Signature FBO

[Gulfstream 200]

I hear ya about Signature....we TRY and avoid them, although SOME have very good service....
as far as overcharging your C172......think about it......do you really think they WANT that thing on thier ramp all day taking up valuable space and buying a whopping 23 gallons of gas??....they are like a large bank these days, they dont want the little guys business.
pretty sad.

 

[CRJ puppy]

I know of several companies that avaoid Signature at all costs...but isn't that the nature of "business"???

 

[flywithruss]

When there's another FBO on the field I don't go to Signature ... but at most of their locations, they're "the only game in town" ... often times, their prices are high because of the cost of doing business at these facilities. Their service is usually pretty good ... for the price, it ought to be.

R

 

[starvingcfi]

one of my personal favorites is mercury air center. got stuck in charleston, sc one night. open 24 hrs. sleep rooms. internet. private shower. very nice people. i try to stop at MAC if i'm going somewhere. unfortunately, i'm usually stuck in the pattern. maybe soon. maybe soon.

frustratedcfi

 

[350DRIVER]

When operating a multi-million dollar aircraft,a small "reasonable" ramp fee for getting top-notch customer service at Signature is a very small price to pay. Last time that I checked the costs were picked up by the pax who chartered out the multi-million dollar aircraft)- my bad Most of the pax that we have flown really don't mind "paying" this fee since I guess in reality that if they didn't have the money to pay this fee then they probably would not have the money to be chartering the airplanes out in the first place -huh?!- Money really is no object for the majority of people who charter the airplanes out and they expect first class service on all levels all the way across the board in which I truly think Signature delievers on.

One who does not feel that Signature is "top notch" with regards to customer service needs just to look at where they rank year in and year out in the voting in most areas...... - Just for kicks how many negative comments have your pax made towards Signature.?? I have had 0 complaints and nothing but praise for them from the pax that I have flown. I will make it a point to use them whenever and wherever there is a Signature. Especially in MEM ( the blonde bombshell is also very nice scenery to look at)

BTW, Signature is certainly not the only FBO out there charging ramp fees if you do not buy fuel.

exactly and it is my opinion that the fee is a small price to pay for what you get in return.

Most Signature employes are very helpful (but, keep in mind they know I do pass out token tips). They provide a fairly new and clean crew car to go to lunch, etc., have internet terminals, wsi weather, private phone booths with free local calls, etc. They have always been able to book my hotel rooms for me at rates well below the rack rate.

The Signature facilities in PHL, MEM, LAS, BWI, not to mention the many others I think speak for themselves.- Pretty top notch.

3 5 0

 

[Rvrrat]

All depends on the market(location)

I have no complaints about Signiture at SBA & PSP; was treated professionally at both places, no fees(I did fuel) and no hassles. And yes, both of these locations still have $.50 off avgas on Saturdays.

Mercury at BUR is awesome. Cutter at ELP is too.

 

[2000flyer]

My complaint about SFS is their equations for avoiding handling fees. For example, I land to just pick up pax, on their ramp for 10 minutes max. If I don't buy fuel I'm charged a $200 handling fee. However, if I buy 200 gallons at $3.40 (KSAV), they gleefully waive the $200 fee. (hmmmmmmm....$200 for nothing...well, ok the guy walked out and chalked the plane....or $680 for the same guy to walk out, chalk the plane and fuel it).

In their defense, there are some good SFS's out there. There is only one in the U.S. we use willingly (meaning we've been a long time customer because of the service they've given us and the employees that are there). With exception to this one facility, we'll avoid SFS at all cost. The only time we use them otherwise is when forced to (aka...the only show on the field). I believe competition forces better service at a better price. How SFS has managed to become the only FBO on the field has always baffled me. KPSP is the only airport I have heard of where SFS wasn't allowed to monopolize the market.

Speaking of price, it has always amazed me how an FBO in middle America can have JetA for $1.80 or less a gallon while an FBO on the east coast is well over $3.00. I'm sure I'm missing something here, but you'd think shipping costs alone would drive fuel prices up at mid-America (land locked) airports. I've seen coastal FBOs with outrageous fuel prices when their distributer has a refinery/storage/distribution facility less than 30 miles from the airport!

2000Flyer

 

[tarp]

Someone said it before....Signature is like all the other companies who have decided they only want high rollers in their doors.

The good news - if you have money and aren't really watching the bottom line, they will dote on you like you wouldn't believe. Pump 100 gallons of Jet-A in the tanks at $3.00/gal and they are your best friends. Need a hotel, need a car, have some popcorn, get yourself a latte......heck, they'll even smile at you.

Buy the minimum or try to get fees waived and now your second class dirt. And please, if you must fly something without jet engines on it, keep those natsy props as far away from the building as possible. The front door and red carpet are for our premier guests. Eliteism at its finest.

So for the pilot who drives his Ford Escort to the parking lot so that he can get in an $18M bizjet paid for by Megabucks Corporation, Signature looks like walking in the front door of the Country Club. Just remember, you are the hired help. The marble and glitz is for the customers. If they keep your customers happy, then you're happy. If you want, you can roll up in your Bonanza, pay them $200 to use the ramp and they will smile and give you the same treatment.

I used to have an American Express gold card in my past life, same deal. I used to go to daily fee golf courses and blow $100-150 for an 18 hole romp - they smiled at me the same way. I used to own a brand new Lexus - same smiles at the dealership. Now I fly for a regional, drive a Corolla, play public courses and what's a credit card? PS. When I'm flying my small avgas burner, I use Airnav and find the cheapest fuel prices - that's who gets my dollars.

 

[350DRIVER]

The fuel prices that Signature does charge can be viewed by some as excessive and unreasonable. I do however give credit to the Signature management team as well as there marketing department for the different programs that they have in place for frequent flyers and users of there facilities. The discount fuel days are a nice perk as well. As for the one complaint about being charged the $200.00 ramp fee for using there ramp for a minimal amount of time, this is somewhat common across the board and one cannot fault Signature 100%. Jet Center in CLE is just one of many that does this practice not too mention there absolute poor customer service to put the icing on the cake. (one of my least favorites places) I do believe that in addition to the landing fee that you are paying, part of this "other" fee is also being turned over to the airport in some cases.

-As stated by 2000flyer

My complaint about SFS is their equations for avoiding handling fees. For example, I land to just pick up pax, on their ramp for 10 minutes max.

2000, I do tend to agree with you, however I do feel that this practice is used by many other fbo's, not just Signature. There is no reason in my mind why (- a l l -) fbo's can't make the "one exception" for a quick turn in which if you use there ramp and facilities for less than 15 minutes then fee is waved. I have had quite a few quick turns where the customer service rep at Signature said "don't worry about the fee" and waved it since we use them quite often and we have started to establish somewhat of a "friendly" relationship with them.


-As stated by flywithruss

Their service is usually pretty good ... for the price, it ought to be.

I think there service is nothing less than exceptional at most locations however that is just my opinion. I have always believed in the old saying that ("you get what you pay for")

-As stated by Flychicaga

If it were me, I would stop using this FBO if I had the option. They are absolutely horrible

This will never happen. The crews enjoy the facilities way too much as well as a l l of our passengers. Like I said we have heard nothing but praise from our pax regarding Signature. I think your "dislike" and "anger" is being pointed at them for all of the wrong reasons. One must keep in mind that they really do not cater to the smaller general aviation training airplanes. They are an "executive terminal". Our 350 and 300 looks out of place on there ramp on certain days of the week. Our 328 and Sabreliner are about the only respectable equipment that we have to compete with all those "money planes" that signature is so use to having on there ramps. ( oops the Sabre's really shouldn't have been included in the same sentence as our 328 jet)

I am curious though why all the negative comments regarding SFS.?? Other than the ramp fees, what other problems have you guys been faced with and your biggest "dislikes"about Signature.?? ( maybee I am just ignorant to certain things)

c h e e r s

3 5 0

 

[Diesel]

In the fractionals we have to stop at signature. We're in bed together. The guy with one airplane get's 10 times the better service than we do. They know he can make a choice to go to another FBO while a QS tail has to go to signature so the service is not the same.

When I flew a king air we used to go into a couple of signatures a day. What we used to do was bring a receipt that we paid the handling fee at one signature. That would waive the handling fee at all the other signatures.

Signature is a nescesary evil. What i love is going into a small fbo and they are all over themselves making sure you are happy. Signature just seems annoyed when you order anything less than 500 gallons.

 

[Timebuilder]

Fuel: contract fuel is the way to go.

Signature prices: paid by the customer.

This is one of those situations where the consumer can vote with his feet.....sometimes. If SFS is the only FBO, you're stuck if you can't pass on the charges.

About Mercury at Charleston. They took 30 mins to bring up our airplane from the far side this past summer. It was on-the-job training for some newbie line guys, and it was like three monkeys and a football. I actually wrote a letter about it. Nice building though, like you said. Nice town too, with good food.

 

[~~~^~~~]

What bugs me about Signature is their liability waiver on the back of the ramp tie down and fuel slips. Not only do they collect your cash, but they require you sign a release agreeing to not attempt collections from Signature if Signature damages your airplane.

Signing the liability waiver is often a violation of your own insurance policy's insuring agreement, meaning that your insurer could deny coverage for waiving the insurer's right to subrogate against Signature.

Also, 99.9% of all Signature locations are on land leased from the government. Airports are supposed to be public use facilities, hence the reason why our tax dollars are used to build & maintain them in the first place. IMHO Signatures exhorbitant fees are just flat wrong - seeing as how taxpayers built the ramp to begin with.

I try not to do business with Signature.

 

[SpiderMan]

They dont make you sign that waiver, just tell them your company doesnt authorize you and they will drop it. Atleast that has worked for me.

 

[2000flyer]

350,

I agree with many points you made. When we're in and out of SFS several times in one day, we buy enough fuel to cover all the stops and SFS promotes this policy. I believe in supporting all FBOs.

Yet, other than the "good" SFS I mentioned we use, I have never been able to negociate with SFS. I keep getting handed their incentive program info and told those are their rules they have to live by. When SFS took over at DTW, my former company was one of their leading transient customers in dollars spent. When SFS came in (and kept the same management) we were told if we didn't like it to get the h*** out....point blank. We moved our transient stops to PTK and saved nearly $100,000 the first year. Had SFS been more cooperative and less confrontational, we would have stayed put.

--

Timebuilder, you're correct, contract is the only way to go! We're saving quite a bit using two fuel contracts.

--

Diesel, While I can't prove it, I'd bet the QS, FX and TA tails at SFS don't pay the high fees you and I pay. I'm sure their marketing department has negociated a sweet deal with SFS due to the number of stops they make a day.

2000Flyer

 

[Publishers]

Price of

First of all, the prices of fuel differ widely because of the vast differences in the computing of taxes and fees in this country. Probably the diffence in real cost of fuel delivered to the heartland or anywhere else is small compared to the differences in pump fees, sales taxes, ramp rental, etc.

The fact is that the margin on fuel in % not real dollars has decreased and Signature or any other FBO operating at a major city. The increases that these cities continue to impose on FBO's including % of sales fees will not end soon and the FBO's will continue to find ways to get it back.

For the most part, you are not paying the FBO, you are paying the city you just landed in.

 

[ShawnC]

About fuel,

Not just around the country, looking around FL I see Self-services prices changing by as much as $1.20 thoughout the state. That's self-serve, truck fuel costs much more.

 

[bart]

Yeah, they waive the fee if you buy enough fuel at $1.40 over market to make up the difference. They only thrive where they are the only game in town.

 

[flydog]

Signature Sucks!!!!!!!!!!

Vote with your wallet and stay away from these crooks!

 

[hyper]

The whole "great service" excuse for signatures raping doesn't sit well with me. I've never had bad service at any of the FBOs I stop at (except one). They want you to believe that it's OK to rape you in exchange for a friendly smile. Oh brother, give me a break! The old lady at the signature counter at JAX (only game in town) has never even given me the time of day- so what's that?

Like someone said, they only thrive when they're the only game in town. I avoid them at all cost as do alot of those that I know.

 

[msw]

Over the last ten years, I have flown my Cherokee Six all over the U.S., from Southern California to Boston, to Atlanta and a whole lot of places in between. I use how an FBO treats me in my Cherokee as a basis for whether I will return there in the King Air I fly at work. If they treat me like crap when I pull up in the PA32, I'll avoid them like the plague when flying the BE20. I avoid ALL Signatures (they even look down their noses at the King Air 200), and Cutter in ABQ. On the other hand, Corporate Jets in Scottsdale is an outstanding FBO. I've been there many many times in my Cherokee, and they seem to have the same smile, the same pleasant service for me in my little flivver as they do for the jet jockeys.

By the way, big money saver for fuel purchases, especially if you are flying over long distances, is taking a look at www.airnav.com

 

[ShawnC]

I think it's ironic that the poshest FBO in DAB Yelvington has the cheapest gas prices most of the time.

 

[El Duderino]

Signature Miami and BWI are awful.

 

[capt_zman]

For all the pilots that think Signature is "top notch" or "you get what you pay for", it is really obvious you have never reached in your wallet to pay one of those bills. For instance, I flew in for an overnight at Signature in Morristown, NJ. Received a bill for $3.55 per gal for fuel, $30 handling fee, $10 overnight charge, and a $45 landing fee. All of this "top notch" service for a baron. I didn't get a red carpet, get whisked away in a brand new van, and the popcorn maker was broken that day. I even had to unload my own baggage. Where's the "top notch" or "premium" service in this?

It's not about whether you can afford it or not. It's the reality of getting gouged "because they can".

 

[jergar999]

The company I work for won't allow us to use SFS. Next time you sign for fuel read what you are signing. Some of them attach a hold harmless agreement so when you sign, you are signing away the liability if, say, they snapped your nose gear with their tug.

 

[Flight_Line]

I avoid Signature as often as I am able. I've been to the signatures at AUS and ALB and both their service was horrible and their prices are outrageous. Incidently they charged me all kinds of fees for their "service" even though I bought fuel (30+ gals in a 172). Yeah I know, BFD 30 gallons. Signature hasn't learned that guys flying in in 172s some times end up flying G5s.