SkyWest pilots to petition NMB...

[Mookie]

Dave,

I got it from the upa organizers this a.m. and as far as anyone I know can tell, there was no mention of keeping it from public knowledge. what's your baggage with having it out? I'm just too lazy to cut and paste the whole thing. let's all take a few deep breaths on this one. plus, there are probably alot of cali/iah crews that don't know anything about this movement, so the more it gets out, the more informed the crew populace becomes.

Mookie

btw...how's the snipe coming along? great wx lately for a little gorge sailing dontchatink?

 

[sleepy]

What is UPA? Is it a national union, or just a Skywest thing? Why not ALPA?

 

[sstearns2]

What is UPA? Is it a national union, or just a Skywest thing? Why not ALPA?

UPA is an in-house union. Why not ALPA indeed.

Scott

 

[crashpad]

You'd be surprised what an inhouse union can accomplish.
Good luck.

 

[Auto-throttle]

Don't be overly concerned. This is typical UPA rhetoric which conveniently ignores the fact that more than half the SkyWest pilots polled think UPA should wait until SkyWest's current T.A. expires at the end of 2004 before locking in their current workrules for God only knows how long. By petitioning now with far less than half the pilots, even fence-sitters, fully behind their drive, the UPA folks are setting themselves up for failure. By petitioning now, UPA is going to alienate many SkyWest pilots who are on the fence.

It also continues their tradition of not answering very pertinent questions, one of which is how they intend to fund their fledgling organization with only 1 percent dues of 1400 pilots and NO initial assessment.

It's also interesting to note the major difference in attitude toward UPA between RJ pilots and EMB pilots. The overwhelming support for UPA seems to come from senior RJ guys in SLC, while the majority of EMB guys (especially west coast domiciles) are opposed or on the fence.

Should be an interesting vote from a heavily divided pilot group.

Should you guys get screwed again by management with the "voting" of a new pay agreement....then when will be the appropriate time to petition the NMB??

IT'S NOW OR NEVER !!

in my 6 years at skywest, I've lost count on the number of time things were just changed by management and shoved down our throat overnight without any warning or consultation with SAPA. All we could do was "take it".

wish UPA the best, TAKE THEM DOWN !!!

 

[Morgoth]

"TAKE THEM DOWN!"

Isn't that strangely reminiscent of the UAL mechanics who wore T-shirts that said "HIGHEST PAY TILL THE LAST DAY!" This "take them down" attitude, while no doubt manly and testosterone-driven, does nothing but reinforce the notion that you're more interested in grinding an axe and/or inflicting pain on management than doing what's best for the pilot group, let alone other employee groups at SkyWest. Indeed, it seems to advocate a willingness to be a willing participant in your own airline's demise if you don't get your way.

Don't you agree that it fosters if not advocates an adversarial position? While there are definitely airlines out there where management and labor have an acrimonious relationship, I don't think SkyWest is like that. I also disagree that SkyWest pilots are always having things "shoved down their throats." There is an amicable and professional relationship which has been nurtured over 30+ years. Do SkyWest pilots get everything they want? Of course not. Neither would they with UPA, ALPA, or any other union. The company must satisfy both its shareholders and its employees. In this day and age of cut-throat competition, low-fare economics, it is increasingly difficult to accomplish (IMHO).

On a different subject, as a SkyWest pilot, a few questions for you:

(1) are you content with UPA's nebulous financial estimates of dues/expense ratios -- i.e., do you think their budget can be accomplished on 1 percent dues without an initial assessment,

(2) how comfortable are you with their lack of experience running a union, their negotiating skills, etc.,

(3) do you think that UPA will prevent the company from creatively interpreting any contract any more than they do your current policy manual?

(4) Are you really willing to lock in your current pay agreement for however many years it takes to negotiate a contract that may or may not be as good as the arrangement you have now?

Inquiring minds and all that.......

P.S. The above is NOT intended to be flame bait in any way, or a personal attack -- I'm seriously interested in your perspective.

 

[barondriver]

Auto Throttle's attitude is exactly why I don't support a union here. No union was one of the first things I was attracted to coming to SkyWest, and still feel that way. From the guys I've flown with, it still seems as if it's just a small group again trying to start it up.

 

[MILF Hunter]

If you dont like unions, I guess your going to spend the rest of your life at skywest. You wouldnt want to fight for anything, that would require some effort and you might make someone angry with your pilot group. Your management will fight, they will always fight.

Dont forget to pick up you handbook, I would hate to hear that one of you guys got fired for not following the rules set by your mgmt.

Dont listen to any of your senior crj captains, they may want a union. What would they know? Some have only been around 6+ years. Take your advice from a 6 month 120 FO who loves the company, and they love him for being that way.

 

[Splert]

...and please don't do enjoy the fruits of other peoples labor.

 

[Morgoth]

Some of the people who went to SkyWest actually DO plan on staying there for the rest of their careers, due to domicile location, QOL, or whatever other personal reason they may have.

Also, the implication that a nonunion pilot force will just roll over and die is ludicrous. Management may be that way at other carriers, but SkyWest management has a 30+ year history of looking after its employees -- and that includes the pilots. Yes, I know that's a rarity in this industry -- which might explain the mindset of "us vs. them" that rages throughout our profession. But it seems to be different at SkyWest.

Interestingly enough, the SkyWest pilots that I've talked to regarding UPA have widely varying opinions. You suggest that we should talk to senior RJ pilots because they've been here and know what they're talking about. Perhaps. But the majority of west coast RJ captains that I've spoken to (all with at least 10 years of seniority, I might add) are adamantly opposed to UPA -- not because they're anti-union, but because UPA has failed to demonstrate financial common sense (e.g. their budget to dues ratio is fiscally impossible), they have no experience running a union, and most importantly because they refuse to answer many pertinent questions (which, BTW, they also accuse the current representative group of doing), and are already talking about a transition plan after they're voted in (according to one post I've been told about) -- which is rather arrogant and presuming, especially since they haven't even petitioned the NMB yet.

So it's not just junior, inexperienced, naive EMB F/O's who oppose UPA. There are quite a few of the senior RJ guys that you hold in such high esteem who oppose it too. Their sage advice should be heeded too. In the latest polls, less than half the pilots polled even support petitioning the NMB at this time, let alone having a certification vote. If I were a UPA organizer, I'd be very nervous with only that amount of support.