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QX EXCO calls B.S. on G0Jets; supports TSA pilots

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theo said:
No I don't miss the point at all. I just don't agree with it. GJ is no different than any other Regional Airline.

again Theo, do you work there??

are you proud of GJ?
do you respect the company?
are you excited about the prospect down the road of mgmt filtering flying back to TSA and encouraging furloughed GJ pilots to send a resume over to TSA?
do you walk with your head held high waxing lyrical about the heady old days of GJ's history when the company was built from scratch on the backs of other good hard working americans? a good honest company, no?

I'll state it again - you are VERY wrong. GJ is EXTREMELY DIFFERENT than every other regional airline (original freedom excepted). It's sad that the "S" word is so narrow in scope.
 
spiffomatic said:
This is completely incorrect Theo, and the facts need to stay out there.I will respond to your opinions because there are no facts included.

GJ is VERY VERY different than every other regional airline - original freedom excepted. There's a difference between fair competition between two different companies in a capitalistic market, and a company exploiting a very debatable contractual loophole What loophole? If there was something done against your agreement where is the lawsuit or grievance that would surely be won by ALPA? There isnt any because you had no leg to stand on in your argument (as usual)(that was deemed legal,because it is but probably should not have, says youfollowing the precedent set at CHQ/Republic where a negotiation took place between the Teamsters and Republic/Chautauqua and a deal was struck.Same thing could have happened at Trans States but in this case no deal was struck. - either way, it was morally and ethically questionable).When the contractual agreement between two parties doesnt get you what you want you try to say even though it isnt in our agreement you should give it to us anyway. Unfortuanatly for you the real world does'nt work that way. You get what you negotiate. Remember that in the future and your frustration will ease. Do YOU want to work for a company that has a history of strong-arming its employees to gain any advantage, I expect every negotiations between a company and a union to include strong arming tactics. Hell that is what you are most upset about here. The fact that you don't have leverage against TSA is why you and most of the zealots are upset about. If you succeeded you would be crowing about how you have the company over a barrell and watch how you bring them to their knees when next you negotiate. Since they bested you on the leverage front now you only have the sour grapes approach which is employed quite often by the zealots posting on this subject. or one that at least attempts to level with its employees? It's sort of like expecting a sound relationship with a woman who picked you up at a bar - and you later found out was already solidly married - not gonna happen. I dont know about you but if a woman picks me up in a bar a sound relationship is the last thing on my mind. Is that what you really expect from that? Really? Besides I would say if she is picking people up in a bar her marriage aint that solid.

Do YOU want to work for a company that will likely turn around and do the same to you, filtering flying back and forth between two competing entities to keep costs sub-walmart low? I think again the facts are that payrates at both TSA and Go Jet are higher than many other Regional Carriers. They've already reset many of their costs to year 1 payscale. What a great idea!! Just like any new company that is one of the cost advantages they have. How do you think Jet Blue has such low costs? Do YOU want a career there??? I already have one and right now I am not looking for another one. However if I were Go Jet would be a place I look because I believe they will grow a great deal over the next few years and it will probably be a great opportunity for a lot of pilots. Do YOU RESPECT what they've done? I don't disrespect what they have done. I think they are just like every other buisness out there doing what they can to get a leg up on the competition. In a lot of ways they have shown a great deal of intelligence in recognizing the situation and responding to it. Is this HONORABLE business or is it snake oil and shady deals? Again , nothing dishonorable about what is happening. no agreements broken, no laws broken, no fraud occuring that we are aware of. So what is dishonorable here? Better start shopping at wal-mart and polish up that greeter resume so you can work there at age 60, Thanks for your concern for me but I think I will be just fine when I turn 60.because if you turn a blind eye to a company doing this to it's employees, you effectively approve of it. As you can see from my reply I don't agree with much of your take on Go Jet. You continue to miss my point that approving or disapproving is not the issue. The TSA MEC blowing the opportunity to corral this flying is the real crime here. TSA pilots should feel upset and frustrated because their leaders appear dimwitted or just plain out of touch with reality. Better MEC leadership is where I think people should be concentrating their efforts. Not on this continual sour grapes attitude toward a legitimate airline producing jobs for many people in the years to come.

Seriously Theo, do you work there?

Ok there is my response. Take care.
 
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UEJ500 said:
Unfortunately, 75% of Trans States Pilots didn't think it was important to set the example to the industry that companies cannot get away with something like this. Being a TSA pilot, I was very upset at the outcome of how our union leaders got the contract shut down. This happened at a time when the industry took an ubrupt turn for the worse and now we have to negotiate a new contract in this environment.

At first, it was the companies fault. The end result now is the fault of the TSA MEC.

Thanks guys for all of the hard work you did that put us and other companies in the present situation.

Yes, I was part of the 25% that voted for the contract that would have put an end to this B.S., Just wait for some of the responses to this post to see how I was treated for my opinion, which now we all know was right.

To all of the QX pilots and any others that might be affected by G0Jet, I'd like to personally say that I am sorry. If the MEC at my company had any class, they would do the same.



So your stand is that you were right all along and that 75% of the TSA pilot group have their collective heads up their as$es? That's a pretty arrogant position to take. You are DECIDEDLY in the minority. THAT is a fact. I would not claim that the TSA pilot leadership is perfect. Monday morning quarterbacking a decision now is pointless.

The pilots looked at the deal the company was offering; 4 year extension of a contract already routinely violated, and near-industry bottom 70 seat rates, furlough protection for those already at GJ (at least they refused to include language ruling it out), and said, "no thanks."

Oh, and almost without exception, the pilots I speak to from day to day from other companies usually ask about the GJ issue. I have yet to meet one who didn't offer their support and voice their feelings towards the GJ pilots. The one recurring request I have heard is for an updated list of the GJ pilots so that they can be welcomed with the open arms they deserve.
 

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