SkyWest confident of getting AWAC flying?

[Rogue5]

Why would they? Its just a continuation of a previous trend where you had ALPA union pilots (regionals) "taking" jobs away from ALPA union pilots (majors).

With the Air Wis deal, what would you have ALPA do? Have all the ALPA-represented regionals go on strike thereby killing ALPA-represented UAL in the process? Three words for that situation: "Conflict of interest."

How 'bout the NWA deal where any new regional growth can only be operated by non-NWA owned regionals?

They did nothing there either.

In all these cases, ALPA has had little history (as of late) of protecting their own when they needed it most, either within a particular company, or within the greater pilot population in general. The ALPA of today is a far cry from the ALPA I read about in the various books on my shelves. (Political aside:I guess thats the Bush/Cheney world we now live in!)

I think ultimately the situation is that with the current lack of power for ALPA to wield, and with the bidding regime set in place with all the UAX companies competing each other out existance, I'd imagine it doesn't really make you feel any better if you woke up one morning and find an ALPA carrier has out bid your company, or if an independant one has...

 

[WhiteCloud]

I hope I don't open a can of worms with this question. I was wondering if ALPA would have a role in the scenario of Skywest taking Air Wisconsin's flying in this bid that's going on right now. The reason I ask is because you have a bunch of non-union pilots taking jobs away from ALPA union members. Wouldn't ALPA have to take some type of action here? Would they? Thank you in advance!

You're making a very valid point. Our ALPA "brothers" at UAL have remained silent on this point too. When we're all out looking for work the usual ALPA threat to not work at some alter ego carrier is going to fall on many deaf ears.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

I hope I don't open a can of worms with this question. I was wondering if ALPA would have a role in the scenario of Skywest taking Air Wisconsin's flying in this bid that's going on right now. The reason I ask is because you have a bunch of non-union pilots taking jobs away from ALPA union members. Wouldn't ALPA have to take some type of action here? Would they? Thank you in advance!

So would you rather see the AWAC flying go to Mesa since they're an ALPA represented pilot group?

What has ALPA done about Jet Blue?

What's ironic is that SKYW actually pays better on the 50 seater than AWAC and AWAC never purchased 70 seaters.

I hope AWAC managment scores a winning bid to keep the flying. I know guys from AWAC and I'd like to see everyone keep their job.

It isn't non-union SkyWest that you have to worry about. I'd be more concerned about Mesa, Chataqua, Republic, Colgan and some of those carriers getting the flying.

Good luck getting ALPA to change the free enterprise system. Probably not going to happen.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

You're making a very valid point. Our ALPA "brothers" at UAL have remained silent on this point too. When we're all out looking for work the usual ALPA threat to not work at some alter ego carrier is going to fall on many deaf ears.

Are you calling SkyWest an alter ego carrier?

 

[T-handle]

What is the history between ALPA and Skywest pilots and will there ever be a future between the two? and if not, why?

 

[rtmcfi]

While I would hate to see AWAC lose it's flying, If it is gonna go, I probably would rather see SkyWest get it. At least the pilots have some semblance of a good relationship with the company. Their pay rates and working agreement is up to snuff with the rest of the industry. You can go on and on about them riding ALPA's coat-tails. ALPA has not done me a whole lot of favors lately. My question is this.... How can ALPA as a national body that protects the interests of all pilots possibly allow the low ball contracts to even come to a vote? ALPA did a great job on AWAC's pre-concesionary contract. Then it allowed the low-ball outfits to pass a contract that instantly put AWACs contract out to pasture. At this point, I would like to get back to those pre-concession wages. I know where we can get a couple of percent right away. Please realize that I am directing my negativity at ALPA national. The local guys are fine by me.

None of the Skywest guys I know are happy with the same pay for 50-100 seat a/c. I am sure they will have a tough fight, but I would not be surprised to see them with a pay rate similar to, or a touch higher than AWACS for the 70 seaters. Now if they could just do something about that no pay during training.....that and a trip rig. Does SkyWest have a minimum day?

 

[Rogue5]

Does SkyWest have a minimum day?

Any scheduled day of flight will pay at least 3:45 credit.

 

[Splert]

Any scheduled day of flight will pay at least 3:45 credit.

Except for:



1. Transition Days that are not original bid package trips

2. Crew Support Open Time Trips

3. Trips placed on Reserve line holder schedule



Our work rules are NOT up to par with other regionals.

 

[trip]

I've been paid 3:45 for the open trips I picked up, unless within 10 days, then its 3:45 or 1.5x hours flown wichever is greater.

Swapboard trips do not pay 3:45.

 

[Ben Dover]

What is the history between ALPA and Skywest pilots and will there ever be a future between the two? and if not, why?

Because on the continuum of good and evil, SkyWest management is slightly less evil than ALPA management.

 

[Splert]

I've been paid 3:45 for the open trips I picked up, unless within 10 days, then its 3:45 or 1.5x hours flown wichever is greater.

Swapboard trips do not pay 3:45.

Sorry I should have been more specific.



Crew Support open-time trips are not covered by the guarantees of our policy manual unless they are original bid package trip and there have not been split by CS. For example it CS splits a trip to cover a vacation for another crew member and you pick up this round trip in Open Time you are only going to get paid block. Trips built by CS are not orginal bid package trips.



Two-day trip could and have paid 1:43.



Good day.

 

[WhiteCloud]

Are you calling SkyWest an alter ego carrier?

Not in the sense that Skywest ownership is creating a new company to beat up on their own airlines employees. UAL is using Skywest like one to beat up on ALPA carrier Air Wisconsin and ALPA and our "brothers" at UAL don't give a [fecal matter].

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Not in the sense that Skywest ownership is creating a new company to beat up on their own airlines employees. UAL is using Skywest like one to beat up on ALPA carrier Air Wisconsin and ALPA and our "brothers" at UAL don't give a [fecal matter].

And SkyWest is losing flying to carriers like Mesa and Colgan. What do you expect a union to do about it? Unfortunately the only thing a union can do is ask pilots not to fly struck work. If a SkyWest (or any other) pilot shows up for work and is told to fly a former AWAC route he is going to fly it or be fired. Like I said unless it's struck work management makes the call on who flys where, not the pilots.

I mainly wanted to make sure that you knew the definition of alter ego carrier. Freedumb comes to mind. SkyWest is in no sense an alter ego carrier. Whether SkyWest was union or not AWAC flying would be at risk. The futile argument that ALPA should do something about "union flying" going to "non-union SkyWest" is pretty pathetic. You have to remember that most of the carriers bidding on that flying pay pilots less than SkyWest.

The majors are farming out their flying to the low cost bidders. Apparently they care little about quality these days and are willing to inconvenience their pax by putting them on airlines that suffer from reliability problems. Unless you have contractual protections setting aside a certain amount of flying like CMR and ASA have then your flying may be up for grabs. It's that free market economy at work. If you're a Republican who supports free trade and deregulation you should be quite happy with this turn of events. If some of the Bushies get their way our jobs will be replaced by Chinese airline pilots.

 

[WhiteCloud]

Unless you have contractual protections setting aside a certain amount of flying like CMR and ASA have then your flying may be up for grabs.

That's what unions are supposed to do and contracts are for. Unfortunately bankruptcy throws all that nice stuff out the window. It's not really a free market at this point since a contract isn't a contract anymore.