Seriously, what is the deal w/ Mesa?

[the turtle]

never denied the jumpseat.

like someone else said, every airline has pros and cons...get your foot in the door with someone who will hire you, build your time, then leave.

 

[Fly2Scuba]

Always hatin on Mesa Fly2Scuba!

Yea, there are better things to do with my time so I'll avoid the Mesa topics in the future, let someone else do the talking. Just one last thought on the issue. The primary problem over there of course are the extremely selfish Freedumb people; one level below scabs. Everyone else should have the opportunity to jumpseat.
Johnny Ornstein still = devilish ethical scum

 

[crj579]

Some Mesa pilots have had a problem with America West mainline in the jumpseat. However, unless the airplane is full you will be able to ride in the back on a pass. I witnessed a mainline AWA pilot deny his own flesh and blood brother a seat on a flight. Pretty sad when that happens!

As far as Freedom goes, no by-laws were broken and they got the 90-seats at Mesa which provided growth. Many are now ALPA members in good standing. I find it ironic that true scabs ( ones who actually crossed the picket lines) are not mentioned on here half as much as Freedom pilots. I doubt if any Freedom pilots would have crossed a picket line as I have spoken to quite a few about it. The Mesa MEC couldve added a side letter to the existing contract to allow the 90-seat jets to be flown under Mesa, but chose the confrontational approach. In the end, about 25 pilots scared them into a the contract that they ended up with. Sad!

For the most part on other carriers, commuting doesn't seem to be that bad. Unfortunatly, some Freedom pilots that went over with ALPA's blessing were just blanketly denied whether they were some of the first ones or not. Alpa brotherhood at its finest. Meanwhile, want to know how many have jumpseated on Freedom from other airlines. I sat next to a guy on FC on Freedom that bitched about it the entire way, then shook the pilots hand before leaving. Too Funny.

 

[Lance501]

Huh?

And I thought the whole deal with Mesa signing that POS contract was because they were trying to stop the whipsaw from their own pilot group trying to start a new airline. I guess I was way off........ wait a minute then why did they sign the first thing the compnay gave to them. Oh, I know, The turn over rate over there is so good that nobody on the MEC had ever been around for contract negotiations before.
Help me understand what you were talking about. If it could have been sealed up with an MOU then why not just do that?

Too many pilots, too few professionals.

 

[crj579]

Go figure why they didn't just have a side-letter. Everyone knew the 90-seaters were coming. Maybe the fact that they wanted rates more than their Mainline affiliate to fly them. They were coming and wouldve just sat on the ramp if there was no agreement. IMO, the bureaucratic process may have had something to do with it and USAirways perceived scope at the time.

 

[AirBill]

F*%^K MESA

Nice.

 

[RIDETHELIGHTING]

Freedumb pilots might not be scads, but there just as low. Dont try and back paddle now to save yourA$$, we all have the list. I always carry some in flight bag just in case someone needs a copy.

 

[Mongolikecandy]

One thing that scares the cr@p out of me about Mesa... they have a person in training right now that has just over 250 hours and LESS THAN 15 HOURS MULTI!!!! And they're going to be in the right seat of a 70 or 90 seater. Nothing like having experience up front.

 

[cl65200]

"And I thought the whole deal with Mesa signing that POS contract was because they were trying to stop the whipsaw from their own pilot group trying to start a new airline. I guess I was way off........ wait a minute then why did they sign the first thing the compnay gave to them. "




---------------------




Our pilotgroup did not TRY to start up a new airline.
J.O & Co started, and had Freedom up and running 6-7 months before we voted on our contract.

 

[cl65200]

"As far as Freedom goes, no by-laws were broken and they got the 90-seats at Mesa which provided growth. Many are now ALPA members in good standing. I find it ironic that true scabs ( ones who actually crossed the picket lines) are not mentioned on here half as much as Freedom pilots. I doubt if any Freedom pilots would have crossed a picket line as I have spoken to quite a few about it. The Mesa MEC couldve added a side letter to the existing contract to allow the 90-seat jets to be flown under Mesa, but chose the confrontational approach. In the end, about 25 pilots scared them into a the contract that they ended up with. Sad! "

------------------------

Sure, the early Freedom pilots should not be called scabs.
I still consider them to be worse than scabs. At least a scab would scab trying to cling to his/her old job. The Freedom pilots jobs @ Mesa were 100% SECURE and we were not in strike!!!! All they had to do was to be patient and therefore force J.O to negotiate with our Neg Com.
So there was other reasons for them to go to Freedom, and we all knows why.......
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"The Mesa MEC couldve added a side letter to the existing contract to allow the 90-seat jets to be flown under Mesa, but chose the confrontational approach."
------

That is what we call NEGOTIATION. .....That is also exactly they tried to do, and what I expect my Neg com to do so........






------
" In the end, about 25 pilots scared them into a the contract that they ended up with. Sad! "



-----
We got our new TA do to the majority of our pilot group voted YES ( me included ) PERIOD. If anyone did put pressure on me, then I must say it was the early Freedom pilots........Anyway,nice to see ALL those jr Freedom pilots back in the right seat where they belong. Actually they belong to another place, but nobody asked me in that matter....

 

[Cows Go Moo]

originally posted by Lance 501

And I thought the whole deal with Mesa signing that POS contract was because they were trying to stop the whipsaw from their own pilot group trying to start a new airline. I guess I was way off........ wait a minute then why did they sign the first thing the compnay gave to them. Oh, I know, The turn over rate over there is so good that nobody on the MEC had ever been around for contract negotiations before.

We were trying to stop the bleeding. First, it wasn't so much the pilot group who started up freedom. Mesa management went thru the whole seniority list of (at the time) about 1300 plus CC Air and the San Juan College folks and seduced and/or scared about 80 or so with signing bonuses, better paychecks and faster upgrades before having to resort to street hires. Second, there was no trying to start a new airline involved. The trying was over. It was already happening. It was successfully started, and Freedom, at the time our contract was negotiated and voted in, was getting two or three aircraft per month. That, plus management threats to start furloughing (again) off the Mesa/Air Midwest pilot group and the CC Air pilot group still SOL and out of the picture, there was a sense of urgency involved.

There are lots of critics out there looking at just our pay rates and QOL, but they conveniently disregard what we got out of it; one pilot group, scope, growth, guaranteed pay raises which vary between 15% and 30% over the life of the contract, and QOL improvements which are, I admit, modest, but at least they're in there. I'll never say that this is a great contract, but, all things considered, I definitely understand it.

 

[crj579]

"Our pilotgroup did not TRY to start up a new airline.
J.O & Co started, and had Freedom up and running 6-7 months before we voted on our contract"

Actually this is exactly what I mean. The airplanes were coming and nothing was done quickly to "include" them before the 6-7months before negotiations of a new contract. Why would you want these airplanes to sit on the ramp unused? Something could have been done!!

 

[low-key]

The majority of the times i have rode on Mesa I have found their FA's to be some of the most UNPROFESSIONAL people in the industry and a handful of their pilots too. The FA's make it seem like your riding in a circus side car when they do their safety announcements and some of the conduct up front i have witnessed while boarding is not needed. The best though and my favorite one is on a trip home one day the flight attendant on an E145 says:" And this Embraer is powered by 2 rolls royce engines, so if yous not ever ridden in a Rolls, yous about to now...."

 

[RIDETHELIGHTING]

and your point is???

 

[low-key]

my point? not really one in that post, just thoughts.

 

[BAe3100FO]

Good for that Flight Attendant!!!

Sounds like we need more like him/her. Doesn't SWA promote that kind of attitude and initiative?

 

[BTDII]

Good for that Flight Attendant!!!

Sounds like we need more like him/her. Doesn't SWA promote that kind of attitude and initiative?

I'm not gonna jump on the "bash mesa bandwagon" but did feel that I had to chime in on this.

Lately I've had to deadhead alot on mesa, and I've got to be honest, the jokes are not funny. Let me re-phrase that, they are funny, just not the way your FA's are saying them. FA's are not comedians, and if the ones I've seen are than they should'nt quit their day job.

You can have a great attitude and show initiative in the way you treat people without trying to tell jokes. People will remember the way they are treated, talked to, and served more than the joke. To add, they will also remember how the FA carrys themselves.

Southwest is a completely different airline than Airways. Should we be like them? Not for me to say. I personally would rather just to be able to compete with them and offer a "different" and "better" product with "excellent" service. Jokes work at SWA because thats SWA. To hop on the "we're a fun airline thing" now would be pointless. I belive the customers could be won over and "kept" with fair prices and excellent service. One of those items we can do something about.

Please stop the jokes, and learn how to carry yourselves. And I won't even go into wearning a different Express Carrier uniform while in the service of US Airways Express

(Disclaimer: That is not a blacket statement. Not all mesa FA's are this way or unprofessional. The ones that this apply to know who they are.)

 

[WileE]

I don't think that's a Mesa problem

I think it's a problem across a lot of airlines. I've flown with way too many FA's who are wannabe comedians only one of whom was on a Mesa flight. The worst one I ever had to endure was on ASA actually, she really was terrible. I don't hold the fact that she was an idiot against the whole airline though. I do agree with BTDII that this is really unprofessional and it certainly doesn't instill the passengers with a sense of confidence in the crew.

 

[jetnut]

Can't argue that point. I'm just saying that Great Lakes seems to stay relatively low on most people's radar screen.
___________________________________________________

I'm actually a big fan of Lakes, just think the smarter career choice is Mesa.

I was there for a while my self and I am pretty happy with the traing for lowtime Pilots. Of course this was 5 years ago when they just got rid of the C models. Pomery is also gone Even better. a better place than mesa. Stay away from Colgan. Shuttle America is hiring for march if rumers hold true and it looks like it big time expansion there. Good Luck