Radar Vectors direct

[Stalled]

If filing an IFR flight plan within say sixty miles of an airport with radar coverage at all times, is it okay to file radar vectors direct? The plane is a /alpha. I've done it numerous times and have had no problems. I just want to verify that it is an appropriate filing method.

I have checked numerous publications but none address the question.

Thanks!

 

[Stalled]

The airport I file to has a VOR on the field and I can receive it within ten miles of the airport I depart. I have filed the victor airway route before and am ALWAYS give radar vectors direct. I just started filing that way because they always gave it to me. I understand that there all kinds of possible radio/nav failures that could happen on any flight. I also realize that if you fly around major airports like I do that you will almost always be on radar vectors.

 

[B-J-J Fighter]

I do it all the time. I fly a twin single pilot and file R.V. Direct all the time. I now have a GNS 530 aboard, but did when I was a /A as well. Its the lazy way to do it. I always file direct now even if Im going a a 1000 miles and just take what they give me.

 

[enigma]

Go to www.propilot.com and look for Docs FAR bulletin board. Ask Doc and you will get the correct answer.

My guess is that filing the way you describe is technically incorrect and as N9103 has pointed out, could leave you up a creek if you ever go NORDO.

regards,
8N

 

[TDTURBO]

That's why you carry a handneld and battery GPS backup so you never have to sweat it.

 

[lookup]

TDTURBO:

Have you ever actually tried to use your handheld in flight? Just for grins sometime, whip it out while IMC and dial up 122.00 and test it out...

From what I understand the only reasonable way to use one is with:
- a headset adapter
- an external antenna
- an external power source (cig lighter plug)

Don't get me wrong, I agree it is a good thing to have, but like any emergency procedure, one must make sure the system will work as hoped.

I keep my Garmin 195 firmly on the yoke and constantly "monitor" my flight... VMC/IMC enroute/approach... The only downside is the rust growing on my non-precision approach skills...

 

[TDTURBO]

I have an ICOM A-23 and I have used it on several occasions without a hitch. Most people don't bother hooking it up until there is a bonified crisis, big mistake. If you're practiced at it, it's like anything else, if you're not, then you're screwed. I can tell you this, it's a heck of a lot easier talking to ATC with a radio and operative VOR (built in), than screaming out of the window at them.

I sleep and fly allot better knowing I don't have to cloud my brain with such superfulous details as lost comm.

With the cables hooked into your headset, you can't tell the difference, maybe some extra static and reduced range but I"m not picky at that point, are you? It will certainly make your flying allot easier and headache free carrying both. Find a way to do it and you won't look back!

 

[bigsky]

In reality you will get direct from atc- however I would file what I would want to do if I lost comms and that way everyone knows what to expect.

 

[Loafman]

TDTURBO:

Have you ever actually tried to use your handheld in flight? Just for grins sometime, whip it out while IMC and dial up 122.00 and test it out...

From what I understand the only reasonable way to use one is with:
- a headset adapter
- an external antenna
- an external power source (cig lighter plug)

Don't get me wrong, I agree it is a good thing to have, but like any emergency procedure, one must make sure the system will work as hoped.

I keep my Garmin 195 firmly on the yoke and constantly "monitor" my flight... VMC/IMC enroute/approach... The only downside is the rust growing on my non-precision approach skills...

Isn't that MY handheld radio you're still borrowing / complaining about?

 

[TXCAP4228]

If I lose coms I am most likely going to lose my nav's as well. Since this is true, the "what if you loose coms" argument is not a legitimate reason to file using an airway or VOR - I most likely will not be able to navigate that way if I am nordo. Be realistic.

I also carry a handheld radio and GPS as backups.

 

[El Cid Av8or]

A few notes about handhelds

As a limited amateur radio operator, I have an Icom T7-H that has a max output of 6 watts. This is when it is connected to an external power source of 11.5 - 14.5 volts DC (i.e. the power point in my truck) and the ouput switch is set to "high". With just the rubber duck antenna, I can successfully reach a repeater station over 15 miles away. When I connect the external antenna, I can do the same at half power output (about 3 watts) or with just running on batteries and max power output. All this is on the ground (relatively flat ground with buildings no higher than 5 floors).

Take that same handheld in the plane and, depending on the weather, I can reach repeater stations over 30 miles away due to the "line of sight" being better and no ground obstacles in the way. I haven't tried it with stations that are more than about 30 miles away yet.

Regarding batteries, NiCd batteries are better than NiMH because they will maintain a constant level of power until they are close to being drained. NiMH batteries will loose available power over the "drain life".

As for connecting the unit to a headset, that will cause more power drain than turning up the volume.

Bottom line is this... A handheld in an aircraft is an excellent idea for backup/redundancy. If you can connect it to a power point in the aircraft and the aircraft's electrical system hasn't gone north (I'm in the south ) and/or an external antenna, you're better off but even just as a bone stock standalone, it's still pretty worthwhile.

The comment about losing navs with comms is pretty accurate since most of the time they are the "same" unit in smaller GA aircraft (i.e. - most singles and light twins) and run off the same power connection.

Keep in mind that you could call another aircraft and have them relay the message to ATC/other ground units too.

 

[lookup]

Posted by Loafman:
Isn't that MY handheld radio you're still borrowing / complaining about?

Loaf,
Yeah, actually it is! It would be helpful if you would pass along the headset adapter!!!

You can have it back once you fly an airplane again instead of that freaking video game you "fly" today!

That reminds me, you obviously don't need that Garmin 295 either... Or does the CRJ need that as a backup too?

 

[LR25]

If the VOR was on the airport, I would file to the VOR, if it wasnt on the airport and close by, I might file to the VOR and then to the FAF of what ever approach would work out for that day.

That way you have a game plan that you and ATC are working from.

You know your going to get RV anyway, just for good measure, I would probobly file something just in case you do lose Comm.

I remember a few years ago going into TEB alot, you would mill over the charts for the best route south, put in a flight plan and you wouldnt even get anything resembling what you filed. So we just started filing direct out of TEB to destination and guess what, you got about the same routing when you called for the clearance.

Those are fun departures out of there in a Lear 25 for the noise abatement.