SkyWest CRJ off runway at CWA

[Dave Benjamin]

He couldn't have gotten to the left seat in 3 years at ASA.

If he's lying about where he works now his profile info might be BS. Who else operates or previously operated both EMB-120's and ATR's?

 

[BoilerUP]

Didn't Continental Express have both ATRs and Bros at one point?

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Didn't Continental Express have both ATRs and Bros at one point?

Yep that's another possibility now that you mention it. Do you think COex had 3 year upgrades anytime in the recent past? The guy might have flown for a regional but he's not flying for a major in this country. Not too many guys would leave a decent captain gig at a regional for right seat at a supplemental. It's a paycut that you never recoup.

 

[BYUFlyr]

No one is saying that regional guys are bad pilots. But there is no way you can sit there and tell me that the lack of experience was not a factor in most of those 21 examples at that regional.

No, but at the same time you cannot say lack of experience was a factor, unless you reviewed the actual NTSB reports and knew how many hours each crew member had at the time of the incident.

There are many low-time regional pilots and many experienced regional pilots as well.

 

[Crossky]

I noticed you didn't post your real name either yet I'm the coward? In fact, I don't see any posters putting their real names on here. I guess they are all cowards?

You've completely verified that you're an authentic IDIOT. Dave didn't point out the painfully obvious truth, but I will. His name is his Avatar. His name is Dave Benjamin. I've seen him come out of the elevator in DEN. His nametag reads "Dave Benjamin". I saw it and went 'where do I know that name from? Oh, my addiction to flightinfo.'

Posters who use fake names most always have a play on words; yours could be "Stu Pidretard". What do you think?

 

[Flip]

I know Dave also. I work with him. He is a stand up guy and knows his shizznit!!! It's more that can be say for Hi Wi Fi or whatever his 'name' is.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

I noticed you didn't post your real name either yet I'm the coward? In fact, I don't see any posters putting their real names on here. I guess they are all cowards?

You're not the sharpest tool in the shed, are you?

 

[bogey383]

dude! there are so many tools on this board you can fill a lowe's. seriously have you guys taken the time to look at some of the crap that you type. the way people ridicule on this site is rediculous. who knows if what went on was do to lack of expirience, inadequate training, or poor runway/ brake action or what. all this is, one big speculation. someone getting a hard on at someone elses misfortune. its funny how everyone thinks there better than anyone, no wonder nobody in aviation can agree with anything. just remember what goes around comes around. you wouldn't want this to happen to you, and your career in jepordy. think about that before you start a pissing match and waste precious minutes of your life.

 

[Sedona16]

Seems to be a bangwagon going on here so ill jump off. Just because Dave says there is not correlation between low time/experience and accident rates doesnt doesnt make it so. Just think about this one logically for a second folks. Why for example are teenage driver insurance rates so much higher than say thirty year olds? Yes there is some maturity that plays in but the lack of experience is the most signigicant factor. This is also true of aircraft accidents. So there are high time pilots with poor judgement, this is true, but from my own experience (and i am no ace pilot) watching the fledgling new hires I fly with there is not question in my mind inexperience statistically leads to more accidents. Ive seen plenty of the new guys/girls Ive flown with try to land me on the wrong runway, descend early over mountainous terrain, forget things that an experience pilot from making the same stupid mistake finally ingrained into his routine so as not to make the same mistake. Low time pilots also dont have the exposure to varied situations that would afford them to pick the best decision for the particular objective to be met....how can someone use their superior judgment skills without having accumulated enough real world knowledge to know what is best?

Sited below are some statisical and objective examples of inexperience leading to higher error rates. Sure there are in some of these other factors involved (fatigue) but there is not question in my mind that inexperience leads to higher accident rates. Also, though i still make my share of mistakes today I can say looking back its amazing i survived due to lack of experience types of mistakes.

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/asma/asem/2005/00000076/00000001/art00009;jsessionid=82qp9glrmsqc3.alice

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:aqTvDq5VYe8J:medind.nic.in/iab/t03/i1/iabt03i1p30.pdf+inexperience+higher+aircraft+accident&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=6

Please see Material and Methods A and B to see that age and number of flight hours were the two biggest determiners of accident rates.

http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19540430-0&lang=en

PROBABLE CAUSE: "a) Delay in feathering after failure of the port engine (due to inexperience of the pilot in emergency procedures), which resulted in a loss of height; b) the subsequent attempt to establish a climb with a nose-high attitude (to get over the obstructions), below the recommended single-engine rate of climb speed, with both gear and flaps up, and c) the progressive loss of airspeed which finally resulted in a stall on a coconut tree.

http://www.aviationtoday.com/cgi/rw/show_mag.cgi?pub=rw&mon=0604&file=fromtheinstructors.htm

Variables that lead to the domino effect and cause a pilot to crash can be avoided, as we can see in analyzing the actions of the accident pilot.
These variables include:
Knowledge of the weather—The pilot should have request a weather and outlook briefing at the departing airport. He should have analyzed weather conditions. Weather obviously played an important role in this accident. Statistics show 17 percent of all accidents are weather-related.
Experience level—This pilot was not familiar with mountain flying or with recognizing turbulence and downdraft. He was ill-prepared to cope with strong winds or to avoid the leeward side of big mountains. These are critical in avoiding accidents. Even very experienced pilots have respect for high mountains.
Decision-making—The pilot did not react immediately when the RPM fell. With proper training and better awareness he could have recovered his lost RPM and safely turned away from this ravine. The R22 and R44 both have a governor. But the governor will not help the pilot control the RPM when the pilot is exceeding his maximum manifold pressure.

Lets not forget another well known inexperienced pilot getting in over his head

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0UBT/is_28_14/ai_63302388

"Other inexperienced pilots, who have become disoriented, almost invariably regret a lack of prudence and a failure to appreciate their limitations."

Heres an antedotal blog

http://flightlevel390.blogspot.com/2005/06/i-had-no-idea.html

http://avstop.com/Stories/mystic.html

PS- Go easy on the spelling

 

[Thurman Merman]

Doesn't Delta still have the 200 or maye its the three hundred? I see the stovepipes in LGA on the shuttle routes occasionally. I also remember seeing them in DCA. Oh yeah, I saw the last hooters 737-200/300? in Allentwon, Johnstown, some town a couple months ago.

 

[acaTerry]

Oneflap,

You have no idea (nor do we) about:

1) the crew, their relative experience, training, or skill level.
2) the weather
3) the immediate or circumstantial causes of this incident
4) the decisions that were made leading up this event that may or may not have contributed
5) the particular environmental or physical factors pertaining to this approach and landing

So, tell us more about all you think you DO know...

Remarks like these sound hauntingly like the ones tha came up after FLG3701...hmmmm

Seriously, I am not at all a fan of hanging crews before the final comes out, but on the same note, taking a crusade for someone can make you look equally bad.

On a final note, it is my opinion that the SKW pilot group instills more confidence in me in general than most of the other regional carriers.

AND ONE MORE THING....this was all Mesa's fault.

 

[bogey383]

well, there is a point to all of this however; in the instance in skywest, they don't hire just anyone such as xjt, asa, and etc. sited as well that people even 10,000 pilots make dumbass mistakes. where is the works cited to that long as post above. you guys are great, seee ya

 

[ArcticFlier]

On a final note, it is my opinion that the SKW pilot group instills more confidence in me in general than most of the other regional carriers.

Thanks............seriously.

AND ONE MORE THING....this was all Mesa's fault.

he he...................that's funny!!!!!!!


AF

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Seems to be a bangwagon going on here so ill jump off. Just because Dave says there is not correlation between low time/experience and accident rates doesnt doesnt make it so.

Sedona,

I think you missed a detail. I was talking more about propensity for errors in general. There are some maturity issues that we see more at regionals than at majors. I think for purposes of analysis we'd want to look at crewed 121 operations rather than rolling other stuff in there too like single pilot 135.

It's refreshing to see someone supporting an argument with evidence rather than rhetoric.

 

[jehtplane]

I though skywest pilots had a lot of experience.

HAHAHAHA