Sincere question: Why go back to USAirways?

[ratherfish]

Remember the never ending uncertainty, the commute, the skanky, roachy, crashpads, the minimal days off, getting bumped off equipement, getting bumped off bases, Wolf and Gangbang's lump sums, the pleasant flight attendants, the pleasant gate agents, Philly, the flea bag hotels, the yellow school bus rides to the kindergarten-changed-into-a-training-center complete with lunch ladys and chow mein and foot high urinals? Now throw in the east/west lovefest, a CEO who is merger happy (read furlough meat AGAIN), and salary and bennies and work rules that have been trimmed. I don't get it. What am I missing? Why go back?

I'm not trying to fault or dog anyone, I just want to understand what I am probably not considering. I have nothing but the greatest respect for my classmates and 99% of the crews I worked with. With my luck, the fact that I'm not returning most likely guarantees USAirways will be the best thing out there in 5 years.

My last day at USAirways, I listened to a fatassed, windbag Cptn bitching in the CLT crew lounge about not getting extra flying. I was so dumbstruck by it I couldn't respond. He didn't have a clue that it was my, and many other's, last day of work.

Later in PIT, I chucked my company stuff at the chief pilot's office locked door. It kind of felt good. (There was a heaped pile of books/stuff others had done the same with) No one had even bothered to be there to wish us good luck. Classy.

On the bus to the employee parking I spoke to another pilot and explained it was my last time taking that ride. He said he was doing the same thing but that this was his second furlough. The first one lasted 8 years. I will never forget his next statement:

"Kid, run don't walk from this train wreck"

Thanks in advance for the real replies.

 

[XBOEINGDRVR]

I have had the same thoughts, thats why I have decided not to return....Good luck

Man- I forgot about that old school house..

 

[LearLove]

the yellow school bus rides to the kindergarten-changed-into-a-training-center complete with lunch ladys and chow mein and foot high urinals?

well, atleast the PIT schoolhouse and sim center is gone, all training is in CLT or PHX now.

I'm not argueing with you but on the other side, what else is out there??

DAL - same thing

UAL - same thing

NWA (when they start hirring) - same thing

CAL - same thing however alittle less of the same thing but they've been hirring awhile now so your bound to be on the or close to the tail off of hirring if you go now

AA - if they do hire you have the whole eagle thing. AA is chomping at the bit to put an e170/190 type at eagle, if this happens somehow kiss all the md80 size stuff, read bulk of domestic flying goodbye from AA.

SWA - its gonna slow, you'll be a 737 fo forever. the time to go was 5 years ago

JB - slowing of all that was good there 5 years ago

AT - sorta slowing, plus if they start contracting out flying again, plus Delta comming back into the fold in ATL

FDX/UPS - 2 big players in cargo that dominate and set the price, leaves the door wide open for a SWA type cargo operator to come in and do to UPS/FDX what the LCCs did to the Majors. Although the barriers to entry are high look at ABX/DHL and some others

stay at your big regional - the problem here, contracts come and go. Take for example Republic. In 5 or so years the contract with U is up and Joeblow Express underbids Rep. No problem the 170 is still indemand so Rep goes to NWA and flys for them, still not a problem worst case is you were based in DCA living local and now you commute to DTW or MSP. But wait, we are ever a global world and instead od a domestic airline Rep gets a contract with Chinola Gen Tso Express or some South American outfit. Now your based in some foreign country with a 15 hour commute. You can't move you are now in your late 30's or early 40's and have a house in VA or MD with 2 kids in school and the wifey ain't movin to no 3rd world country. Good luck getting home to see the family once a month.

its all a crap shoot in the end - I'll take luck any day

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

Fate is the Hunter.

I'd like to think it would be better here than at a regional. LOA 93 will go away. Sooner or later a new CBA will be agreed upon, things will get better once we stop fighting.

If I were you, I'd take the recall and put apps out to other carriers; hopefully you'll get the call but if you get stuck, at least you'd be stuck at a crappy major, which, in the long run should at least pay better than a great regional.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[PositiveRate]

Good post fish.

I know there are a lot people out West wondering what happened to this place. At first there was a general dismissal of the reality and culture out East and a lot of folks sincerely believed that the new airline could embrace the old West culture - Not too long ago AWA was a laid back and fun place to work with a halfway decent future. In three short years, this has gone from a dream job (major airline living in base) to living nightmare (infighting ad nauseum).

Being that we are along for the ride now, the question is - how long does one wait for the tide to turn? Some patience for this to play out seems prudent. The longer we choose to fight eachother, the more we diminish are chance for combined career success at this new airline.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

"With my luck, the fact that I'm not returning most likely guarantees USAirways will be the best thing out there in 5 years."

That is my biggest fear and the ONLY reason that I am still considering going back...

Kind of like that episode of Seinfeld where George discovered that if he only do the OPPOSITE of his impulse, he was successful.

My impulse is to stay away from US Airways... ergo..

 

[On Your Six]

Well, I think USAirways will be around years from now (even if their service SUCKS - sorry, personal opinion given recent experience with numerous cancelled flights and lame excuses, etc.). I think what you need to ask is whether you are OK with the slow progression to upgrade that is likely... Can you sit in the right seat for a very long time and withstand the potential infighting between East and West? The other legacies are likely to have long upgrade times too - so, USAirways won't be unique in that regard.

Personally, I passed up on my opportunity to return to United - NOT INTERESTED. I've given up on 121 flying - way too many headaches and uncertainties. If I didn't like my current part 91 gig so much I would be looking at Netjets...

 

[Green]

Remember the never ending uncertainty, the commute, the skanky, roachy, crashpads, the minimal days off, getting bumped off equipement, getting bumped off bases, Wolf and Gangbang's lump sums, the pleasant flight attendants, the pleasant gate agents, Philly, the flea bag hotels, the yellow school bus rides to the kindergarten-changed-into-a-training-center complete with lunch ladys and chow mein and foot high urinals? Now throw in the east/west lovefest, a CEO who is merger happy (read furlough meat AGAIN), and salary and bennies and work rules that have been trimmed. I don't get it. What am I missing? Why go back?

I'm not trying to fault or dog anyone, I just want to understand what I am probably not considering. I have nothing but the greatest respect for my classmates and 99% of the crews I worked with. With my luck, the fact that I'm not returning most likely guarantees USAirways will be the best thing out there in 5 years.

My last day at USAirways, I listened to a fatassed, windbag Cptn bitching in the CLT crew lounge about not getting extra flying. I was so dumbstruck by it I couldn't respond. He didn't have a clue that it was my, and many other's, last day of work.

Later in PIT, I chucked my company stuff at the chief pilot's office locked door. It kind of felt good. (There was a heaped pile of books/stuff others had done the same with) No one had even bothered to be there to wish us good luck. Classy.

On the bus to the employee parking I spoke to another pilot and explained it was my last time taking that ride. He said he was doing the same thing but that this was his second furlough. The first one lasted 8 years. I will never forget his next statement:

"Kid, run don't walk from this train wreck"

Thanks in advance for the real replies.

Maybe you shouldn´t come back. The LAST thing LCC needs is another miserable cockpit flying around. One more guy claiming that their career expectations were ruined by Nicalaou and greedy AWA fo´s, etc. Go to SWA, Us Airways has become a cesspool of infighting...

 

[Groucho]

Expectations and all that stuff

I know this is a post about going back to US Airways, but I am struck by what Positive rate said, "I know there are a lot people out West wondering what happened to this place."

There is no restriction on where the company can place equipment, add more flying or increase overall service. This is all now occurring in the East, recalls are going east, there is no growth out West.

What does that say about realistic expectations? Very curious.

 

[Green]

What does that say about realistic expectations? Very curious.

Well it obviously proves that AWA would have most certainly failed within the next 2-5 years and US Airways would have gone on to be wildly succesful. All of the AAA furloughees would have retired number 1 on the A330, or more likely, the A340. Pay parity with FedEx would have been right around the corner as soon as Congress reinstated the AAA pilot pension with a little extra cash on the side to ensure there were no hard feelings.

sarcasm intended...

 

[PositiveRate]

Groucho, your jabbing inuendo is pathetic.

You also use my words absent the context of the following sentences to aid your spin - pathetic. Maybe you wouldn't be so "struck" if you had read my whole post.

You guys can spin this however you like, but you all had a fair shake to be reasonable and declined. The true colors out East should be quite clear to all right about now...


FurloughedAgain - unless you are willing to move to PHL, NY or BOS and willing to endure at least 3-5 yrs of crap as this all plays out, I would stay away.

It sounds like you have a decent gig where you get a lot of nights at home and don't have to commute. The grass is not greener here - The grass is being pissed on repeatedly and is not in anyway green. That IS the reality of what you will come back to. Come back because that's what you want. Coming back hoping that it will be good in the future is setting you and your family up for disappointment.

It may be a good investment if it's what you truly want and a dream that can't be shaken. It's a horrible risk, though, if you're trying recapture some romanticized dream of airline flying at the possible risk of your sanity and your family's quality of life.

 

[On Your Six]

As far as I am concerned, the West needs less work than the East. The East has fallen into disrepair and their airplanes need to upgraded or replaced in many instances (although the Airbuses are holding up). Those E190s will be replacing older airplanes on the East Coast. The West appears to be in pretty good shape in terms of fleet composition (Mesa CR9s complement the West fleet) so it will likely get less attention in the short term.

I wouldn't take that personally if I were a West pilot.

 

[reepicheep]

I agree with Positiverate; a pretty decent little airline where (!) people did their jobs, jetway drivers showed up, bags were unloaded, and there was a modicum of emphasis on running an ontime operation, has gone down the s_____r. I've worked for both companies and now feel like it's 2002 again and nothing's really changed. America West is long gone, never to return.

 

[Swaayze]

Wow, thanks for the memories. I'll never forget Day 1, gettin picked up at the LaQuinta in the old school bus and then truckin' up to the old school - I about dropped a load wondering what I'd done after having enjoyed the AA Flight Academy for the previous 5 years at Eagle! Then came lunch with the (literally, for you non U types) 3 lunch ladies still there from the grade school days. Also had to fight the urge to have a peeing contest at the tiny toilets. Strangely enough these are now fond memories of my personal version of the good 'ol days.

I too suspect that my hex will vacate LCC if I don't return and all will be well there, but I'm not willing to go back just to bet on the come. If I go back it will be with the expectation of working under LOA93 and a 10 year upgrade, with the logbook updated in case of a merger or another attack.

I too think LCC is not very attractive right now, and quite honestly I'm with LearLove in thinking that it's the same industrywide anymore. I'll probably just ride this job out as long as I can stand it and pay the bills. I fear Van Hagar said it well: "Dream another dream. This dream is over."

 

[pilotyip]

because it has better pay and better QOL then the furlougees present job. Why a pilot left a DC-10 Int'l Cargo Captain's job to go back for the second time since 1989.

 

[HalinTexas]

ATA has had a quite a few come back off of furlough. Of course not from SWA, CAL, UPS, FDX. However, as of 7/1 our list has shrunk by 200, only a few recalls and the bottom group still has a year or two to go. That's 3+ if you're counting.

GAL and WLDA was approved yesterday, so who the he!! knows?

 

[Dogwood]

"Kid, run don't walk from this train wreck" ..........

Thanks in advance for the real replies.

I remember standing at the curb waiting for the hotel van to pick us up after a long day. I called the Code-a-Phone to kill a few minutes, only to hear of the furlough announcement. A quick calculation in my head, indicated this might get to me this time.

15 years at one airline was about to come to an end. 15 years of filling the walls of my office with Piedmont and US Airways "Stuff" was about to end. On a middle shelf, next to a worn out speedbird license plate, was an unopened 1985 can of "Piedmont Punch" . I could almost hear the can asking me what had happened.

The world had come to an end, as it seemed at the time.

Just before the furlough I was able to get a corporate flying job, thanks to the help of another furloughee. We moved, to be closer to the new job.

Quickly, my wife found a job in her field, making about twice the money. Not long after that JetBlue called, etc.

While, the furlough seemed tough at first, it's the best thing that could have happened. It forced me to move along in life. I had found myself in a more relaxed town with better schools, and at a better job.

For the moment, I still have recall rights, but would never go back. We have no retirement and no seniority to go back to.

We all have different stories, and different life situations. One must decide based on "your story".

If you go back, it may work out great for you, and I hope it does. All I can suggest is that you decide based on what you see there now, and not on any future promises or A/C orders.

If you get the letter and the big descision must be made to return or resign, do so with dignity and move on with life.

Good luck to everyone.

DW

 

[bearcat]

Flying airplanes is a cool job.....but it is only a JOB! Do what is best for you and your family. If you want to fly airplanes, then consider what is close to your home. If I commuted to US, there is no way I would go back. It is going to take years to get things straightened out. The pay sucks, eveyrone is pissed and there isn't much job security. Why would anyone want to work for the combined company? HP was cool. US was...well US. Now it is a HUGE mess. You can get a job anywhere making the same amount of cash if you put your mind to it. Buy your own airplane and fly on your own terms to fill the flying square.

 

[XBOEINGDRVR]

well said DW, it made me move forward too, and Im much happier now.