Signing up??

[CaptO'Brien]

Hey just wondering if anyone can give me some pointers on joinnig the military for flying fixed wing....if i already have a degree in aviation with a 3.6GPA and my commercial multi IFR would that help? and if i join will i be stuck on a helo? (not that i dont like them but i want to fly fixed wing)...oh and everyones typical question...how hard is it to get on a hornet? i have top marks in my ground school for my flight training but will that really get me in a hornet? Also how long do i have to stay in before i can leave for civillian aviaition again? thanks!

 

[bobs98tlr]

How old are you?

Im sure someone will chim in here and help you out but im just going to redirect you to www.baseops.net because there are guys that will tell you just about everything you need to know step by step. You can sit on that board and read all night long about what you need to do.

To start- you need to talk to a Officer Rectruiter..if you want to fly the Hornet (which is NO guarantee, you have to be top of your class to be able to pick the plane you want to fly at the end of flight training in the military) you need to talk to a Marine or Navy recruiter. Your flight time now will help you out more then someone that doesnt have any time.

 

[Phoenix45]

There are never any guarantees. Perhaps the closest you can come to one is go talk to a Marine Officer Selection Officer. They can give you a flight contract, depending on which program you are eligible for. It is more difficult if you already have your degree though. You would have to compete for an OCC spot. Even then, you are not guaranteed a fixed wing spot. Stay away from the army, very few fixed wing spots available. I don't know what the Navy or Air Farce can provide.
Bottom line, go talk to an OSO for whatever service you are interested for.

 

[CaptO'Brien]

hmm so the marines are better to go to hey? ive been to an airforce recruiter before but i havent talked to the marines...they seemed to want to get their hands on me but that was before i had the degree...oh and im 22 years old now..

 

[mgg20]

Go to the Army OCS family of websites, Airforceots.com, navyocs.com, etc. and search all you want. It's a long and involved process, and there is no "signing up". These are the most prized positions in aviation right now and it's very competitive. However, I've heard good thing about the Marine program if you can get up to their level of enthusiasm.

 

[HoursHore]

Also how long do i have to stay in before i can leave for civillian aviaition again? thanks!

10 years.

 

[OleGuy]

They were looking for Hog pilots in the CLT ANG unit a while back. That way you wouldn't run the risk of being sent to helos. If you were serious I would go there and speak directly to them.

 

[chas1000]

10 years.

In the Air Force, the ten-year commitment does not start until after you complete your pilot training (one year), which does not occur until after you complete OCS (12 weeks?). In any event, as a civilian going into the Air Force as a pilot, you are obligated for a minimum of just over 11 years.

I know. I was accepted into the Air Force with a pilot slot at the age of almost 29, went to OCS and then voluntarily left before getting commissioned. To make a long story real short, I decided civilian life was MUCH better, for lots of different reasons. For those of you thinking of joining the military to be a pilot, you need to think long and hard about what it means to be in the military and whether you are compatible with its mission. It's not like Top Gun. You are a soldier. You must accept the risk of dying for your country. You must accept the fact that you may be asked to kill someone (lots of people actually if you are a bomber or fighter pilot, some of whom will be innocent civilians). You must accept that you may be flying only a couple hundred hours a year, and you may not even be flying your whole career in the military. You may be flying a desk as you get older. The point is it is a long commitment (I thought 11 years was too long for me at my age) with very real and important consequences, many of which you will have no control over.

Just something to think about if you are actually capable of getting into the AF.

 

[JungleJett]

What in the hell is this crap? Kill innocent people? You make it sound like the military intentionally targets civilians!! Coming from someone who punched before the going got tough, what do you base that comment on..CNN, Fox? How in the hell do you know what military life is like after a few weeks of OCS? I have ten plus years in a there are still things to learn. I would not trade my experience for anything.

What you totally fail to recognize is that the military has more missions than combat. How about building schools, hospitals, roads, ect. How about feeding hundreds of thousands of people? Providing medical treatment to children and adults alike. I see the US military as the largest humanitarian organization in the world. Check the history.

You are correct in stating that we are called to fight and we may have to kill and may be killed. It is part of the call to service. I can tell you this and I think most will agree; you will not find a more rewarding experience anywhere. There is nothing like serving this nation and its people. Your freedom of choosing not to serve is yours, but I think your thought process was a bit flawed. Good luck with your "civilian" career and next time you see a troop, thank them.

I think you may have decided that civilian life was EASIER and was much simpler letting the others maintain the peace.

This sums it up:

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.

In the Air Force, the ten-year commitment does not start until after you complete your pilot training (one year), which does not occur until after you complete OCS (12 weeks?). In any event, as a civilian going into the Air Force as a pilot, you are obligated for a minimum of just over 11 years.

I know. I was accepted into the Air Force with a pilot slot at the age of almost 29, went to OCS and then voluntarily left before getting commissioned. To make a long story real short, I decided civilian life was MUCH better, for lots of different reasons. For those of you thinking of joining the military to be a pilot, you need to think long and hard about what it means to be in the military and whether you are compatible with its mission. It's not like Top Gun. You are a soldier. You must accept the risk of dying for your country. You must accept the fact that you may be asked to kill someone (lots of people actually if you are a bomber or fighter pilot, some of whom will be innocent civilians). You must accept that you may be flying only a couple hundred hours a year, and you may not even be flying your whole career in the military. You may be flying a desk as you get older. The point is it is a long commitment (I thought 11 years was too long for me at my age) with very real and important consequences, many of which you will have no control over.

Just something to think about if you are actually capable of getting into the AF.

You must accept the fact that you may be asked to kill someone (lots of people actually if you are a bomber or fighter pilot, some of whom will be innocent civilians).

 

[mgg20]

In the Air Force, the ten-year commitment does not start until after you complete your pilot training (one year), which does not occur until after you complete OCS (12 weeks?). In any event, as a civilian going into the Air Force as a pilot, you are obligated for a minimum of just over 11 years.

I know. I was accepted into the Air Force with a pilot slot at the age of almost 29, went to OCS and then voluntarily left before getting commissioned. To make a long story real short, I decided civilian life was MUCH better, for lots of different reasons. For those of you thinking of joining the military to be a pilot, you need to think long and hard about what it means to be in the military and whether you are compatible with its mission. It's not like Top Gun. You are a soldier. You must accept the risk of dying for your country. You must accept the fact that you may be asked to kill someone (lots of people actually if you are a bomber or fighter pilot, some of whom will be innocent civilians). You must accept that you may be flying only a couple hundred hours a year, and you may not even be flying your whole career in the military. You may be flying a desk as you get older. The point is it is a long commitment (I thought 11 years was too long for me at my age) with very real and important consequences, many of which you will have no control over.

Just something to think about if you are actually capable of getting into the AF.

Since the Air Force doesn't have OCS, maybe you were at the wrong place. Try looking for OTS next time, maybe you'll enjoy your stay a little more.

 

[slacker]

Great quote

This sums it up:

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.

That is a awesome quote if it wasn't so long i might steal it for a signature block.

Chas1000- If the first few days of OTS (not OCS) were too much for you to handle- you made the right choice quitting. If you thought the first few days of OTS were an accurate depiction of the rest of your Air Force career- you're a moron. If you have a problem pulling the trigger or being shot at, again, you made the right choice quitting. If you think this is all the military does, you're a moron.

I can't fault you for quitting, it didn't sound like you were right for the job. I can fault you for taking a slot that many folks would do anything to get but will probably never have the opportunity you had, and you took it so lightly. Didn't you think about all that moral argument crap during your lengthy application process? It's not like you walked into a recruiter's office and the next day you were at OTS. You probably had an idea that the military might kill people and break things, before you got to OTS, right? I think you're blaming your lack of sack on some moral argument. If you just said "OTS sucked and the people were sucked and i hate the Air Force," I'd understand more. But to blame it on some epiphany you had during the first few days of folks screaming at you, i think it's suspect.

 

[chas1000]

Guys, you need to chill out. I was merely trying to make the point that it's not all **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED**s and giggles being a military pilot. It' a very serious choice. That's all. I see people all the time on these boards who seem to have a flippant attitude about it. I really didn't expect to get flamed by anyone, especially service members. I respect and appreciate anyone who voluntarily enters the military.

If you guys don't think innocent people are killed in war, then you are idiots. It's a fact of life. Again, I only mentioned that to emphasize the seriousness of the job. That is not why I decided to leave. Of course I thought about that fact before I went in. I really don't feel obligated to explain my situation to a bunch of anonymous pricks who bash someone simply trying to help others. I left for reasons external to the military. A family member was in a coma while I was there. That good enough for you a-holes?

Again, I respect and admire all of our military personnel. It's a tough job.

 

[slacker]

Name calling?

I said your reason, "innocent people die in war", is a crappy reason to quit OTS. I stand by that. That is a lame excuse, and you should have thought about it before you stepped across the blue line at OTS.

Now, if you had a family emergency while in training- that is completely different. OTS sucked, to have to deal with a family emergency while at OTS would suck worse. I would completely understand having to take care of your family instead of staying, i don't think anyone would fault you for quitting.

Your reason in your first post was suspect. If that makes you angry, oh well. I'm sure most people would agree with me, that you should have considered your roll in the military well in advance of the first week of OTS. A family emergency is a different story and i hope your family member recovered.

I'm off to meet my quota of the innocent, seems i fell behind.

Regards,
A--hole anonymous prick

 

[JungleJett]

Innocent people do die in war and they always will. You made it sound like they were targeted. Your correct in saying that someone should seriously consider the choice of joining the service. You should have as well. It is not secret that people in the military may have to fight, if you didnt know that, then who is the idiot now?

I am sorry to hear of your family member and hope that things turned out well. Had you mentioned that to your OTS cadre, they may have assisted you in taking the needed time away. Family is very important to the military. Family is important to me and that is one of the reasons I serve.

Slacker, save some innocents for me. There is nothing on TV and I just finished Halo and really want to kill something for real. I wonder if it is anything like I see on tv and in the movies.

Guys, you need to chill out. I was merely trying to make the point that it's not all **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED**s and giggles being a military pilot. It' a very serious choice. That's all. I see people all the time on these boards who seem to have a flippant attitude about it. I really didn't expect to get flamed by anyone, especially service members. I respect and appreciate anyone who voluntarily enters the military.

If you guys don't think innocent people are killed in war, then you are idiots. It's a fact of life. Again, I only mentioned that to emphasize the seriousness of the job. That is not why I decided to leave. Of course I thought about that fact before I went in. I really don't feel obligated to explain my situation to a bunch of anonymous pricks who bash someone simply trying to help others. I left for reasons external to the military. A family member was in a coma while I was there. That good enough for you a-holes?

Again, I respect and admire all of our military personnel. It's a tough job.

 

[Beertini]

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.

You can credit Mr. John Stuart Mill, an English economist and philosopher for that particular quote.

 

[JungleJett]

True...and there is more to it. I took just an excerpt from the statement.

You can credit Mr. John Stuart Mill, an English economist and philosopher for that particular quote.

 

[Rook]

I can't fault you for quitting, it didn't sound like you were right for the job. I can fault you for taking a slot that many folks would do anything to get but will probably never have the opportunity you had, and you took it so lightly.

You got that right. I'd Kill for that opportunity, but being on the remedial college plan, I just reached the cutoff age after I walked with my B.S. But to serve the country in any capacity, is an honor. Wish I had that guys A.F. slot.

Rook

 

[pilotyip]

Why are you joining?

This subject has been gone over a bunch of times; you can do a search. Remember you do not join the military service to fly, you join to serve your country and fulfill the needs of the President by flying. You serve at the pleasure of the President and the military. They assign you to the aircraft that needs pilots. In the Navy helo is the biggest pipeline, in the USMC most flying is helos. You will not fly that much in the Military unless you go into a conflict, Although Army WO's do stay in the cockpit more than any other service, and there is tons of office duties and family separation You may fly once per week and spend the other 4 days in the office 8-5 doing paper work, Then in the USN and USMC you can be assigned weekend watch duty, so you will have something to do over the weekend before you come back to the office on Monday. In 11 years of Navy Active duty I got 2500 hours of pilot time, 800 hours of it in 6 months during Vietnam. I was gone from home for nearly 4 years. Saw my son for about 11 months between his birth, which I almost missed, and his fourth birthday. If you go into fly, you will have a 10-11 year obligation, which as an officer will include at least 3-4 years of not flying.

 

['LUVIN LIFE]

Capt,

Back to your question.

I'll do my best to give you a true representation of the Navy flight program. My background? Flew Hornets on two deployments and am now at the training squadron teaching new guys how to fly them as well as the new Super Hornet. Getting out end of this year to fly with Southwest as well as continue my current job instructing in the reserves.

Graduated with a degree in Psychology (because the Navy doesn't care what your major is) with something over a 3.0. Got a pilot slot and headed to Pensacola. From that point on it is all competition and TIMING!!!!!! More on that later.

As far as prior flight time goes what you'll get from that is, more than likely, doing exceptionally well in primary flying the single prop T-34. That's good because it should put you at the top of your class which lets you pick between jets, props or helos. Then from there you compete again at the end of jet training for E-2/C-2, Hornets, Super Hornets, Prowlers. Once again based on how well you do.

Now for the kicker. You can be the best pilot they've seen in the last ten years, but if there is no jet slot or hornet slot the week you graduate then you are S.O.L. That's the way it is. So when you join, be sure it is because you absolutely want to serve your country. And besides what the "yahoo" in this thread said, there is nothing better than flying fighter jets off carriers into bad guy land to prevent them from coming over here and doing damage. You will NEVER have another chance to do what we do. You will only "wish" you had done it if that's what your heart desires.

Commitment is eight years from wings (for jets) which equates to about a total of ten years. And as far as civilian aviation goes when your done kickin #@* and taking names, at my squadron we are 16 for 16 in guys getting hired by SWA. Coincidence? I don't think so.

So that's it. Good luck in all you do and remember you only get one shot at life!

 

[hindsight2020]

I agree with all the posts above. I'll play devil's advocate a little though and warn you that different airframes have different lifestyles and people like Luvin'Life had the opportunity to luck out in this life. I do not question his commitment but I dare submit that until he has been in the situation where he/she has the grades for the jet and timing gets the best of the situation and you end up in an E-2/AWAC/J-STARS/whatever going "where did my life take a turn?", he/she has no more leverage than me, looking on the outside of the fence, to argue that people should be happy with what they get.

I commend him for being straightforward and honest about that same fact, that shows good character, most pointy nose drivers tend to eat sh!t and talk all day about how their hot hands got them the Hornet/Eagle/Viper/Hog/Talon/Buckeye etc etc. And the fact of the matter is, that contention is far from the truth.

More people than they care to admit punch holes in the wall when they get home because they got screwed out of a particular assignment, or like Luvin' pointed out, the slots weren't there to be given out. So I would warn you against going active in Navy, Air Force and USMC if you are unsure of your flexibility of assignment. I too, suggest you check out baseops.net regarding this question, those folks go for months on the "WTF didn't I get a T-38?!?" thread.

As it relates to your hesitation about avioding a helo, go Air Force. Navy and Marines are, statistically, rotorwing dominated when compared to the Air Force, so narrowing it down to Air Force would be wise at that juncture. Other than that, life is a gamble, most people recognize it's a huge break to catch a military flying slot these days and most deal with what they get, but others do struggle with their fates and for no fault of their own. So consider yourself warned.

Good luck in your decision, also try out the Air Force Reserves and Air National Guard side of the house, their benefit is guaranteed airframe, which simplifies the contention, but of course it ain't that easy of a solution, you have a better chance of catching bronze in olympic synchronized swimming than getting a freggin' Guard slot these days.

 

[Pirate]

I hate to bring up old topics but I have not checked the forum for a while. I hate people who say they have served but never did. I think Chas1000 is not telling the truth. First the whole OCS vs OTS thing. I don't think it was a honest mistake. I also don't believe that anyone who attended Air Force OTS would call themselvs a "soldier". I think you were looking for a place to get on a soap box. The straw that broke the camels back was the use of the word "flippant". This is not a military word and I do believe, in my office, you would get your butt kicked for saying something like that.

The use of emotion to get someone to break contact is weak.
Your first post:
"then voluntarily left before getting commissioned. To make a long story real short, I decided civilian life was MUCH better, for lots of different reasons"

Second Post:
"I left for reasons external to the military. A family member was in a coma while I was there."

To lie about military service is very dishonorable.
I don't buy it. Maybe you should tell it to Oprah.

 

[G100F16]

You must accept that you may be flying only a couple hundred hours a year, and you may not even be flying your whole career in the military.

Good comments from others about the disasterous 'critique' of the military by chas1000. I won't comment further other than to say if you don't have military experience or training at the task (dropping bombs, etc) better to keep your mouth shut.

I will say this about chas1000's other quote that I selected...

after my mil and civilain flying...NOT ALL HOURS ARE CREATED EQUAL!

Get that in your mind right now. I would never compare my fighter time to my 'lunchbox time'.

Sorry for those of you that might now think less of your hours (take offense)....but it's true. If you are looking to pad your logbook with x number of hours, then yeah...there are quicker ways to get hours and then you can feel good about your 'hours'. I wouldn't trade my 2000 fighter hours for 10000 "A to B" flying hours. Apples and oranges...