower

I used my FE ticket flying planes other than a 737......so not a waste....

Maybe to you, but that written cost me the price of a meal. Not a couple of mortgage payments like your type rating.

You are right.....I wouldn't trade places with you either.

Those " couple of mortgage payments" have paid off handsomely in my case. Care to bet who's banked more money and more time off in the last 15 years?