Small Plane Flies Over Bush Motorcade

[surfnole]

Draconian Restrictions To FollowDrudge

 

[VampyreGTX]

http://www.kyw1060.com/news_story_detail.cfm?newsitemid=30992

 

[Swass]

That's a real bummer for the pilot.

 

[340drvr]

This crap will get worse, too, as the election campaign ramps up, and the emperor goes traipsing all over the country baby-kissing and glad-handing.

 

[WrightAvia]

There's never a Smith & Wesson Model 76 around when you need one...

http://www.spleenworld.com/heston/mov/chuckmad.mov

I know what Chuck woulda done

 

[ShawnC]

Maybe they should have announced the restriction more than 12 hours ahead of time.

Also, why does the President need a TFR that covers over 80 square miles of air space?

 

[furlough-boy]

I'm no math genius, but

80 square miles is only a 10 mile diameter circle. Certainly reasonable.

 

[ShawnC]

Oops 80nm wide. It was two 30 mile radius TFRs.

 

[Timebuilder]

Just as good operating technique, I always talk to Philly when I am around that airspace, whether I am required to or not. This could be a big help in staying out of trouble.

Other tips are looking at the graphical TFR and getting a good briefing from FSS before takeoff.

It's one thing to rely on your IFR clearance to keep you out of trouble, but another to fly around VFR checking pipes in the Northeast. This is an area that is easy for ANY president to visit, so in our corner of the US, we need to be a little more careful.

 

[ShawnC]

Yes the guy should have gotten a briefing, but that TFR was outrageously huge. No man needs a 80nm wide TFR, not even the President.

 

[troyzohner]

Who ordered the guy to land? Was it Philly approach? I've never dealt with such a situation myself but I have heard various ATC tell pilots who were on flight following or in Class B/C airspace to avoid areas under flight restrictions......Such as Atlanta approach letting a guy know to stay so high above Turner Field or so many NM away from it as he approached it. Either way it seems like the TFR area may be quite vast. I could easily see a pilot taking off for a short joy ride not getting a briefing for a relatively local flight on a perfect weather day. Or if somebody gets a quick wx look online a 12 hr TFR could easily be missed.

 

[JHook]

This crap will get worse, too, as the election campaign ramps up, and the emperor goes traipsing all over the country baby-kissing and glad-handing.

Just out of curiosity, why is all fo this hatred directed at President Bush? I personally think he has done a phenomenal job in the outrageously challenging Presidency he has had. I know most of you don't like this TFR stuff but the fact is that the worst terrorist attack on the US used airplanes as their weapons. It doesn't seem unreasonable that the government will become wary of them. The only sad thing is that at airports, they are searching little old ladies and letting Mohammed walk right on through. If they were totally committed to security, it would be the other way around. You can blame Bush for that if you want to but I'm sure it was a political move designed to keep the PC crown off his back. Do you think the people who banned the use of the words handicapped, retarded, Indian and Black would sit idly by while TSA agents stopped ragheads? It makes them feel better to see Grandma Betsy get the anal probe.

 

[2000flyer]

It's just a guess, but the large airspace restrictions that the TFR's employ allows ample time to call in air cover should the threat be real. Granted a 172 will take 20 minutes to enter the TFR and fly to it's center (given 120 kt GS). However, should, God forbid, terrorist get their hands on an airliner or corporate jet, that distance could easily covered in 6-7 minutes, less if a stronger tail wind. If the TFR was, say, 40 nm wide, that number is now down to 3-1/2 minutes or less.

Republican, democrat, independent or otherwise, our President must be protected at all times, at all cost. I don't care if the potential threat is a 747 or C150. If our elected officials were that easy of a target, our government as we know it would be in dire straights.

Regards,
2000Flyer

 

[ShawnC]

You are going to need at 30 minutes to intercept an airliner, unless the birds are constantly circling the President, even then you are going to need 10-15 minutes.

To accomplish that the TFRs would be huge, and call for the grounding of all traffic, 91/135/121. They simply need to surrender to the fact that the President is going to be vulnerable. Our government was designed to survive the administration, for this very reason.

 

[Typhoon1244]

Just out of curiosity, why is all of this hatred directed at President Bush? I personally think he has done a phenomenal job in the outrageously challenging Presidency he has had.

Well, let's see. He's done nothing to make us safe from terrorism, and he's systematically pissed off every potential terrorist in the Middle East. You're right, he's done a phenomenal job!

People on this board have a hissy fit when someone gets hired because of who their daddy is...but they like George II.

Don't get me wrong: Al Bore probably wouldn't have done any better. We need F.D.R. back...or maybe Winston Churchill. We need a President, not an empty suit with an itchy trigger finger and poor language skills.

[/rant]

As for the TFR's, I think I'd be afraid to engage in any Part 91 ops these days! Got to watch CNN (or whatever) the day before you fly to find out where George is! If he was planning on being anywhere near my city, I'd just stay home.

It's a crock. Particularly since the TFR won't stop a determined, well-planned attack anyway.

 

[skiddriver]

These TFR's are old news. I had a couple of buddies who nearly got fried by (then) Al Gore's Secret Service team for flying their Marine Corps AH-1 too close to the VP's motorcade route. The TFR was established at the last minute and hadn't made it into the military NOTAM's system.

If you want to bash Bush, enoy. Just don't pretend he made up TFR's on his own lonesome. Clinton and Gore used them all the time, and in the same fashion, with the same effect on pilots.

 

[Typhoon1244]

If you want to bash Bush, enoy. Just don't pretend he made up TFR's on his own lonesome.

Oh, I didn't mean to imply that. I just don't like 'im.

You taught me something I didn't know, though. I always assumed (for no really good reason) that any military traffic was exempt from those TFR's.

 

[Cadillac]

Al Bore probably wouldn't have done any better. We need F.D.R. back...or maybe Winston Churchill. We need a President, not an empty suit with an itchy trigger finger and poor language skills.

F.D.R. ?!?!?!?! F.D.R.!?!?!?!?! It's going to take another 30 years to fix the social security/welfare/entitlement messes he set up over 50 years ago! We definitely do NOT need another F.D.R.

Winston Churchill on the other hand, there's a guy I can agree with you on.

 

[Typhoon1244]

F.D.R. ?!?!?!?!

Well, maybe you've got a point. However, F.D.R. wouldn't have thought twice about closing the borders to all Arabic males age 18-30. Political correctness wasn't his thing.

Even Ronald "Just Bomb Somebody" Reagan would be an improvement over our current president. I'll take senility over stupidity any day...Osama'd tell his people, "don't attack the Americans now! We don't know what that crazy f_cker might do!"

 

[Typhoon1244]

Back to the point of this thread:

As police use of radar became more an more widespread, radar detectors became more common, right?

Stealth technology and aviation are a proven mix. Maybe the G.A. manufacturers need to get on the ball and start turning out some products that will keep their customers safe from TFR-related problems.

Who wouldn't want to be the first at your airport to own a Raytheon Shadow Baron? Or a Piper Cherokee-Ghost? Or a Cessna SkyPhantom? You thought the B-52I of Dale Brown's "Old Dog" novels was cool, huh? Wait until you see a charcoal-gray 150 with faceted surfaces, a butterfly tail, shrouded fiberglass prop, retractable gear...has the radar cross-section of a Krystals hamburger.

 

[ShawnC]

Who wouldn't want to be the first at your airport to own a Raytheon Shadow Baron? Or a Piper Cherokee-Ghost? Or a Cessna SkyPhantom? You thought the B-52I of Dale Brown's "Old Dog" novels was cool, huh? Wait until you see a charcoal-gray 150 with faceted surfaces, a butterfly tail, shrouded fiberglass prop, retractable gear...has the radar cross-section of a Krystals hamburger.

You would have to add a sling shot to get it off the ground because you would have had to remove the engine to allow it to stay somewhere near W&B with all the stealth mods.

Well you can always pick up a Velocity, according to the local NBC station here, since they are make out of fiberglass they are "invisible to radar".