Question to any ATController

[FlyWolf]

I have a question to any controller.

If you ask some aircraft to descend to a different altitude (ie, descend and maintain FL240) what kind of rate do you expect to see that aircraft do?

I am trying to find it in the AIM, till then, thankyou

 

[paulsalem]

AIM 4-4-9. Adherence to Clearance

d. When ATC has not used the term "AT PILOT'S DISCRETION" nor imposed any climb or descent restrictions, pilots should initiate climb or descent promptly on acknowledgement of the clearance. Descend or climb at an optimum rate consistent with the operating characteristics of the aircraft to 1,000 feet above or below the assigned altitude, and then attempt to descend or climb at a rate of between 500 and 1,500 fpm until the assigned altitude is reached. If at anytime the pilot is unable to climb or descend at a rate of at least 500 feet a minute, advise ATC. If it is necessary to level off at an intermediate altitude during climb or descent, advise ATC, except when leveling off at 10,000 feet MSL on descent, or 2,500 feet above airport elevation (prior to entering a Class C or Class D surface area), when required for speed reduction.

 

[FlyWolf]

Thanks Paul

 

[Grey Ghost]

I have a question to any controller.

If you ask some aircraft to descend to a different altitude (ie, descend and maintain FL240) what kind of rate do you expect to see that aircraft do?

I am trying to find it in the AIM, till then, thankyou

Try the AIM! Optimum rate consistent with safety until within 1000ft then climb or descend 500-1500/fpm! uh, I think!:erm:

 

[paulsalem]

Thanks Paul

No problem.

 

[EX_CV580FR8Dawg]

hey wolfie...what paul said! How are those twins doing Paul? Nice Avatar....timeto get the old guy off of mine

 

[paulsalem]

hey wolfie...what paul said! How are those twins doing Paul? Nice Avatar....timeto get the old guy off of mine

Thanks. I wish I new how they were doing EX_CV580FR8Dawg...I wish I knew.

 

[Sig]

I have a related question:

Let's say I'm given a descent to X, cross ABC at (same) X. Do you want me to be level at the new altitude exactly at the fix, or can I descend now (say I'm 20 miles out) and "drag" it to the fix?

Got my peepee whacked by a captain for doing a 3:1 descent to be level exactly at the fix. It worked, like it always does, but he wanted me down NOW to cross LATER.

 

[EX_CV580FR8Dawg]

I have a related question:

Let's say I'm given a descent to X, cross ABC at (same) X. Do you want me to be level at the new altitude exactly at the fix, or can I descend now (say I'm 20 miles out) and "drag" it to the fix?

Got my peepee whacked by a captain for doing a 3:1 descent to be level exactly at the fix. It worked, like it always does, but he wanted me down NOW to cross LATER.

Better to be down a lil before than a lil after...

Are you hand flying the descents?

 

[glasspilot]

...........

 

[glasspilot]

I have a related question:

Let's say I'm given a descent to X, cross ABC at (same) X. Do you want me to be level at the new altitude exactly at the fix, or can I descend now (say I'm 20 miles out) and "drag" it to the fix?

Got my peepee whacked by a captain for doing a 3:1 descent to be level exactly at the fix. It worked, like it always does, but he wanted me down NOW to cross LATER.

Your "Captain" is wrong if I read your post correctly. If the clearance is to cross ABC at 10,000ft and you stay level and the fly a decent profile that hits ABC at 10,000 you have complied. If your 300 miles from ABC and start down now to then fly level at 10,000 for 240 miles then you have complied also. The problem is the later profile burns much more fuel and any Captain worth his salt would prefer the first profile.

 

[PreContact]

Don't forget that you should limit climbs/descents in RVSM airspace to no greater than 1000 fpm to avoid nuisance TCAS RAs.

 

[glasspilot]

Don't forget that you should limit climbs/descents in RVSM airspace to no greater than 1000 fpm to avoid nuisance TCAS RAs.

Climbs: Fine, my plane will barely do that in RVSM airspace anyway.


Descents: Screw that. Show me that in the regs and I'll show you a reg that A.) No one follows; B.) ATC doesn't want you to do; and C.) Is stupid, stupid, stupid.

 

[paulsalem]

Descents: Screw that. Show me that in the regs and I'll show you a reg that A.) No one follows; B.) ATC doesn't want you to do; and C.) Is stupid, stupid, stupid.

Well that solves it.

 

[Rythm3]

Don't forget that you should limit climbs/descents in RVSM airspace to no greater than 1000 fpm to avoid nuisance TCAS RAs.

That would only be for the last 1,000 feet.

 

[Oakum_Boy]

Climbs: Fine, my plane will barely do that in RVSM airspace anyway.


Descents: Screw that. Show me that in the regs and I'll show you a reg that A.) No one follows; B.) ATC doesn't want you to do; and C.) Is stupid, stupid, stupid.

That's really not bright. Why not increase your initial descent rate so you CAN do 1500 fpm in the last 1000-2000'

And if you're going into an airport that crosses arriving and departing traffic with 1000' separation, you WILL force a TCAS RA if you're diving at 3000 fpm to make the fix. The same goes for climbing out.

When I do get those TA's and occasional RA's, I'll know it must be you blundering through the skies with the blessing of ATC. Thanks.

 

[NCherches]

PreContract - Can you send me that picture you use for your profile... good stuff.

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