Should I quit my job?

[banned username 2]

"Dude".... YES, you SHOULD quit your job... your pi$$ poor attitude will never survive on a professional flight deck... sorry... thems the facts...

 

[vixin]

Maybe he will learn one day that the world does not revolve around him. Maybe he should get a second job to take his GF out and move out of mommy and daddys(now that is sad). It sure is funny though the rest of us did it just fine and are better for it. I have been on my own since 19 and never had any trouble with the ladies or paying bills. Sure at times it was a struggle, but I sure do appreciate what I have now. Yes doctors, lawyers, pilots etc do graduate from college making little money. It is called getting out of it what you put into it. You dont put anything into it yet you expect everyone to hand you the world. Do us all a favor GET OUT OF AVIATION. I would not be able to fly a rotation with the likes of you. Most likely the company you fly for now has seen this already. They have a cheap gear opperator. Several of us have stated we would never fly for food, yet your ignorant comments are degrading those of us experienced. We are not to blame for what they do to you. Is it not the job you took or does someone twist your arm to stay? Teach them a lesson and leave. That will show them for sure. It goes to show your ignorance, lack of desire for this profession and your need to get out of it. Every job has its ups and downs. Go sling garbage bags and let us all know how good you have it then.

 

[bigD]

We suffer because pilots as a group tend to love what they do. I doubt that many people would choose to be engineers or businessmen or whatever else if they had to put in the time "paying dues" that we do.

It's a business world out there. Companies don't pay beginning pilots the big bucks to fly multi-million dollar planes because they don't have to. It's as simple as that. As long as there are pilots looking for jobs, employers will pay us what they want to pay us.

Maybe that's not right, and perhaps we're not getting paid an amount that's in line with our training and what we do, but right now that's the way it is. And while trying to improve conditions for ourselves is certainly a worthy cause, you initially came over here asking if you should quit your job because you're bored flying an airplane that typically is well beyond what someone with your low time can get into. So excuse the f*ck out of me for not being sympathetic to your situation.

You're entitled to be bored. You're entitled to be pissed that you can't live on the wage you're getting. But don't start busting our balls because you didn't get the answer from us that you were expecting.

 

[bigbird]

You guys dont get the point. Falcon Capt, you are the one with the poor attitute. You seem to be very arrogant or maybe you think you're some sort of "big shot" because you are flying a Falcon. Personally I dont care what you or anybody else flies. This is about professional ETHICS. It has nothing to do with being pilots or flying airplanes. I am fighting for peoples rights to make a fair living. Trying to prevent young pilots from being exploited, just because they are a CFI or copilot...Falcon I am sure you would be the biggest asshole to work for. I feel sorry for you copilot.

 

[Fokkerflyer]

OK guys-

Let's put this subject to rest. Bigbird is obviously an idiot moron that gets his kicks out of p***ing off everyone on this board.

Let's focus on the other 99% that sincerely use this message board for what it was intended.

Be safe,

FF

 

[CL60]

Traits of a good captain?

Argumentative, combative, reluctance to accept input, poor conflict resolution skills, self absorbed, unwilling to listen, indecisive, no authority or respect, sets bad example, autocratic style, etc...

You may be better off in politics or law. Crusading seems to be one of your interests as well.

 

[falcondriver]

Sounds like he would be great in management....
FD

 

[Detroitpilot]

Hey, can I have your right seat?

Man, I just have to echo everyone elses responses here. This just isn't the time to be complaining about right seat in anything turbine. You just have to ask yourself, "What is the most I can get out of this job?" High alt. endorsement is a must, they don't grow on trees. If your capt. is a CFI and there's an empty leg, ask if you can do an emer. descent and have him sign you off for high alt. if he's comfortable with it (he may want to do ground as well on high alt. meterology and physiology etc. if he's worth his weight). However you're logging this time, I hope you know the airplane inside and out, because your next interviewer will (should) disect your knowledge on systems, etc. to see if you knew the a/c or were "just sitting there". Just remember, no matter how bad you think you have it, it can always get worse. Good luck!

 

[501261]

GET OUT OF FLYING!

A doctor with a fresh MD needs 7 years as a surgical resident before he can go out and get the big money! You think you are owed after flying a King Air for a year??????

Got news for you bud, money ain't gonna make you happy. Best advise I can give you is go out and get a job where you don't have to interact with others, and make a lot of money, then you can go out and buy yourself a King Air and laugh at all us "stupid, selfish" pilots!

 

[501261]

Falcon I am sure you would be the biggest asshole to work for. I feel sorry for you copilot.

Bigbird, just curious have you ever met a captain that wasn't an A$$hole to you. I bet you haven't. Must be a conspiracy from all us captains against sweet, innocent, little you. I bet that's what your mommy tells you anyway

 

[irapilot]

Wow. I understand the frustration of someone that is trying to get ahead in their career and things are not working out as they think they should have, but I don't understand someone getting on a forum of professional pilots and asking a question and then freaking out at the answers/suggestions.

So, I have some more input -

A. It is the WWW and who knows, there might not be a real pilot anywhere on this forum so screw us, huh? (or maybe listen a bit, who knows, you might learn something)
B. Don't ask a question or for advice if you already have your mind made up - why bother?
C. If you feel that way quit your job and try to get another.
D. Falcon Capt. and others gave you some good input, maybe it isn't what you wanted to hear, but sometimes the truth is hard to hear.
E. You still haven't answered my question about how you are logging that "co-pilot" time in the King Air and about how you have helped yourself lately within your company.
F. Get over yourself and grow up... in our flight deptarment with 10 pilots - you wouldn't last a week - the other pilots would eat your un-professionalism alive.
G. At 1500 hours you have a lot to learn, get a job flying PIC with a crappy freight company, if you can, and get out there and be PIC in the worst of the worst for a year, then come back to this forum and let us know what is what - at that time I will listen to you.

See Ya

 

[bigbird]

You guys are brutal...Trust me I get along fine in my work enviorment. I'm well respected and liked by my other pilots and company. That what I use this board for, to let out the frustrations I cant at work. Keep the responses coming.

 

[B-J-J Fighter]

Jobs

I have right around 1000TT and I got a great job flying, in the military. It pays right around 40K the 1st year and I have FREE benefits for all my family members. I leave 30 APR 03. Just by looking at your posts Big Bird you just seem like another civilian wannabe that didnt have the "right stuff" to fly in the mil.

 

[rice]

Bird Brain.....uh I mean Big Bird

I understand you intended this to be about professional ethics. But you have missed the point of everyone else who's taken the time to respond to you.
A) Aviation is a tough career. No one here is ever going to feel soory for you unless you REALLY got shafted and then its only going to be 50/50. EVERYONE has a story so don't think your all alone.
B) The economy sucks. Hard for me or anyone else to feel your pain when I've been out of work for three months and have three kids and a mortgage.
C) You don't have dick for time or experience. Quit your biatching and pay your dues. We all did, albeit some more than others.
D) Be grateful you have a job and if you feel they're taking advantage of you, pound the bricks and find another job. Just don't come 'round here and piss and moan to us about that one or you'll really get flamed for it.
E) Most importantly, don't ever call someone you have never met before an a$$hole!!!!!!!!! Especially in this community, it is very small and we all have very long memories when it comes to this. You just called someone I know and respect by that name which is equivalent to saying it to me. Thats two people who will never employ you, plus probably everyone each of knows (are you seeing how this community thing works yet?)
All that said, I wish you luck finding an employer who values your services and is willing to pay you a fair wage. Yes in a perfect world YOU should be able to EARN enough to pay your bills. But who ever said this was a perfect world.
Now do you feel better? I know I do!


Rice

 

[irapilot]

Real life is "brutal": deal with it. You called someone (who was trying to give you some advice) an asshole, that's brutal.

 

[Mr. Irrelevant]

I can to some extent see where this guy is coming from. Calling Falcon Capt., who has been on this board since near it's inception and handing out good advice, isn't going to endear him to anyone though.

I work in Investment Management and when first getting out of undergrad, in Financial Services. The salary and benefits provided undergrads coming out of school just blows away what almost any CFI can make. And apparently what alot of FO's in charter operations sometimes make. And people at that age (22-23 or so) are indeed paying their dues, but learning at the same time.

For the amount of effort a pilot has to put it compared to someone else in Accounting or Finance before they get that first job, they are tremendously underpaid (doh!!!). The only reason I can think that is, is simply because we're all very passionaite about flying. Who the hell is passionaite about posting a debit to prepaid expenses?? People can leave for another job so much more easily in other industries and the lower level jobs are usually so un-enjoyable that they do leave after a year or year and half. Typically for more money and a better job elsewhere. How often does a FO leave for a higher paying Captain's position??? Probably never. Unfortunately the low paid FO and sometimes the low paid Captain seems to be ingrained in the culture of this industry. I know that isn't the case everywhere however. It seems that the unions at the regionals are doing their best to put a stop to this (at their part of the industry) but obviously it will take a while.

In sum, I think Bigbird has some good points but needs to think about how he's presenting them to everyone here.


Bigbird,


Relax bro! This board is not for letting out steam at other individuals. All of whom would probably help you out anytime too if they could(probably after an apology). I think if you had mentioned how ridiculous the deal you have is in relation to probably all of your peers in other jobs, etc, everyone would have known where you're coming from (as many of them worked lousy jobs working there way up the ladder). It certainly sounds as if it's not too good for you right now. Just hang in there, send your resume out to regionals or other corporate operators and don't burn any bridges.

Good luck!!


Mr. I.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

BIG BIRD,

It really sounds like you will go through MANY jobs flying with "jerks" and "assholez" at the helm, all of them holding you back.

They are all just jealous of your King Air time.

Dont hurt yourself, jackass.

 

[patq1]

BIG BIRD,


Dont hurt yourself, jackass.

Amen! 1300 hours and complaining about being bored flying a King Air! Unbelieveable! If you're bored go get a job as a single pilot freight dog. If you need money then get a second or third job. A lot of us started during other down cycles and we found ways to make it work. You need a serious attitude adjustment. I could go on for pages but I would just be repeating everybody else.
Get a clue!

Pat

 

[banned username 2]

You guys dont get the point. Falcon Capt, you are the one with the poor attitute. You seem to be very arrogant or maybe you think you're some sort of "big shot" because you are flying a Falcon. Personally I dont care what you or anybody else flies. This is about professional ETHICS. It has nothing to do with being pilots or flying airplanes. I am fighting for peoples rights to make a fair living. Trying to prevent young pilots from being exploited, just because they are a CFI or copilot...Falcon I am sure you would be the biggest asshole to work for. I feel sorry for you copilot.

Well the maturity speaks for itself... I think it is now blatently obvious why this individual is in the position he is in... I'm sure his company is hoping he will go away just as much as the other members on this board are hoping...

Would you hire this guy?

And Mike, you should never say things that might come back and haunt you, this is a very small community...

 

[bigD]

And Mike, you should never say things that might come back and haunt you, this is a very small community...

Somewhere, waaay off in the distance, I can hear someone scream, "DOH!"

 

[banned username 2]

Somewhere, waaay off in the distance, I can hear someone scream, "DOH!"

 

[CatYaaak]

I deserve a salary and health benfits. I dont give a #%#@ what anyone says. I will NOT fly for food or do any other work for beans. I am old enough and deserve to make a decent living just like everyone else..

"deserves" and "old enough"...I won't even ask to be excused for laughing. Yes, it would be so wonderful to have as an F/O someone so self-absorbed, combined with such an over-inflated sense of entitlement! Unmitigated joy would no doubt be felt while listening to his sage wisdome on "how the world should work" as attempts are made to convince me how Life is dealing him a lousy hand. If I'm lucky, he might even begin to quote snippets from Lennon's song "Imagine". Let me guess bigbird....you're a Berkeley grad like mommy and daddy, right?

See, this is what was spawned when you old folk allowed hippies to breed in their communes. What were you thinking? Thanks a lot.

 

[flywithruss]

Get a grip!

Bigbird,

GET A GRIP! I agree that, based on your initial statements, you don't have what any of us would consider a "quality" aviation job. As you know, there are lots of flying jobs out there that aren't so great. The people that work at them usually do so until they can get something better. That's just the way this industry works.

I have a decent corporate job. Is it perfect? NO. Would I like something better? Of course. Am I d*mn happy to be employed right now? YOU BET I AM. That's the kind of attitude you need to have in this business, or you'll never survive.

Now, attacking guys like 501261 and Falcon Capt, who are hard-working guys who've given nothing but good advice to me and a lot of other pilots on this forum, is just tasteless. These guys are just trying to answer the question you originally asked, and your thanks is to call them a$$holes. Disgusting. With the attitude you have, I don't think you have much of a future in this business. I for one don't think I could share the cockpit of my King Air with you for four minutes, let alone four days.

The way I see it, you have two choices. Either make a MAJOR change to your attitude and outlook (after which I think you'd see your lot in life improve) or get out of this business and make room for some of the folks who don't have jobs and are willing to work for a living. I don't know where you got this attitude of entitlement from, but I'd be willing to bet your parents are Democrats. Life ain't always fair, pal ...

R

 

[captjim]

I could see this as flame-bait a mile away.

BigBird, keep your job! Get a part time job and augment your income. Is it right you can't earn a real income as a commercial pilot, of course it's not right. It however is the way it is! Every pilot before you, except military pilots had to scrape the bottom of the barrel to make it for many years, I'm no exception.

Hell at 1300 hours I was flying dead bodies around the desert, and living on an indian reservation. Believe me sitting in the right seat of King Air is an awsome job to have with 1300 hrs. Enjoy what you have. Your time will come, be patiant! I bet if you hang in there another 6 months or so they'll upgrade you. For now take the time you have and learn from your captains.

 

[bigbird]

Thanks captjim for the polite advice. These are the responses Im looking for. Not ones that attack me for being unhappy at my current job.

 

[pa56pa]

Bigbird,

Read your posts again... You weren't being attacked.... you just couldn't take advice and constructive criticism. Good luck...

 

[banned username 2]

Mike.... uh, I mean "Big Bird" has become unusually quiet all of the sudden...

Things that make you say "Hhhhmmmm...."

Well??? Did you quit your job?

 

[toneal]

Ive got a whopping 37 hours. I'll be more than glad to ride right seat. I currently work in tech support for an ISP. I sit here and day dream of the day I get a full time pilot's position and I understand that it will be a while. If your bored to tears just remember that there are guys like me that sit here and dream of a job like yours. Keep your head up, Ill probably be your first officer someday.

 

[asolo]

I can understand the basis of what bigbird is saying. BigBird thinks that we should stand up for our hard work. However, before I went any further than my private, I knew exactly what I was getting into and what to expect. I knew that nothing was going to change in 1 year, 2 years, or even 3 years. The underlying problem that is inherent to our career is that aviation is expensive and the cost of flying increases every day. It is not stable at all, and flucuates with the economy. If a company loses money, the first thing to go is the aviation department. Notice too that it is also the last thing to be added to a company.
Yes, there are a lot of people who have to "pay their dues" and some get their lucky breaks early. BigBird is one of them if he plays his cards right. In the meantime, I hope he realizes this and just sticks it out. Good luck and Blue Skies.

 

[banned username 2]

If a company loses money, the first thing to go is the aviation department. Notice too that it is also the last thing to be added to a company.

I wish people would stop saying this... this is more of a falacy of the past than the way things are today... yeah, some small companies who probably shouldn't have had an airplane in the first place may shut down their operation, but it isn't like as soon as the most companies goe red the first thing to go is the planes... just isn't true...