Single Pilot IFR Confidence

[Medicryan]

I am still a ways from 1200 hrs but I am looking to go to a 135 outfit after instructing for a while for experience and multi time. I have no idea what my IFR skills are going to be at that time. I am just trying to get a concensus of how you guys felt when you first started doing single pilot 135 runs in the crap. How confident were you about your skills? I mean, there is only so much experience you can get from doing CFII work.

Thanks,

Ryan

 

[CaravanMan]

I would say that, in the mean time, you should try to get as much actual experience as possible while still flying a 172 or comparable. Start out flying IFR on decent weather days, where you're only IMC enroute, then you can descend and get a visual approach. After that, fly on days with ceilings about 1000ft or so AGL, so you'll be able to do part of an approach, but will get ground contact early. Then, work into poorer days, where you're shooting approaches to 400ft or so. Do that a LOT, day and night, and you'd be pretty ready for movement into 135 and faster planes.

 

[Medicryan]

When I was doing time building to get the 250 for my commercial I was doing nothing but IFR x-c. Out of 40 hrs I only got 2.3 hrs of actual. Damn Florida!

 

[RideTheWind]

I used Microsoft Flightsim 98 back in the day to keep the intrument skills sharp, worked great, built my confidence big time after not flying the gauges for a few years, didn't have any problem at all flying an ILS to 100 and a half in the real plane after doing it in MS Flightsim. You can practice non presicion approaches too, it's really a great tool to keep sharp on instruments.

Microsoft Flightsim 2004 is inexpensive and has a full Jepp database, almost like flying the real thing.

 

[infiniti757]

I was a little unnerved the first day alone since it was my first non flight instructing job. Generally i flew the same route and it was old hat by the end of the second week. It helped that i had a lot of confidence in the quality of maintenance at our operation. The flying was actually easier than instructing.

 

[Capt. JD]

Single Pilot...

It might help to have some single pilot jobs that are VFR: Traffic Watch, Aerial Mapping, Banner Towing... So that when you get into the FAR135 IFR-PIC single pilot jobs you will have good judgement.

 

[FN FAL]

It might help to have some single pilot jobs that are VFR: Traffic Watch, Aerial Mapping, Banner Towing... So that when you get into the FAR135 IFR-PIC single pilot jobs you will have good judgement.

I found that to be true as well. After flying tons of takeoffs and landings as a jump pilot, I found that my flying skills translated over into piston twin 135, regarding aircraft handling, landings and decision making.

When you pass your 135 intial checkride, you'll be instrument current but nothing will prepare you for the distraction of passengers and keeping them happy, except experience.

As far as the instrument confidence goes, you'll have to build that "muscle memory" in through experience as well.

Just remember to not bite off more than you can chew and don't let people push you into making bad decisions.

 

[mainiac]

The most hands-on time you can get VFR first will make you much more comfortable in solid IMC later. To do this, I recommend "dang Florida" as you said. Get hooked up with one of the many "migratory" 135 "airlines" that do FL in the winter, NewEngland in the summer. That way, by the time you're flying good old Nantucket fog, you'll know the airplane better than your crashpad. Some ops will even sign you on under the 135 regs as PIC 135 VFR only with as little as 500 hrs. In S. Florida, you could fly a whole winter season to the Bahamas in an Aztec and never have to file IFR. Just take a close look at the maintenance logs first, because my experience with some of these VFR only jobs is that they obviously aren't spending a lot of $$ on anything!

 

[Lead Sled]

I am still a ways from 1200 hrs but I am looking to go to a 135 outfit after instructing for a while for experience and multi time. I have no idea what my IFR skills are going to be at that time. I am just trying to get a concensus of how you guys felt when you first started doing single pilot 135 runs in the crap. How confident were you about your skills? I mean, there is only so much experience you can get from doing CFII work.

Every one of us old guys have been in exactly your same position. I'd recommend that you get two books for your aviation library - Weather Flying by Robert Buck and Instrument Flying by Richard Taylor. You'll learn more about real world instrument flying and working the system reading those two books than you would learn in a few hundred hours of "trial and error" self-taught actual instrument flying and be much safer while you're doing it.

The books are not a substitute for the real thing, but they'll help you as you transition into the real world.

'Sled

 

[Buddy1958]

Charter Ride Alongs

Everybody's got ideas and experiences about your concern, but at the end of the day, it's gotta be YOU that's the comfortable one in the pointy end! If you can hook up with a person or outfit that flies charter (say with an Aztec, Navajo, Aerostar, etc.), ask them if they'd mind if you rode along on their trips. I did this, while working as a CFI, and it proved invaluable later! I got to fly on the empty legs, in IMC, bad weather, etc., etc. and it REALLY helped me build confidence and experience. You'll also be a great asset to the PIC on the 135 legs, by helping him/her with the radios, departure/approach setup, and pax help, etc. Plus, many guys like to have the company...and some EVEN pay you!!! (they paid me). However, all said, at the end of the day, your 135 training and initial experiences will greatly boost your confidence and abilities! The whole week of flight training I went through, we were pretty much solid IFR every day - with ceilings around 300-400 OVC. We can all tell you stories about real-world single pilot IFR where things didn't go as planned or perfect. But you know, as long as you're safe, and as long as you're not afraid to go missed and try again, etc., you'll learn more every flight. As far as IMC in Florida is concerned, I can tell you from experience, that (especially last summer!) I got LOTS of time on the gauges, in/near thunderstorms, and flying GPS and ILS approaches. It seemed to be a daily thing. when you're ready, get a job with a freight company (Flight Express, Ram Air, Wiggins, AirNow, etc.) - and scare the crap outta yourself once or twice...and you'll be better for it! Remember, without you up front, it's just a dumb piece of metal! Best of luck to ya!!!

 

[indefinitehold]

hand flying a C172 in the soup is all you need for the confedance and the skill. Hell i have to force myself in order to keep proficient on the job by hand flying every approach. and ask for the damm GPS approach every once in a while. shooting an ILS every night coupled can create a handicap. you just keep trucking along and dont worry about it. if i had to guess you will be asking this question again as it regards to icing.

 

[81Horse]

I am still a ways from 1200 hrs but I am looking to go to a 135 outfit after instructing for a while for experience and multi time. I have no idea what my IFR skills are going to be at that time. I am just trying to get a concensus of how you guys felt when you first started doing single pilot 135 runs in the crap. How confident were you about your skills? I mean, there is only so much experience you can get from doing CFII work.

Ryan, I was right at 1200 hours when I got my first 135 job flying freight in a Lance. Right after my checkride, I got sent out on a "special" -- I ended the day and night with about 8.5 hours, much of it actual, including several approaches to minimums. I had thought there would be a learning curve -- I quickly realized it was more like a learning wall, and it had to be climbed. You don't start the climb with confidence, but you'll gain it quickly.

Make sure your basic scan is good, your procedural knowledge is good, and you're physically well and rested -- you'll be fine. In fact, it'll be the most exhilarating time of your flying career. Your skills and experience will take the steepest upward trajectory that you'll ever see.

Embrace it, man -- but be prepared!

Oh. And remember you're mortal. Practice looking in the mirror and saying, "No."

 

[Lead Sled]

Hi Ryan,

I felt the same way as you. I didn't have much confidence at all because I had little practice. I had 2000 hours when I got hired to fly a caravan for one of the FedEx feeders. I had been instructing and flying for a drop zone. I had a total of 5 hours of actual instrument time; none in the preceding several years. I did an ICC when I had to but couldn't afford to rent very often. I had never seen ice or used radar before. The training was excellent and the plane was great. Sim training and then a few hours in the plane including steep turns and stalls in IMC. That was a good confidence builder. When they turned me loose I used the autopilot a lot and then gradually less and less. Before long I actually looked forward to hand flying the frequent foggy ILS to minimums approaches that were necessary. Half the time with the flight director and half without. When I first started the thought of that made me quite uncomfortable. It didn't take long to get comfortable with the whole idea. Just remember to be conservative, and say no if it's really something you really don't think is safe. You have to push yourself a bit, but carry lots of fuel and always leave yourself a plan B. Also don't be afraid to ask for advice from the other guys you fly with that have more experience. Have fun,

Pat

Ryan, I say again, get those two books I mentioned in my earlier post.

'Sled

 

[patq1]

I am still a ways from 1200 hrs but I am looking to go to a 135 outfit after instructing for a while for experience and multi time. I have no idea what my IFR skills are going to be at that time. I am just trying to get a concensus of how you guys felt when you first started doing single pilot 135 runs in the crap. How confident were you about your skills? I mean, there is only so much experience you can get from doing CFII work.

Thanks,

Ryan

Hi Ryan,

I felt the same way as you. I didn't have much confidence at all because I had little practice. I had 2000 hours when I got hired to fly a caravan for one of the FedEx feeders. I had been instructing and flying for a drop zone. I had a total of 5 hours of actual instrument time; none in the preceding several years. I did an ICC when I had to but couldn't afford to rent very often. I had never seen ice or used radar before. The training was excellent and the plane was great. Sim training and then a few hours in the plane including steep turns and stalls in IMC. That was a good confidence builder. When they turned me loose I used the autopilot a lot and then gradually less and less. Before long I actually looked forward to hand flying the frequent foggy ILS to minimums approaches that were necessary. Half the time with the flight director and half without. When I first started the thought of that made me quite uncomfortable. It didn't take long to get comfortable with the whole idea. Just remember to be conservative, and say no if it's really something you really don't think is safe. You have to push yourself a bit, but carry lots of fuel and always leave yourself a plan B. Also don't be afraid to ask for advice from the other guys you fly with that have more experience. Have fun,

Pat

 

[labbats]

I felt the same as you when I got hired at Flight Express. I felt a lot better a week or two later after flying the same route with the same fixes and airports.

Long story short, you'll be fine. It's the ones that never worry that should.

 

[1flier]

Work up to it

Everyone will agree the first time its down to mins, we were more nervous than a long tailed cat in a room of rocking chairs. The suggestion about taking a gig flying traffic watch is a good suggestion since alot of them are flying special VFR or having to file in the air when going back in the mornings. A VFR 135 gig other than Arizona where IFR is hard to get would help also since 135 VFR mins are 2 miles and 1000 ft ceilings in uncontrolled airspace. I did as VFR gig for a year where most of the flying was at nite between 2 islands and it was nothing for the clouds to sweep in mid flight. That built my confidence up and when I returned stateside I started flying for FLX in Cessna 210. Still, I was a little more than unnerved the first time I shot an approach to 100ft ceiling and 1800 RVR right at the mins for the approach, but I got used to it over time. Its not for everybody, just dont overestimate your abilities and you will be fine. Just remember before you apply to these companies, they all expect you to fly as long as it is legal alot of times that means to mins. Most training is 3-10 days including ground and flying depending on the company. The company I worked for held no bones about it, they were not there to teach you instruments, only company and 135 policies. 5 days ground school, 6 hours flight training then check ride and then you were off on your own. If possible, file IFR and fly some practice approaches and holds with another pilot and give yourself a buffer like 1000 ft ceilings and as you become comfortable take it down a little at a time. Dont even be ashamed to get an IFR refresher with a sim somewhere, that works wonders in getting up to par. Best of luck and fly safe.

 

[Boris Badenov]

I'm another FLX guy, except I haven't had the good luck or sense to get out of here yet. Mostly, I'd just reiterate what everyone else has said. The first couple of days are overwhelming and if you're unlucky enough for them to be IMC, they might be overwhelming/terrifying. But you learn really fast, and before you know it the most stressful thing about shooting an approach to minimums will be the irritation of having to hold or divert if you don't get in. As for icing (someone mentioned it), it has a reputation amongst CFIIs as this terrifying boogeyman, but if you plan for it, it's not that big a deal (this may depend also on what you're flying. In a 210 with TKS, ice is almost a non-event).

The short version is yes it's going to feel like you're in way over your head. The secret is that everyone feels that way at first. It's good to be a little freaked out at first, it keeps you alert. It's also a lot of fun, so enjoy it while it lasts.

 

[IHateMgmt]

Ryan,

You've got the right attitude and a good game plan. I too wanted to fly freight after CFIing before I rushed off to the airlines... and I'm soo glad I did. What you will learn will stick with you for the rest of your life. That being said, you probably won't learn all your lessons the easy way. The best thing you can do right now to prepare is to get as many instrument students as you can. Anytime a good day for actual instruments comes up, call all your instrument students and get them in the clouds. Its good for them and good for you. In between those students hop on your local sim and keep your scan current. Put the Wx variable so sometimes you'll make it in, and sometimes you won't be able to, and always plan on the Wx being below mins.

Once you get close to your 1200hrs, start thinking about who the best 135 operator out there is for you. Figure out the flight schedule and be there when they get home some nights. Make friends with the pilots and see if they'll take you up with them sometimes. Many cargo operators are not approved to take passengers, so respect that if they say it, or see if they can make an employee out of you. The best way to really learn how to fly the 135 stuff is just to ride along with an experienced pilot. I rode with for two weeks straight and am very glad I did.

I fly out of the midwest, so icing is a huge concern. FL has the TS's... some 135 will have radar or storm scope and some won't. I've flown both ways. Radar/storm scopes are excellent tools, but it is very doable without them. When you think you'll have TS's between you and your destination get a good Wx briefing. Pay careful attention to the trend of the radar and the surface analysis charts. Also, always, ALWAYS have an out. When you're up to your eye balls in sh*t, now's not the time to ask where to next? No matter what the situation, always have an airport or altitude or some direction to turn to when you need to bug out(this is especially important in icing conditions). When flying near TS's without radar/storm scopes, stay VFR at all costs. Your eyeballs are your best assets for seeing and avoiding TS's. Don't be afraid to get block altitudes or ask for deviations or whatever you need. Most controllers will try to help you, but when they get busy(especially with airline traffic) they might not notice that their radar vector will put you right through the center of a level four TS in 10 miles. If they give you a heading or altitude that will put you in a bad situation, simply reply "unable".

You'll have a blast and you'll acquire invaluable experience that will aid you for the rest of your career. You'll also learn how to rate your experiences on a scale of "pucker factor" and you will appreciate that cushy jet job that much more when you get it. Best of luck.

-IHM

 

[bell47]

You'll be fine. Just plan on flying every approach and going MISSED. Plan ahead as usual for the miss and when the runway actually comes into view at mins., you'll be pleasantly suprised! Also, if T-storms are an issue, let the controllers know that you DON'T have radar or scope and tell them you want a wide berth around them. Most are super nice about it. Ice, well, it all depends on what your flying and how it's equipped. When the poop hits the ocilating breeze maker, just calm down(I know it's hard sometimes) take a deep breath, and think back to your training. It will be old hat after a couple of weeks. GOOD LUCK!