Question for a pilot...

[cactus320mech]

Not too long ago we had an emergency landing here at LAX. An A320 landed with a front landing gear cocked and locked at 90 degrees from center. The pilot managed an absolutely perfect landing that had me stunned. Later reading I found out that this wasn't an isolated incident. My question is do they practice for this? What are the procedures used in terms of reverse thrust, brakes, and adjustments to Vref are made to accomplish this? I also noticed that the spoilers were not deployed...

 

[User546]

I remember watching that A320 land like it was yesterday!

Your correct it wasn't an isolated incident. I called up a good friend of mine who flies the Airbus for a major airline, and he said that has happened on more then one occasion. I got the impression that they don't particuarly train for it in the simulator (maybe they do now, I don't know) but I'm sure they've got extra procedures and checklists now in place to help them solve the problem. It's a very well identified problem and the solution is something that can be worked through rather quickly, now that the problem has been identified.

I'm guessing the reason spoilers weren't using was because the pilot was wanting to keep the nose wheel off the runway as long as possible. Deploying your spoilers would kill the lift rather quickly and would cause the nose wheel to come quicker. Same theory with thrust reversers.

I also can't think of a reason why Vref would change. This type of problem shoud be treated more or less like a normal landing, with the exception being to hold the nose off as long as possible to avoid possible directional control issues, among other things.

Now take these opinions for what they're worth. I was just thinking out loud, so if I'm wrong about anything I'm sure it'll be very duely noted on here.

 

[gkrangers]

Soft field landing... <-- me thinking out loud.

 

[Say Again Over]

I am sure someone with more knowledge than me will chime in, but here's what I think, we can't simulate this specific condition in the sim. The good thing is that the captain on this aircraft was the F/O on the previous (JetBlue) incident. As far as why the T/R's and spoilers weren't deployed was due to the checklist for abnormal gear.

AUTOBRAKE ..... DO NOT ARM
REVERSE ......... DO NOT USE
NOSE ............. MAINTAIN UP
BRAKES .......... APPLY
ENG MASTERS .. OFF (shutdown the engines before nose impact)

 

[Alamanach]

I'm guessing the reason spoilers weren't using was because the pilot was wanting to keep the nose wheel off the runway as long as possible. Deploying your spoilers would kill the lift rather quickly and would cause the nose wheel to come quicker.

You guys would know better than I would, but... spoliers kill lift on the wings, right? And the center of lift is aft of the center of gravity, right? I think keeping the nosewheel off the ground would depend entirely on the elevators. The lift from the wings alone would tend to lift the back end of the plane, causing the nose to droop; this is balanced by the downward force from the horizontal stabilizer, which holds the nose up.

But then there could be a lot to the big airliners that runs counter to what I read in Stick and Rudder, so I could be way off here.

 

[Say Again Over]

GROUND SPOILERS.......DO NOT ARM

This item is on a previous part of the same checklist.

 

[cactus320mech]

you guys are awesome, thanks for the replies!!!

 

[User546]

You guys would know better than I would, but... spoliers kill lift on the wings, right? And the center of lift is aft of the center of gravity, right? I think keeping the nosewheel off the ground would depend entirely on the elevators. The lift from the wings alone would tend to lift the back end of the plane, causing the nose to droop; this is balanced by the downward force from the horizontal stabilizer, which holds the nose up.

You just made my head hurt reading that.

The good thing is that the captain on this aircraft was the F/O on the previous (JetBlue) incident.

I didn't know that. Boy, that guy's got some bad funk to him.

 

[KeroseneSnorter]

Not too long ago we had an emergency landing here at LAX. An A320 landed with a front landing gear cocked and locked at 90 degrees from center. The pilot managed an absolutely perfect landing that had me stunned. Later reading I found out that this wasn't an isolated incident. My question is do they practice for this? What are the procedures used in terms of reverse thrust, brakes, and adjustments to Vref are made to accomplish this? I also noticed that the spoilers were not deployed...

Contrary to the popular belief in the maintenance shack.....pilots actually do more than push buttons on an auto pilot!!

Do not know about the Bus, but I never had a sim session that included such a problem. Something like that usually doesn't make it in to the training schedule unless it is a known problem, the first few slobs that it happens to have to figure it out on the fly. An example is the rudder problem on the 737, took them a while to work it into the sim. Now as far as I know every 73 operator trains it. My guess is that the Bus has had enough nose wheel problems lately that it is probably being added to the sim training at most airlines, or at least into the QRH.

 

[FL420]

You guys would know better than I would, but... spoliers kill lift on the wings, right? And the center of lift is aft of the center of gravity, right? I think keeping the nosewheel off the ground would depend entirely on the elevators. The lift from the wings alone would tend to lift the back end of the plane, causing the nose to droop; this is balanced by the downward force from the horizontal stabilizer, which holds the nose up.

But then there could be a lot to the big airliners that runs counter to what I read in Stick and Rudder, so I could be way off here.

Think about it this way. The fulcrum on the teeter-totter is the CG when airborne but it is the axles of the main landing gear when on the ground. Killing lift with spoilers increases the effective weight on the MLG.