Remember The MESA Crash Landing in ROA?

[PropPiedmont]

I guess this how they're taught to do it.
​

NTSB Identification: DEN06LA035
14 CFR Part 91: General Aviation
Accident occurred Wednesday, January 25, 2006 in Farmington, NM
Aircraft: Beech A36, registration: N1830V
Injuries: 2 Uninjured.

This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors. Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been completed.

On January 26, 2006, approximately 1830 mountain standard time, a Beech A36, N1830V, registered to MPD, Inc., and doing business as Mesa Pilot Development, was substantially damaged when it made a hard landing at Farmington Municipal Airport (FMN), Farmington, New Mexico. Night visual meteorological conditions prevailed at the time of the accident. The local instructional flight was being conducted under the provisions of Title 14 CFR Part 91 without a flight plan. The private pilot and the commercial certificated flight instructor were not injured. The flight originated at an undetermined time.

Preliminary information indicates the private pilot, who was working on his commercial pilot certificate, was receiving instruction from the flight instructor in night takeoffs and landings on runway 7. The wind was reportedly from 090 degrees at 12 knots. The airplane landed hard and the instructor took control of the airplane. They aborted the landing, went around, landed, and secured the airplane for the night. The damage was discovered the next morning by another pilot making a preflight inspection. The left wing was bent up, the upper skin was rippled and wrinkled, and the aileron was buckled. There were scrape marks underneath the left wing tip.

 

[IFlyFL410]

"Oh what heck, let's let him slip through the cracks and give him a shot in ROA ans see if he can out do the last crew!"

 

[bearcat]

I really don't think that there is any comaprison to ROA. First you must brief a no go around approach, then stall at 500 feet. Pull back against the shaker, deeper into the stall, ignore the pusher, pull further back, tail strike, scare people and ignore everything. I think the example in FMN was a good one after a bad landing. Minus the fact that they damaged the airplane and going around was probably not such a good thing. Maybe they were scared of the ground when the sparks flew up.

Haha..that was fun. If I wasn't so tired I would put my signature DIE MESA in huge red letters again.

Oh, btw...the aircraft in KROA was unmanned...whatever that means. A friend told me.....

DIE MESA DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE
Ahhhhh...couldn't resist.
could night ladies....

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

Bearcat, you crack me up.

 

[Wacopilot]

You also have to be a Female Captain....................Check the report.

Waco

 

[91100 100 set]

The similarities are where both pairs of pilots failed to notice the damage afterwards. In the ROA accident, I believe the airplane actually flew a leg the next morning (to CLT?) and the crew swapping into it there noticed the damage.

 

[wmuflyguy]

correct.

I guess they don't teach post-flight inspections.

 

[TNPILOT]

Exactly the reason I don't let family ride on Mesa. I once worked with a guy who eventually ended up at Mesa who can harldy speak english and is an overall joke of a pilot. The thought of him at the controls with a family member of mine on board gives me nightmares. Sure every airline has some winners but Mesa seems to have more than most.

 

[Lequip]

You also have to be a Female Captain....................Check the report.

Waco

Why are women involved in the majority of mishaps when they are the miniority sex amongst the pilot ranks?

 

[WSurf]

Why are women involved in the majority of mishaps when they are the miniority sex amongst the pilot ranks?

Well you had to ask! Read my son, read!!
http://christianparty.net/womenpilots.htm

 

[CoATP]

Wattaa bunch of bull Since the femal pilot population is lower in total numbers any incident will be a larger percentage. However it could explain why male pilots never ask for directions from center.

 

[Cloudroller]

I have seen the pictures of that aircrafts tail. its not as noticable as you might think. No rampers noticed the damage, which was very close to the rear cargo door. their were 2 females envolved in this one.

 

[Lequip]

Wattaa bunch of bull Since the femal pilot population is lower in total numbers any incident will be a larger percentage. However it could explain why male pilots never ask for directions from center.

Your logic is flawwed CoATP. If the pilot ranks contain 10% females then on a pure statistical basis, one in 10 accidents / mishaps should contain a woman in the cockpit. It seems like every other accident or mishap that I read involves a woman in the cockpit. Women pilots account for way more than their fair share on a purely statistical basis. There is a lot of truth in the article about women pilots. That is why the best women chess & pool players can't even come close to beating average pro men chess and pool players. Explain that one?

 

[xjcaptain]

Any info on what happened to the crew involved? I would think the company and the fed's would be a little concerned about the judgement, not to mention not writing up the hard landing and having a mx inspection done.

 

[Andy Neill]

Actually, STATISTICALLY speaking, if the pilot population is 10% female, they should be involved in 19% of the accidents. There will be an 81% chance of an all male crew, an 18% chance of a mixed gender crew, and a 1% chance of an all female crew (assuming the women are equally represented in the Captain and FO ranks).

 

[Turtlesfly]

I don't know about the female captains (since I haven't flown with one yet by coincidence), but female flight students are the worst. I can't tell you how many times I have been holding in the clouds, IFR, on training flights and they tell me, "I don't care anymore. I'm hungry." Or we're on the 250-mile cross country and they say, "can we divert, I'm tired." Or you ask them if they read the assignment for today and they say, "I'm sorry my boyfriend was in town," or you ask them to do a chandelle and they say, "but I did one yesterday."

Sorry, flame off.

 

[CoATP]

Flawed logic .. perhaps. But it's been proven that 72.6% of the time statistics can be used to prove (or disprove) anything ;-)

Actually if you can find accident statistics that compare % of pilot population with similar experience (hrs/ratings) you will find that skews are not as great as "every other" accident report. I'm sure you will find that if pilots of any gender (perhaps either would be a better word) are in over their heads (read 250 hr pic in a rj) accidents rates are high. So perhaps other correlations skew the report population more than gender.

 

[PropPiedmont]

Any info on what happened to the crew involved? I would think the company and the fed's would be a little concerned about the judgement, not to mention not writing up the hard landing and having a mx inspection done.

I'm pretty sure the captain passed away over a year ago. I think she was diagnosed with cancer and with the added stress of getting fired, she went down hill fast.

Not sure about the FO, but I'm sure she's at FedEx or some place a lot better than Mesa now.

 

[RideTheWind]

I heard the FO was the one that passed of cancer.

 

[ShyFlyGuy]

Actually, STATISTICALLY speaking, if the pilot population is 10% female, they should be involved in 19% of the accidents. There will be an 81% chance of an all male crew, an 18% chance of a mixed gender crew, and a 1% chance of an all female crew (assuming the women are equally represented in the Captain and FO ranks).

Excellent math, Andy! Very well done. I'm thinking of how proud my Calc 1 prof would be of you right now. Excellent math.

As for the argument at hand, all the female pilots I've come across at the CFI level or higher, I've been very impressed by. Wait, that's a preposition. I can't end a sentence in a preposition. Um... All the female pilots I've come across, by which I've been very impressed. Um... By the pilots I've been impressed, are female... no, wait... the impression by CFI pilots are women who I am very impressed... by. Dammit! Nevermind.

Shy

 

[CoATP]

A preposition is a bad word to end a sentence with

 

[stall022]

I heard the FO was the one that passed of cancer.

correct the FO passed of cancer about a year after it happened.. the first captain and FO were fired as well as the second crew. the female captain was I believe rehired and decided not to come back but was rumored to have went to comair for a short time. the FO and second Captain were both rehired. ROA is now part of the training syllabus on the ERJ side aswell as being used to show what a lack of CRM and poor decision making can cause.

 

[Going2Baja]

I just rode Mesa from CLD to PHX on the Dash and the capt had to be one of these guys. He took the highspeed so fast that peoples heads bounced off the window. Then he went way hard on the brakes to stop short of the taxiway. Once cleared it felt like he went to t/o power to start the taxi - taxi speed must have been 40 miles an hour. Back on the brakes to wait to get into the alley. More of the same until shut down.He couldn't wait to get out to see the pax off with his shiney 4 stripes. What a kook! The flight was Jan 31st - only one a day, maybe a mesa guy can look it up. This guy should get a one way trip to the CP.

Two days later on the way back to CLD the flight was great, a good capt this time.

Just more examples of the lack of experience of Mesa crews.

Baja.

 

[bearcat]

I have seen the pictures of that aircrafts tail. its not as noticable as you might think. No rampers noticed the damage, which was very close to the rear cargo door. their were 2 females envolved in this one.

Actually the tail was pretty bent up. There are a couple of exhaust vents that were totally smashed and it did enough damage to twist the aft pressure bulkhead. If it didn't fly from ROA to PIT the next day, or if it had flown in the bozosphere, it could have had some serious pressurization issues.

Yes the cockpit was unmanned. There was an FA in the back that was of alternative lifestyle. Whatever that means.

 

[PropPiedmont]

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/GenPDF.asp?id=NYC02LA013&rpt=fa

 

[Detroitpilot22]

while we are talking about mesa, I just want to say congrats to the mesa crew flying out of KCLT today and the excellent job they did on flying that departure. You know who you are and what you did, I don't even need to say it. It gave me a good laugh. You might think i am talking trash, but i was actually impressed with the way you guys covered it up. Hey, we all make mistakes from time to time, but your comments on the radio were priceless.

 

[ShyFlyGuy]

while we are talking about mesa, I just want to say congrats to the mesa crew flying out of KCLT today and the excellent job they did on flying that departure. You know who you are and what you did, I don't even need to say it. It gave me a good laugh. You might think i am talking trash, but i was actually impressed with the way you guys covered it up. Hey, we all make mistakes from time to time, but your comments on the radio were priceless.

Not cool.

Spill it. What are the chances they're on here tonight. Few. Give us the laugh.

Shy

 

[81Horse]

Historically, approximately 99 percent of all aircraft accidents and incidents have involved white, male pilots. There are half a dozen fatal accident threads active here now -- all involving (apparently white) male pilots. Draw your own conclusions.

I do notice a robust correlation between low time in type/low total time and accident rates. Some newbies will be women or "minorities." When they screw up, nobody ever forgets it and everybody loves to talk about it -- it makes some people feel good about themselves if they believe white males are naturally better pilots.

So this Bonanza incident -- white male, or other? 'Cause apparently this is more important than their flight time and experience.

 

[pianoman]

Ummmm.... Pinnacle flight? CorpEx?

I've flown with some women that are great and some that suck. I think I could say the same about most guys. I will say that a female captain I flew with ties a male captain as the two most together examples of a good PIC I ever shared a cockpit with.

 

[CoATP]

women who are great ... womem who suck --- guys who are great .. guys who suck === I do not wish to know 50% of the people with whom you have flown (the latter half)