Southwest Airlines Pilot Takes Evasive Action to Avoid Collision, 2 Injured

[DieselDragRacer]

:beer:



BURBANK, Calif. — The Federal Aviation Administration says two flight attendants were injured when a Southwest Airlines pilot took sudden evasive action to avoid a collision with a private plane near Burbank over the weekend.

FAA spokesman Ian Gregor said Tuesday the pilot of Southwest Flight 2534 from Las Vegas got an automated alert because it was briefly on a collision course with another aircraft. The plane was flying at about 6,000 feet Saturday about 20 miles away from Bob Hope Airport.


Gregor says the Southwest pilot made some sudden maneuvers to avoid the other plane, which was about two miles away. He says one Southwest flight attendant suffered a broken shoulder, the other was bruised.
The FAA and National Transportation Safety Board are investigating the incident.

 

[GuppyWN]

It's not a mayday. Just follow the guidance cues.

Gup

 

[airlinepilot]

how often below 10,000' do you hear mice in the kitchen?

 

[Mach 80]

I wasn't there so maybe his situation was somehow different, but I've had a couple of RA's and never had to manuever the plane abruptly to comply. Not much different than a normal climb or descent.

 

[Quiet Flight]

Capt's line is restricted. Go figure... I was just wondering if there were any "LM" blocks on it.

 

[BLUE BAYOU]

I'm surprised there aren't more incidents like this in Southern California. We get hundreds of RAs alone going into LGB and BUR (near Van Nuys). Bug smashers are dangerous in this region, remember Cerritos mid-air?

 

[learherkjay]

Capt's line is restricted. Go figure... I was just wondering if there were any "LM" blocks on it.

Wow, classy post. Nice Monday Morning QBing, and a nice show of respect for a fellow company pilot.

 

[Colonel Savage]

Capt's line is restricted. Go figure... I was just wondering if there were any "LM" blocks on it.

What are "LM" blocks?

 

[BigMotorToter]

I'm pretty sure RA's are designed to give you guidance that won't exceed 1G. I used to work for a foreign carrier that would have us do repeated RA maneuvers in the sim so that we would not pull more than 1.25G's. It was really amazing to me how little you had to push or pull the yolk to comply with the green band on the TCAS panel.

Some gouge they taught us:

1 degree pitch at .80 mach = 800 ft./minute
" .70 mach = 700 ft./minute
" .60 mach = 600 ft./minute

etc... so to get into the green band on a RA you rarely have to exceed 1000 feet/minute, which equates to just about 1 - 2 degree's pitch change. Not much.

Admitedly, until I did this over and over again, I just asumed an RA was an "agressive" maneuver. Well it isn't.

That being said, I wasn't there and everyone lived to fly again, so that is ultimately a good thing.

 

[MILPILOT17]

Wow, classy post. Nice Monday Morning QBing, and a nice show of respect for a fellow company pilot.

You are 100% correct!

 

[ALSF 2]

I'm sorry... After quiet flight's post, I'm not sure what we are talking about....




btw, they're real..... and they're spectacular!

 

[Dan Roman]

Wow, classy post. Nice Monday Morning QBing, and a nice show of respect for a fellow company pilot.

Good post, but don't limit it to fellow COMPANY pilot. He is a fellow pilot and we weren't there. I'm guessing he had a good reason for the level of evasive action and if he did over it do it, so what, none of us are perfect and it could happen to anyone. I would like to see how the finger pointers would react if they see a small airplane that appears on an immediate collision course and see how quick they react. I'm guessing any of us would have done the same thing.

 

[RedDogC130]

Capt's line is restricted. Go figure... I was just wondering if there were any "LM" blocks on it.

your a jealous reject based on that comment

 

[SuperFLUF]

Based on the numerous cabin crew injuries that occour with TCAS RA's, it appears that most, if not all, major airlines do an inadequate job of training their pilots on how to react to RA's.
Just telling someone its a 1G manuver vs practing, uplanned, startleing events are quite different.
Its just sad that these needless injuries continue to occour.
If the report is correct, the aircraft never got closer than 2 miles and now a flight attendant has a broken back.

 

[bmxandjets]

I wasn't there so maybe his situation was somehow different, but I've had a couple of RA's and never had to manuever the plane abruptly to comply. Not much different than a normal climb or descent.

and hopefully you will never have to..

 

[General Lee]

It's not a mayday. Just follow the guidance cues.

Gup

Wasn't Kevin Smith also going to BUR? Just think, had he been on that same plane, his extra weight may have caused more of a lag in the evasive maneuver, and the 737 may have hit that other plane! So, what should corpulent people do from now on? Buy 1st class seats on legacies, they have larger seats. Instead of going OAK to BUR, Smith should have taken the bridge over to SFO and flown AA or UA to LAX. It would have been more comfortable, indeed.

Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[MILPILOT17]

Wasn't Kevin Smith also going to BUR? Just think, had he been on that same plane, his extra weight may have caused more of a lag in the evasive maneuver, and the 737 may have hit that other plane! Thank gawd SWA hates FAT people. What do FAT people do on Legacy Airlines? They buy a first class seat, that is larger. Oh well.

Bye Bye---General Lee

When will those first class seats yield a profit?

 

[igneousy2]

Based on the numerous cabin crew injuries that occour with TCAS RA's, it appears that most, if not all, major airlines do an inadequate job of training their pilots on how to react to RA's.
Just telling someone its a 1G manuver vs practing, uplanned, startleing events are quite different.
Its just sad that these needless injuries continue to occour.
If the report is correct, the aircraft never got closer than 2 miles and now a flight attendant has a broken back.

Okay...even the sensationalizing media isn't saying she had a broken back.

Nothing i've read says they "never got closer than 2 miles"...and besides, even if that statement is true you would have to say...In spite of the Captains actions the airplanes closed to within 2 miles. Sorry but even 2 miles is too close when nobody is sure whats going on.

Training departments need to react very carefully or we will end up killing hundreds of people due to the under-reaction of pilots to save a few flight attendant shoulders. The answer should be to sit the flight attendants down sooner, there is absolutely no reason why any flight attendant should be up within 50 miles of the destination...20 miles out is ridicules. Being up 20 miles out, especially going into Burbank where the chance of getting a turbulence upset or an RA are very high even on an average day is dangerous.

 

[GuppyWN]

Wasn't Kevin Smith also going to BUR? Just think, had he been on that same plane, his extra weight may have caused more of a lag in the evasive maneuver, and the 737 may have hit that other plane! So, what should corpulent people do from now on? Buy 1st class seats on legacies, they have larger seats. Instead of going OAK to BUR, Smith should have taken the bridge over to SFO and flown AA or UA to LAX. It would have been more comfortable, indeed.

Bye Bye---General Lee

Dude. Sometimes you twist your hatred toward Southwest in a funny way but lately - not so much. I'm sorry you are an unhappy person.

Gup

 

[ableone]

If they were under 10,000 why weren't the FAs seated?

 

[igneousy2]

Admitedly, until I did this over and over again, I just asumed an RA was an "agressive" maneuver. Well it isn't.

Yeah...these are the same instructors that told you that you were not allowed to lower the nose to recover from a stall in a transport.

It works great in the sterile world of the sim...but the equipment doesn't always work so good in the real world. Everybody lived that's all that really matters.

 

[BigMotorToter]

Yeah...these are the same instructors that told you that you were not allowed to lower the nose to recover from a stall in a transport.

It works great in the sterile world of the sim...but the equipment doesn't always work so good in the real world. Everybody lived that's all that really matters.

What?

Didn't realize Japan Airlines Instructors taught C172 training in a sim.

I've never been told by any instructor at any airline I've flown at that I "can't lower the nose to recover from a stall".

You do have a point on real world vs. sim world. Maybe the SW 737's TCAS didn't give a warning until just a few seconds before apparent collision. I don't know. But TCAS is designed to give (I am trying to remember but not sure) at least 30 or 40 second warning, meaning if you do nothing a collision will happen in 30 or 40 seconds. That is a long time. It is designed that way for a reason so you don't (most of the time) have to do a radical maneuver to avoid collision.

What happened in this case is anyones guess right now. I always give the pilot the benefit of the doubt until the reports come out, that's why I said " I wasn't there, and everyone lived so its a good thing). But I also wanted to put out some info that I have acquired over the years. Do with it what you wish.

 

[Benjamin Dover]

Wasn't Kevin Smith also going to BUR? Just think, had he been on that same plane, his extra weight may have caused more of a lag in the evasive maneuver, and the 737 may have hit that other plane! So, what should corpulent people do from now on? Buy 1st class seats on legacies, they have larger seats. Instead of going OAK to BUR, Smith should have taken the bridge over to SFO and flown AA or UA to LAX. It would have been more comfortable, indeed.

Bye Bye---General Lee

And if I were I flight attendant, I would feel much safer working on a Delta airplane because if the flight is less than 300 miles then I would be sitting on my fat as$ because it's not enough "time" to serve - even if smooth.

You should come back domestic General and see how it is these days. I just rode BNA-ATL the other day - blue sky, smooth ride and the sky hag announced "unable to serve due to short duration of the flight". Pretty funny. I hope they had enough US, In Touch, Star, People, etc. stuff to read on that "short" flight.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

And if I were I flight attendant, I would feel much safer working on a Delta airplane because if the flight is less than 300 miles then I would be sitting on my fat as$ because it's not enough "time" to serve - even if smooth.

So being a pay for training person, you just sit on your "fat ass" up in the cockpit? Were you the one who was flying without any clothes on? I bet you're the guy tanker clown gets all his information from!

You should come back domestic General and see how it is these days. I just rode BNA-ATL the other day - blue sky, smooth ride and the sky hag announced "unable to serve due to short duration of the flight". Pretty funny. I hope they had enough US, In Touch, Star, People, etc. stuff to read on that "short" flight.

So what is it that you read on those 6 legs doing the texas 2 step?
American Bride?:laugh::laugh::laugh:

 

[boeingdriver213]

Broken shoulder.

 

[General Lee]

Dude. Sometimes you twist your hatred toward Southwest in a funny way but lately - not so much. I'm sorry you are an unhappy person.

Gup

Nah, it was supposed to be funny. And, I don't hate SWA or you guys, I just really wouldn't want to fly what you do, and as often as you do. I would like the pay again, and hopefully that will happen sooner than later. Other than that, you go ahead and enjoy those multiple leg days, and my jabs. No hard feelings, right? (That is what she said...)


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[General Lee]

And if I were I flight attendant, I would feel much safer working on a Delta airplane because if the flight is less than 300 miles then I would be sitting on my fat as$ because it's not enough "time" to serve - even if smooth.

You should come back domestic General and see how it is these days. I just rode BNA-ATL the other day - blue sky, smooth ride and the sky hag announced "unable to serve due to short duration of the flight". Pretty funny. I hope they had enough US, In Touch, Star, People, etc. stuff to read on that "short" flight.

I recently flew a 4 day domestic trip (they have added a lot in the bid packet during the Winter due to many Europe flights not being daily until Summer season), and I remembered why I enjoy 1 leg to Europe, great meals, and then one leg back. But, I did get to see a long SFO layover, and a Manhattan layover, and that made me feel great. As far as how the stews do, I don't really know. They work hard on most of the Europe stuff I do, while I eat a great meal and then take a 3 hour nap in the back....


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[The Prussian]

Boy...things around here were doing great till you went domestic.

 

[NuGuy]

I'm surprised there aren't more incidents like this in Southern California. We get hundreds of RAs alone going into LGB and BUR (near Van Nuys). Bug smashers are dangerous in this region, remember Cerritos mid-air?

Interesting perspective, considering that the "bug smashers" have every much a right to be there as the airlines do.

The PSA accident in California is an interesting couterpoint to Cerritios. AAR 79-05 if anyone is interested.

Nu

 

[Red Line]

I recently flew a 4 day domestic trip (they have added a lot in the bid packet during the Winter due to many Europe flights not being daily until Summer season), and I remembered why I enjoy 1 leg to Europe, great meals, and then one leg back. But, I did get to see a long SFO layover, and a Manhattan layover, and that made me feel great. As far as how the stews do, I don't really know. They work hard on most of the Europe stuff I do, while I eat a great meal and then take a 3 hour nap in the back....


Bye Bye---General Lee

General,

Where did you guys go to eat in SFO? What about Manhattan? I want to feel great too!!

Is going to Europe really as neat as you make it out to be? I can't wait until the summer so you can tell us every day how great the trip is!

Thanks!