Question(s) for King Air Pilots

[Coool Hand Luke]

Gentlemen,

I am new to the King Air (350 if it matters). The Collins Proline 21 is nice and the aircraft flies great but I'd like some input:

(1) How do you conduct/complete your pre-flight/takeoff power runup at airports that are not condusive for such things, like Aspen or Eagle/Vail (et al).

It seems like:

(a) you would be blocking all aircraft behind you that don't need to do a runup; and

(b) with the lack of a runup area any aircraft that is directly behind you has the potential for FOD damage (I know I wouldn't like it).

Also, like I mentioned, it handles great once it's in the air, but is very much a pig on the ground. Any tips on this?

Finally, props MAX or 1500 for landing? I've done both. I prefer MAX. Those that choose 1500 mentioned they do it for noise considerations. Don't you think that if you slowly bring the props to MAX the pax wouldn't even notice the change, plus the landing is much less abrupt as the props don't "dump" like they do at 1500.

Thanks in advance for your input.

Cool Hand

 

[LJ45]

most King air drivers don't do run-ups much.

 

[TransMach]

KingAir Technique

I've not flown the BE-300/350 airplanes but have a lot of experience in the BE-E90 and Super 200.

Regards run-ups, the companies I worked for considered run-ups a maintenance function and flight crew only did them in training and first flight or last flight of each week.

Regards prop RPM on landing, we always left them in the cruise setting for smooth transition to landing. If single engine then they would be set to max.

TransMach

 

[Coool Hand Luke]

most King air drivers don't do run-ups much.

Yep, what I was thinking as well. But I have company SOP's to comply with.

 

[junkjockey]

Ive never heard of it handling like a pig on the ground. We always operated with props full forward on t/o and ldg. Try going props full forward on landing if u think it handles poorly. It'll stop very quick. Runups...I tried to do the autofeather check and cycle the props at high rpm each morning as first flight of the day check. Pax didnt seem to mind considering you were checking critical systems. Great airplane...wish i was still flying it. Have fun

 

[Coool Hand Luke]

Ive never heard of it handling like a pig on the ground. We always operated with props full forward on t/o and ldg. Try going props full forward on landing if u think it handles poorly. It'll stop very quick. Runups...I tried to do the autofeather check and cycle the props at high rpm each morning as first flight of the day check. Pax didnt seem to mind considering you were checking critical systems. Great airplane...wish i was still flying it. Have fun

I am referring to Taxi, but I have not flown anything without a tiller in quite a few years either.

Also, how did you coplete the Auto-feather, Secondary and Primary governor checks with another aircraft behind you?

 

[kingairyahoo]

(1) How do you conduct/complete your pre-flight/takeoff power runup at airports that are not condusive for such things, like Aspen or Eagle/Vail (et al).


It seems like:

(a) you would be blocking all aircraft behind you that don't need to do a runup; and

(b) with the lack of a runup area any aircraft that is directly behind you has the potential for FOD damage (I know I wouldn't like it).

Also, like I mentioned, it handles great once it's in the air, but is very much a pig on the ground. Any tips on this?

Finally, props MAX or 1500 for landing? I've done both. I prefer MAX. Those that choose 1500 mentioned they do it for noise considerations. Don't you think that if you slowly bring the props to MAX the pax wouldn't even notice the change, plus the landing is much less abrupt as the props don't "dump" like they do at 1500.

Thanks in advance for your input.

Cool Hand

runups...we do em once a day, usually first flight of the day and/or empty leg. BUT, if I am flying the same plane back to back, it turns into once a week as you get to know the airplane and its associated quirks.

pig on the ground...no comprende

as for the rpms...we bring em up once the power levers go to idle, then nothing changes. the only other time we bring em up high would be on a low minimum approach, or if we were stacked in tight...in other words in preperation for a possible go around.

lol...if you think the props dump in a 350, you havent flown an old straight C90...id rather have em go to ground idle on the ground than 50 feet in the air

 

[FO4life]

I've always done the checks (once a day) just cock the plane one way or the other as to not blast anyone behind you, and I left the props back at what ever cruize was, the plane uses hardly any runway to begin with might as well leave it quite. just my 2 cents. back in my A100 days with thoes 4 props hanging out.... boy if you brought out any of the 600lbs torque before touch down the paxs were well aware of your arrival. good times....good times

 

[Hawker800]

Flew the 350 for 10yrs. Loved the thing. Wish we still had it. Do not understand the pig business on the ground. Will even taxi backwards when needed if you know how. As for the props, pull them back to 1500 for the climb and cruise, ease them forward for the final approach. They now can get you out of trouble or stop you quickly after landing. Have fun.

 

[cjdriver]

Some of my best memories are flying with my dad in the King Air. He was a master in that plane, 10k hours in it at least.

 

[pilothouston123]

It won't taxi/turn on a dime like my G2, It really helps to use differantial power when turning. Might need grease in the front strut in order to get the nose wheel turning normaly. Besides whats said in your checklist, props on normal landings are a personal preference. Low vis or X-wind props full for most guys.

 

[kingairyahoo]

It won't taxi/turn on a dime like my G2, It really helps to use differantial power when turning.

huh???? diff power ROCKS...i can use just enough power one one side to get the prop off the stops, ground fine on the opposite prop and the ground fine tire will turn 360* in its own shadow...spin on a dime and give ya back 9 cents change :smash:

 

[Coool Hand Luke]

huh???? diff power ROCKS...i can use just enough power one one side to get the prop off the stops, ground fine on the opposite prop and the ground fine tire will turn 360* in its own shadow...spin on a dime and give ya back 9 cents change :smash:

Nice pointer yahoo. I never thought about using ground fine on the turn side. (still wish I had a tiller though) Thanks!

 

[cvsfly]

Sounds like a fairly new BE-350. Sounds like nose wheel steering maybe stiff. Check MX logs to see if it has ever had the strut serviced. Often new planes or fresh out of mx service the strut ends up under serviced with grease (has to be worked in a little). But yeah to turn smoothly you will use differential power. To turn tight in a parking space don't slow so much as to almost stop as you make the turn. Keep some speed in turn, differential power (bring in enough power on outside engine to carry momentum around), and of course inside brake (but don't stop wheel from rolling). As a standard SOP props (checklist) go forward on short final. But this is a preference thing which is more pronounced in different models. Flew a 200 with 4 blade props- max rpm is 2000, cruise is 1700 (and cabin had static noise canceling for 1700 rpm. Normally landed at 1700 and briefed (normally flew 2 pilots) pnf to push props forward on landing at idle power. I usually carried pwr all thru the touchdown (and on long runway kept nose wheel off as long as practical) and had some pnfs that would slam props forward as soon as the mains touched. Got a slight surge when that happened. In training and check rides it is better to set it (props forward) and forget it. You are ready for go-around, short field and little crew coordination involved. Train like you fly? With props forward, pulling power on short final will have the props flatten out even more and the props will be like barn doors assuring an abrupt arrival (especially on 4 blade vs 3 blade) so keep power on to the landing. On an F-90, max rpm is 1900 vs 1800-1700 rpm for cruise so noise difference is not much different on appr. so I go props forward all the time. On an E-90 max rpm is 2200 and cruise is 1800 - (noisy) larger difference and the preference is land props at cruise and push up on landing.

 

[Kingairrick]

Since we're talking 350, the props will not flatten on you when you pull the power back to idle in the flare because of the ground/flight low pitch stops (not in the 200/B200). I always eased them up to full forward on final to be ready for a go around, as mentioned above by hawker800.
As for the ground handling, the differential power technique works wonders.
I rarely did the full runup with pax on board, but I had lots of empty legs to make sure the stuff was working...

 

[cheyflyer]

Not sure about the pig part and what its doing to/for you, but......

When we got ours last year, (late 90's model) it was all over the place on taxi. With just slight addition of power it would lunge left or right and could hear the props going on/off the gov (??) I guess, but would also pit a zero turn radius mower to shame on turns. I had the shop check the rigging and they made some changes and adjustments and then my steering went to hell. Also heard about the nose strut servicing issue as well and had every fitting possible on the nose greased and that seemed to help.

HBS in KSAT mentioned that from the factory they tend to underservice the nose due to grease squirting out and getting all over the plane, so if yours is new, have them grease the strut if you are having problems turning. Mine seems to be doing fine now, taxi's straight and turns ok, not as good as before but I dont think I look drunk on taxi anymore.

cf

 

[cvsfly]

Since we're talking 350, the props will not flatten on you when you pull the power back to idle in the flare because of the ground/flight low pitch stops (not in the 200/B200). I always eased them up to full forward on final to be ready for a go around, as mentioned above by hawker800.
As for the ground handling, the differential power technique works wonders.
I rarely did the full runup with pax on board, but I had lots of empty legs to make sure the stuff was working...

Forgot about the low pitch stop on 350 and F90. No experience on 350, but F90 with 4 blade will still flatten a bit (to the stop) with idle power. Best appr are with a little power all the way to touch down.

 

[Hawker800]

Steering issues. There is a plate located in the nose wheel bay held in place by four bolts. I forget what it is called but attaches to the steering arm. They worked loose on mine and it jerked all over the place. Maintenance could not find the issue until a new helper was cleaning the extra lube off. He spotted the loose bolts. That fixed the problem. Those having such problems may want to have this checked.

 

[Coool Hand Luke]

You guys are great. Thanks for those tips on the nose steering. It seems to wander off on its own with just the least bit of inattention (like when you are trying to accomplish taxi checks) . Yes, it is a nearly new 350 and it does not fly all that much either. I'll talk with our techs about the adjustments/rigging and the possible lack of grease. Then again, it could just be all in my head.