Question to get me to Majors

[akseiner]

I have been instructing the last 1000 hrs, I am getting ready for my first regional job. So my question is: Which would be a better move to get me to the majors, 1.Should I try for one that I can upgrade in one year but it would be a B1900. 2.Or for one that I would be in a rj but upgrade would be 2-3 years.

I have 1500TT and 100multi. Thanks for any suggestions.

 

[RadioClash]

I would take the fast upgrade. Turbine 121 PIC is what you need. I have not heard of any companies giving a preference to RJ time vs Turboprop time. Anyone know of any? I would go for the fastest 121 PIC time.

 

[Socalplt]

As for someone who took the RJ route, I'd say go and get the job with the fastest upgrade. I didnt start logging turbine PIC until four years into the 121 flying.

 

[135fr8r]

First of all, I'd go somewhere I could handle working a few years. More than likely, you wont be out of there as soon as you get that 1000 pic. From what I've been reading, the most competitive guys have at least 1500-2000 pic turbine, and 4000-7000 total. That's just what I've seen.

Last but not least, network, and get to know people at other airlines. This is a must!!!

 

[akseiner]

Thanks for the quick response guys. That is very helpful. A regional pilot I know said that Continental is hiring guys without 121 pic, is that right, or did I hear wrong?

 

[BigPappa]

check their website for the actual requirements

 

[135fr8r]

AirTran is the only one who requires previous 121 time. They require 500 hrs 121 pic time as part of their mins.

 

[Big Beer Belly]

A regional pilot I know said that Continental is hiring guys without 121 pic, is that right, or did I hear wrong?

EVERY airline hires lots of guys without 121 PIC.

BBB

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

Multi-turbine PIC is King. Doesn't matter whether its part 91,135 or 121. Get the job with the fastest upgrade and never give up no matter what anyone on this board says.

Good luck.

 

[MECH]

Get an internship at a major. It is the only way to get hired at a major with low time!!

 

[GuppyPuppy]

JB requires 1000 hours in airplanes over 20,000lbs, I think. The B-1900 time won't help you there.

But then again, with the way this job is going I don't know why people actually aspire to work here.

GP

 

[Krapflier]

I would take the fast upgrade. Turbine 121 PIC is what you need. I have not heard of any companies giving a preference to RJ time vs Turboprop time. Anyone know of any? I would go for the fastest 121 PIC time.

Air Tran there's one for ya. Dont like the Turboprop drivers.

 

[Phaedrus]

Krap: Wrong.

 

[propilot]

Air Tran there's one for ya. Dont like the Turboprop drivers.

Not true. A friend of mine who was flying Saabs with red tails, was hired in May.

 

[RadioClash]

Krap,

Had a few guys in my class that were previous turboprop guys. Not sure where you are getting your info.

 

[skiav8tor]

JB requires 1000 hours in airplanes over 20,000lbs, I think. The B-1900 time won't help you there.

But then again, with the way this job is going I don't know why people actually aspire to work here.

GP

Actually, it's 1000 PIC in aircraft (of any type) over 20K lbs., or 1000 PIC in turbojet aircraft over 12,500 lbs.

 

[ATRCAPT]

Don't come down with a case of SJS (Shining Jet Syndrome). GO WHERE YOU WILL GET PIC TURBINE THE FASTEST!!!!

 

[Cobra]

Thanks for the quick response guys. That is very helpful. A regional pilot I know said that Continental is hiring guys without 121 pic, is that right, or did I hear wrong?

Unfortunately the short answer is yes-this is true. However, these types of newhires had numerous letters of recs and fast tracking through the CP's office both at EWR and IAH.

 

[linecheck]

Go with the company that will treat you the best, and pay you the most. With age 60 on the horizon in conjunction with legacy airline consolodation (mergers) there could be significant stagnation for pilots and their career progression. Choose the airline that will not necessarily give you the "quickest upgrade" rather the one that will allow you to enjoy the job all the while meeting your personal needs.

Good luck.

 

[Alcatraz]

You need to decide what's best for you.

If you want the quick upgrade in the Beech, you will probably have to deal with crappy pay and work rules for a while... can you stand that? Jet PIC is better (in my opinion) than prop PIC, but not by much. My PIC time was in The Almighty Beech, and it served me well at several big airplane airlines down the road.

If you've got a family that's depending on you as a sole source of income, I don't recommend counting on upgrading fast or being hired on by someone better shortly after getting that 1000 PIC, since that never seems to happen as fast as you think.

Also, don't believe much of what an airline recruiter tells you. Current upgrade time (which many recuiters use) is NOT indicative of future upgrade time!

Good luck!

 

[It will roll]

Akseiner, I am currently pondering a similar question. This subject has been debated many times and the majority always says PIC time no matter what. Well, I am currently at one of those "quick upgrade" operations flying the Saab. I went there because they filled my head with all sorts of kool-aid, 13 month upgrade, 50 seat turboprop mumbo jumbo, whatever. Well, its been just under 1 year now and 13 month upgrade? nope. 50 seat turboprop? nope. It wont be too much longer, maybe 2 years total to upgrade. Twice what I expected though, and 2nd year at 23/hr too! Holy ramen noodles batman. So now I am at a cross-roads. Do I suck it up (It really isn't THAT bad) and stay with crap paychecks, no frills airline type deal or do I go to one of those sweeeet jet operators with my 121 time? I have no idea. I've never been more undecided on anything than I am now. Sure PIC is cool and helps you get out of this regional mess, but does that mean you want to spend the next 4 years wishing you were at another airline, so you can apply at a major 1 or 2 years earlier. I know most people will argue that that 1 or two years can be the difference between reserve on a 73 and ca on a 75, etc, and to an extent they are right. I just turned 23, so I feel no need to rush into anything. Maybe your age should be a guide. If you are older, better to get the process going quickly. If you are low/mid 20's, maybe you can afford to wait the extra 2 years for upgrade. G-d knows its nicer to be in a plane with an APU in the winter/summer. I'm not sure what your personality is, but mine is always thinking bigger/better. That type of personality is not well suited to "suck it up" on a Saab for 5 years while I wait for CAL to maybe call me. Who knows though, I'm very young and this is a tough call for me, probally my hardest yet. Someone before did make a VERY good point. The jet regional may be advertising 2-3 year upgrade now, but the key question is, will it still be the same in 2-3 years? Even at my place, they tell new hires 15 months to upgrae. NO. The people they are upgrading now have been here 15-18 months. But for a new hire it will longer. That is how I stand on the situation, hopefully that will help sway you one way or the other. I just wish I could figure out what the heck to do also...

 

[Alcatraz]

Another point I'd like to make: another benefit of some of the smaller regionals is the better networking (yes, at a smaller regional).

I worked at Skyway, which is small compared to Comair and Eagle, and only has one domicile, so most of us got to know one another fairly well (for better or for worse ). But since I knew most of the pilots there pretty well I've been able to get help getting on at an airline or two, and been able to help a few of them, too.

I've known friends at larger regionals (such as Eagle) where they rarely fly with the same person very often, and simply getting interview info or a letter of rec is a little more challenging for them.

Smaller airlines also tend to have higher volatility with upgrade time. A ten airplane operator, for example, could have a rapid upgrade time if it gets ten more airplanes in two years. A hundred airplane operator, on the other hand, is very unlikely to get another hundred airplanes in four years! But either could be stagnant, and downgrades tend to be more volatile at smaller carriers for the same reasons.

Just my two cents...

 

[GuppyPuppy]

Actually, it's 1000 PIC in aircraft (of any type) over 20K lbs., or 1000 PIC in turbojet aircraft over 12,500 lbs.

Well....that's not what it reads on the JB website:

IV. Minimum Qualifications:

• 1500 hours total time in airplanes (excluded: Helicopter, Simulator, Flight Engineer time)
• 1000 hours turbine in airplanes
• 1000 hours Pilot in Command Time*
• 1000 hours in airplanes at or above 20,000 pounds (maximum takeoff weight) or 1000 hours in large jet-powered airplanes at or above 12,500 pounds (maximum takeoff weight)

Therefore, you could have 1,000 PIC in a C-152 and 1000 hours in the right seat of a Brasilia and technically qualify.

Cheers!

GP

 

[jergar999]

Krap, do you live in KRAP?

 

[akseiner]

Get an internship at a major. It is the only way to get hired at a major with low time!!

This is something I am unfamiliar with. How does it work, how do you get one, etc.??

 

[Alcatraz]

Regarding an internship with a major...

This is something I am unfamiliar with. How does it work, how do you get one, etc.??

If you are a student at a university/college and majoring in some sort of aviation program, you may be able to intern with an airline. Flight majors would work as interns for a semester or so in a chief pilot's office, training department, or something with flight safety, for example. If you're not familiar with this option, chances are you can't do it.

Some offered guaranteed interviews or a lowering of minimums/competitive minimums for reasons I never quite fully understood.

I never did one (most used to be unpaid, so I couldn't afford it), so I don't know all the details.

 

[Quimby]

Go for the turbine PIC at your first chance. Build as much as you can, as quickly as you can.

 

[It will roll]

Regarding internships at the Majors, my college had a few choices for those. Went to Embry-Riddle. ----Insert jokes here---- although I dont think im an over confident 300 hour wonder flying a CRJ 700 for go jets like most people make our grads out to be like. ANYWAYS. I know personally of a few that did the Continental intenship, not that they were physic, just that they thought it would be a great experience to be at a major instead of a regional. Well, the 2 that i know of, are now 24 year old 757 FO's!! No joke. 1000 jet sic and they were in like a senior taking a freshman to prom. Lucky for me I did the ACA/Independence Air internship................................

 

[Big Slick]

Join the Air National Guard / Air Force Reserve. If you fly an F-16, for example, you can log jet PIC from day one. Plus, all your buds in the unit will be airline pilots.