Seriously considering Cathay Pacific

[SFR]

I filled out the app and am getting ready to mail it in. Before I spend the money on postage and a photo, I just want to be sure of one thing.

Can an American like me go there and make a career out of it and retire in the left seat of a heavy?

Thanks

 

[mar]

Judging by your profile...

...it's hard to say.

Basically: If you have jet time you're qualified as a direct entry FO on the freighter fleet with a North American basing. You'll make less than an FO on the passenger fleet.

If you have no jet time you're only way into CX is as an SO (relief pilot) on the passenger fleet with a Hong Kong basing.

Time to command: 15 years.

The trainers and checkers are biased against Americans. They think Yanks are very casual and cavalier.

It's my opinion (and only my opinion) that the interviewers discriminate against Americans even though the company calls them for interviews.

My advice: Spend the money on postage and the photo. If you get hired you'll receive some of the best training in the industry and fly some of the newest airplanes with the best crews.

Just remember to cross all of your t's and dot all of your i's.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

If U R considering going overseas, I'd reccomend U check into Emirates, based in Dubai, UAE.

http://www.emiratesgroupcareers.com/
http://www.pprune.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=8

I believe that Emirates is the best international airline that is currently hiring Americans.

I also think Dubai is a great place to live.

Good luck!

Cliff
DTW

 

[mar]

Curious about Dubai

Not to hijack the thread or anything, but I'm wondering about your thoughts on living in Dubai.

Why do you think it's great.

Are you speaking from a single or married standpoint? Or does it matter? Maybe you're thinking of the tax advantages?

Just curious. I'm not qualified for Emirates but maybe one day.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

I think it would be great to live in a foreign country and have my kids go to school with kids from all over.

Emirates provides housing, school, etc.

There's no income tax.

My wife likes heat, beaches, and shopping-Dubai has all 3. It also has a great night life, etc. It's like the Monaco of South-West Asia.

I'm pretty adventurous. I know a lot of people would hate it, because it's not the US/UK, whatever. It's not what they're used to.

Cliff
DTW

 

[Cpt. Underpants]

Cathay also provides housing, school subsidies, etc.

Income tax is a flat 16%.

Hong Kong is the hub of Asia. English widely spoken. "JIHAAAD!" hardly ever heard here...OK, never.

Very seldom hits 120 F here...OK, never.

A (junior) F/O in CX takes home (big issue) about 50% more than an EK 7 year Captain.

Like your labour laws? Not in Dubai. No unionism at all. Take it or leave it.

Fancy a cold bud? Ummmm. Read about SHARIA here.

Time to command in CX for a new joiner S/O currently 12 years. Could go either way.

Wonder what happens to traffic when the next gulf war starts? Benevolence doesn't appear in the contract, I think.

Finally, EK is also known to some as "MUDGUARD" Airlines - nice and shiny on top, but don't look underneath.

As always, your call.

 

[SilentBob]

SFR,

Looks like a great opportunity, not for everyone I guess but what is? Definitely worth the look, effort, postage etc.

Let me digress with a stupid question. Did you type the app? I guess the essay Q's should be handwritten by the instruction. Probably sweating the small stuff here. My wife works in HR and says this app should be handwritten. Just wondering.

Thanks.

 

[SFR]

I handwrote the whole thing (blue ink). I figure if they like me they will call, if not they won't. I don't sweat ANY of it anymore. It is win win. I will have to sacrifice a bit if hired (moving to HK), but get to fly heavys. If not hired I stay at ASA for a bit and keep our house we love and get decent pay anyway.

BTW, last summer I typed ATA's app. That got me nowhere, but maybe I should be glad about that!!!

Later all

 

[SilentBob]

Great minds must think alike. I agree with you. Only I'm off active duty in six months whether I get hired or not and I'm trying to avoid going to Baghdad during that time. Be thankful ASA doesn't hold that over your head.

Thanks

 

[Gulfstream 200]

I think Dubai would be a great place to live for a while.

Yes, its hot, but no hotter then Texas or Arizoan and much cleaner.

The people are very nice, its multi-cultural (lots of brits and germans etc..) the beaches are great, tax free, etc..

I also hear there are excellent schools if you are a family guy.

Worth checking out in my opinion.

 

[furloughfodder]

If it is about the cities...

I have spent time in both cities, and Hong Kong kicks ass over Dubai. But Dubai isn't that bad either.

PS- If you "fancy a cold bud" you can drink in either place.

 

[CatYaaak]

I think Dubai would be a great place to live for a while.

Yes, its hot, but no hotter then Texas or Arizoan and much cleaner.

Gotta disagree on the heat thing in the Gulf being anything like Texas or Arizona. Last summer (as always) in Dubai (and Kuwait City, Dhamam, etc), routinely 48C, 49C and hitting 50C (122F) degrees with humidity about 99%, like fog. Absolutely the worst heat/humidity on the planet.

 

[typhoonpilot]

Just spotted this thread and would love to give a detailed reply to some of the posts, but I'm on the road and don't have any time right now. I will try to get back to it later today or tomorrow. I live in Dubai and work for EK so if anybody wants to PM me with questions I'll be happy to answer.


Typhoonpilot

 

[typhoonpilot]

SFR:

I can't really answer your original question, Captain Underpants can probably do that with more accuracy or even Dieterly if he is around.

This thread took an interesting turn when Emirates was mentioned. The thing that has put Emirates on the map recently is that it has been a good place to go for a quick command on a widebody. Americans weren't really looking overseas until after 9-11, but now they are and places like Emirates, Cathay, Dragonair, China Airlines, and the Japanese contracts based in Hawaii have become much more popular.

I'll say this once, the best airline job in the world for an American is as a pilot for a major in the States. There is just no question about it. I've done both and I know. It is only people like me who have had our careers interupted for one reason or another that end up overseas. Don't get me wrong, I like my job, but I would much rather be flying for a good major in the States.

Why do I say this ? Lots of reasons. The pay is generally better. The lifestyle is better. I live in my own country and don't have to worry about the whims of politics causing me to lose my job. I would have a retirement package that included health insurance. I would be closer to friends and family. I'm sure you can think of more reasons, but you get the idea.

That said, if you are up for a big adventure then I say go for it. Just realize that it is a very difficult transition to live and work overseas.

Now, to the comments made previosly regarding EK.

Very seldom hits 120 F here...OK, never.

Actually we had a pretty mild summer last year and it was never much over 40 centigrade. The trade is that we can actually breathe the air in Dubai. Pilots have left Dragonair due to their children's health in Hong Kong. The smog is really bad, a lot like L.A. in the 70s. Just spent the last 7 months enjoying very comfortable weather in Dubai and I can still play golf in summer, just have to use a cart.

A (junior) F/O in CX takes home (big issue) about 50% more than an EK 7 year Captain.

I doubt the accuracy of that statement and I don't really want to post my first year Captain pay on the internet. It isn't great in comparison to Cathay but the total package is what counts and I have a much nicer lifestlye in Dubai than I could have in Hong Kong. How much does a round of golf cost you in Hong kong ? I pay $700 for the year. Little things like that make a difference. I have membership to two beach clubs and two health clubs in town for $30 per month. What would that cost in Hong Kong ?

Fancy a cold bud? Ummmm. Read about SHARIA

I have a liquor store in my building, enough said.

Time to command in CX for a new joiner S/O currently 12 years. Could go either way.

EK will definitely increase from the present 3 years to command, but should stay within 7 for people joining this year.

Wonder what happens to traffic when the next gulf war starts? Benevolence doesn't appear in the contract, I think.

The last Gulf War didn't hurt too much. We lost some European traffic but the Sub-Continent traffic didn't drop at all. SARS was more of an issue for global airlines. Wasn't there talk of halting all Cathay flights in the month of May last year ?

Finally, EK is also known to some as "MUDGUARD" Airlines - nice and shiny on top, but don't look underneath.

Hadn't heard that term before, it does have some truth to it. EK isn't a bed of roses. They have their problems with very rapid expansion and the Jo-Burg incident is a direct result of that, which would be a more appropriate use of the term MUDGUARD.

Off to dinner now, it is a lovely evening in Melbourne.

Typhoonpilot

 

[Lear70]

Off to dinner now, it is a lovely evening in Melbourne. Typhoonpilot

Now that's what I'M talking about!! I was born and raised in TN so of course living in the U.S. would be better if all things were equal and having flown Boeings before, it's not really about the size of aircraft, but more about lifestyle, and I REALLY want to fly internationally (Europe, Australia, Asia) .

The main question for a lot of us here at PCL who have talked about this very issue and one I'd like to hear about is:

Situation: a 28-32 year old married guy with 2 kids who is making about $70k a year in the left seat of an RJ (doesn't go very far with a family) with 13-14 days off and isn't going anywhere for several years domestically (major airline unless SWA calls and that wouldn't ever be international with their current op strategy) and will probably end up at one of them, but won't see International for probably 12-15 years realistically, and then it would be from the right seat...

For the guys who work at Cathay and Emirates, given that situation, would you stay put or would you still jump to an overseas carrier? Are any guys who have come there trying to get back out to a U.S. carrier like jetBlue or SWA and are any of them having any luck? (Determines future ability to get back in-country for when the U.S. majors hire again in later years).

Just to be clear, many of us were talking about how great it would be to go to Emirates or Cathay for 7-10 years, make the same or better money but make it (relatively) tax free, international education for the kids, get to fly internationally during that period, then when the majors pick up again, head back to the U.S. and we're just wondering how realistic that is...

Thanks!

 

[Cpt. Underpants]

Lear, check your PM's.

 

[typhoonpilot]

For the guys who work at Cathay and Emirates, given that situation, would you stay put or would you still jump to an overseas carrier?

I would say that once you have 1000 PIC in the jet then it would be okay to jump. The problem though is that Emirates doesn't look at people who have only flown RJs. I wish they would because I think they are overlooking a good source of pilots. I believe Cathay does so that might be your only choice.

Are any guys who have come there trying to get back out to a U.S. carrier like jetBlue or SWA and are any of them having any luck? (Determines future ability to get back in-country for when the U.S. majors hire again in later years).

Again, the big issue is health insurance after you retire. So it is very possible that people will start looking for a way to secure that as they get older. I would say though it would be very difficult to leave the left seat of a widebody at a successful international airline.

Just so you are aware, the Fedex application or requirements now state 5 years of residence in the United States prior to applying. I believe that was included due to the Postal Service contract. Take a look at their website since it has been awhile since I last looked.


Typhoonpilot

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

typhoon,
I missed the update when you moved over...Congrats!

 

[Lear70]

Thanks Capt, appreciate the reply.

Typhoon, have plenty of time on the 727 to qualify for Emirates, so that's not an issue, more of a quality of life issue if they offered the job - got the email back that said they received my stuff and would be in touch. You're right about the FedEx Postal Service stuff - it's why I don't fly the 727 anymore, FedEx took over the USPS contract from us and it required 5 years in-country residency among other things.

Thanks to those who PM'd me, lots of interesting stuff to mull over. Good luck to all!

 

[SFR]

So back to the question of if I can retire at Cathay.

I am just concerened that in 10 years they will wake up one day and say they don't want any Americans. fire them all!!!!

Then out of a job??

Other than that I am going