Recurrent

[volunteer]

As far as the FAA is concerned....As a Part 91 jet pilot that is compensated (i.e. corporate pilot), do you have to go to recurrent for the PIC check every 12 months or every 24 months? I know common sense, safety, and the insurance company demand every 12 months.Please provide the CFR if you have it. Thanks!

 

[MauleSkinner]

As an ATP, with a few types, you ought to be familiar with
§ 61.58 Pilot-in-command proficiency check: Operation of aircraft requiring more than one pilot flight crewmember.
(a) Except as otherwise provided in this section, to serve as pilot in command of an aircraft that is type certificated for more than one required pilot flight crewmember, a person must -
(1) Within the preceding 12 calendar months, complete a pilot-in-command proficiency check in an aircraft that is type certificated for more than one required pilot flight crewmember; and
(2) Within the preceding 24 calendar months, complete a pilot-in-command proficiency check in the particular type of aircraft in which that person will serve as pilot in command.

 

[volunteer]

As an ATP, with a few types, you ought to be familiar with
§ 61.58 Pilot-in-command proficiency check: Operation of aircraft requiring more than one pilot flight crewmember.
(a) Except as otherwise provided in this section, to serve as pilot in command of an aircraft that is type certificated for more than one required pilot flight crewmember, a person must -
(1) Within the preceding 12 calendar months, complete a pilot-in-command proficiency check in an aircraft that is type certificated for more than one required pilot flight crewmember; and
(2) Within the preceding 24 calendar months, complete a pilot-in-command proficiency check in the particular type of aircraft in which that person will serve as pilot in command.

Yes, I am familiar and can read it. The problem (as you can probably tell from a few other threads that I have started/participated in here) is that I fly with a guy who has 21,000 hours of part 121 time and is very much set in his ways. He does not realize that part 91 is very much different than 121. So, even if you show it to him in print in the FAR's he still tries to apply his logic to it. That logic could be 121 logic, his past 121 carrier's ops manual logic, something that he has made up for himself, or a combination of all of this. Very little of which applies in our part 91 world. So, as a back up to my argument, I usually ask the question here and tap into the vast experience that is present on this board. I can then print the different comments off and usually he will see the light if 10 people are saying the same thing.

 

[A Squared]

well, you don't say what sort of jet, but assuming that you're not flying one ofhte single pilot citations, it's pretty clear. 61.58 (a) requires a PIC check in *a* 2 pilot aircraft every 12 months, and a PIC check in the specific 2 pilot aircraft every 24 months. So if he's flying some other 2 pilot aircraft he has to get a check in at least one of them every 12 months, it he's only flying one 2 pilot airplane, he has to get a check in that one every 12 months. there's no other way to be in compliance with 61.58 (a)(1). How exactly does he argue against that?

note, you don't have to be compensated for this to be a requirement. 61.58 says nothing about flying for hire.

 

[volunteer]

well, you don't say what sort of jet, but assuming that you're not flying one ofhte single pilot citations, it's pretty clear. 61.58 (a) requires a PIC check in *a* 2 pilot aircraft every 12 months, and a PIC check in the specific 2 pilot aircraft every 24 months. So if he's flying some other 2 pilot aircraft he has to get a check in at least one of them every 12 months, it he's only flying one 2 pilot airplane, he has to get a check in that one every 12 months. there's no other way to be in compliance with 61.58 (a)(1). How exactly does he argue against that?

note, you don't have to be compensated for this to be a requirement. 61.58 says nothing about flying for hire.

He seems to think that only the 24 month requirement applies because we only fly one airplane (two-crew required). I don't think that the "and" at the end of 61.58 (a) (1) is registering. It is pretty clear to me in 61.58 also.

 

[MauleSkinner]

He seems to think that only the 24 month requirement applies because we only fly one airplane (two-crew required). I don't think that the "and" at the end of 61.58 (a) (1) is registering. It is pretty clear to me in 61.58 also.

Some of the other guys here know about the 121 rules, I'm sure, but I've always looked at this as pretty much the same way 135 works...

Under IFR 135, the FAA requires you to take a checkride every 6 months (IPC, basically), with an annual recurrent in each type. If you fly two airplanes, you just alternate types every six months for your checkride. This way, you still only have to take one checkride every six months instead of two.

Same for Part 61.58...the FAA wants you to take a checkride every year (61.58(a)(1)), but they allow leeway for multiple types, so that you don't need to take TWO checkrides every year(61.58(a)(2)).

Fly safe!

David