Questions about ALPA and it's history

[JP4user]

its a mirror.....

With a very large smoke machine.

 

[JP4user]

And the "weak and spineless" are who you have voted in as your elected LEC and MEC....right? Are there no leaders in your pilot group?

Tejas

My pilot group today is numbered at 4 with one contract pilot.

But the trend nowadays seems to be getting people that promise the moon and get elected. They then slide into a politcal protection mode to avoid at all costs to return to the line and work under the miserable conditions of their constituents.

It is very difficult to dislodge elected reps.

 

[Catbird]

Ignore the ALPA National Towel Boys. Worthless has them perched at the computer to deliver the ALPA National babbling at a moments notice. Guess what? The working pilots are paying these Chamber Maids a large sum to keep Worthless and his scumbags living the high life. If you don't believe ALPA National pays these morons a big salary to dispense the BS your mistaken.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

But the trend nowadays seems to be getting people that promise the moon and get elected. They then slide into a politcal protection mode to avoid at all costs to return to the line and work under the miserable conditions of their constituents.

Do expect politicans to be any different here? I candidate is running for office! of course he is going to promise the moon. He wants your vote!

What do you mean nowadays... fact is your [misaligned] expectations were being met during your career. At the winter of it, your pension was robbed and pride ripped from you. But before then life was pretty good to the point you really didn't have to concern yourself with the politics and events of ALPA. You could come to work, fly your trip and afford to be indifferent. Fact is times were relatively good and there were volunteers behind the scences cutting a path so you'd have the luxury of just flying your trip and going home.

The indifferent union pilot who shows up, flies his trip and goes home is one of the worst, because he takes for granted what was hard fought for...

From Flying the Line, Vol. 1, page 227:

Inevitably, a new generation arrived made up of pilots less steeped in the past struggles and more content about the professional status ALPA had created for them. The new generation was also increasingly indifferent to ALPA and its administration. Pioneer pilots, by and large, paid close attention to ALPA affairs, and they couldn’t understand the lackadaisical attitude of the younger pilots, partically when it came to governance at the local level. By the late 1950s, many pilots simply took for granted that somebody else would do the hard work needed to sustain ALPA. While complacent pilots golfed or pursued second careers, a minority ran ALPA’s local affairs on each airline.

Although most of these individuals were dedicated to making ALPA work, on some airlines a few pilots used ALPA as a gimmick for personal aggrandizement. The indifference of the rank and file and the poor attendance at local council meetings meant that a minority on any airline could, with proper planning, seize control and eventually dominate the master executive council (MEC) itself. The danger was that a well-organized clique could speak for an indifferent majority of pilots.

​

It is very difficult to dislodge elected reps.

Well, that is very evident. That is why it is critical to be a part of the process, not indifferent. With 30% particpation in elections, of course it is difficult to recall reps. How are pilots going to organize themselves to recall when they can't even take 90sec to vote during pre-organized elections!

Responsibility is for big boys.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

It is very difficult to dislodge elected reps.

Sure it takes some hard work....but it is not impossible. I've seen recalls take place more than once.

Tejas

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Sure it takes some hard work....but it is not impossible. I've seen recalls take place more than once.

Tejas

How about the NWA MEC...................

 

[maru657]

Reference Flying the line Vol, 1 page 227, An original member of ALPA and former MEC said to me, "We worked for years and years to get the wages and working conditions of the avarage US pilot above that of the itinerant farm worker and then they failed the IQ test and started thinking they were republicans".

 

[Vastly Underemp]

ALPA....the most expensive magazine subscription I've ever had.

My a$$ still hurts from their "representation" but at least they told me they loved me.....

 

[81Horse]

... and then they failed the IQ test and started thinking they were republicans". ...

Had to see this again.

 

[A350]

I love the posts on here from the cheerleaders.....

Complaints lodged, careers decimated or lost altogether, pensions gone, and the wholesale destruction of the profession and its standards are here today and the best you guys can come up with is that the blame belongs to the apathy of the membership?

Thanks. Where else can you get screwed out of your hard earned career and pension by a bunch of spineless whimps who won't even let you vote on the loss of your pension and then they tell you that YOU are the reason it happened.

Very sad.


A350

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

ALPA....the most expensive magazine subscription I've ever had.

My a$$ still hurts from their "representation" but at least they told me they loved me.....

The dumbest remarks usually come from the most ignorant.

I like pages 25-31 in this months issue...

I love the posts on here from the cheerleaders.....

Complaints lodged, careers decimated or lost altogether, pensions gone, and the wholesale destruction of the profession and its standards are here today and the best you guys can come up with is that the blame belongs to the apathy of the membership?

Thanks. Where else can you get screwed out of your hard earned career and pension by a bunch of spineless whimps who won't even let you vote on the loss of your pension and then they tell you that YOU are the reason it happened.

Very sad.


A350

Unions seem to be doing fine over at SWA......

Maybe it isn't entirely the unions fault....

The apathy results in pilots not understanding the way things work. With misguided expectations when things don't go your way, the lack of understanding only evolves into conspiracy therioes and paranoia.

I sat near two business men on a flight and they convinced themselves that pilots flew across the USA by looking for cities and flying from one to the next. If explained to them about VORs and GPS would they accept it or still believe thier uneducated rationale was correct....

Your education is up to you...


If a flight is delayed and the passegers are not told what is wrong and why, when they finally get to thier destination they are pissed...just like you.

But if you explain, educate, inform, etc... Then they get off the jet in a neutral or positive mood. People understand everything doesn't go right, that life is not fair or perfect, they just want to know what is going on.

One of ALPA's fault's is they have done a poor job keep the pilot educated as to HOW the political process works. And becuase of that pilots are like un-updated passengers stuck in a tube.

But you are big boys. You can read for yourself:

Flying the Line Vol I and II
Confessions of a Union Buster
Hard Landing
Nuts
The SWA Way
ALPA CBA
ALPA C&BL
Attend LEC meetings.
Vote.

At our last LEC meeting a pilot brought up ALPA President pay, when asked where he got his information he admitted it was hersay. Education and information are critical.

Most pilots intro to ALPA was a 30-60 min meeting during new hire class. At that time, no one is concerned with ALPA. They have memory items, flows and profiles to learn. The ALPA rep says, we'll protect your job and get you better pay. And that is it... Those are a pilots expectations of ALPA...for the next 20+ years. And when those expectations are not meet, pilots get pissed.

Unions are only has good as the membership who votes in the Officers. Is the gov't perfect? Your church? Time to get real. How is increasing your education and information going to hurt? It will only improve our situation.

I know, all of the above is boring, lacks instant gratification, and requires individual thought.....

Bashing on Flight Info is soooo much more fun...