Pro Pilot Mag -Salary Study 2002

[StaticWick]

I've been verbally offered a position as Chief Pilot/Captain on a Part 135 Beech Duke. Everyone knows money talks and BS walks but I also wanted to present a fair market salary proposal without offending the future employer while not undervaluing services. Pro-pilot in 2002 showed a salary scale for a Chief Pilot on a entry level turboprop category in a Caravan of 33,000 low, the high being 59,000 with a average of 45,000. I talked to a good friend/president/chief pilot (part 135) and he said our contracts that we are getting paid on the low side. The job would be the "basic 135" so I wouldn't have pilots to oversee at first. Anybody been down this road before? PM me or post please; I need more information on how to tactfully go about this since we are still in the planning stage. Before you respond I will tell you this I know that if I requested 60,000 a year I might find a door in my face.

Thanks!

 

[LongBoarder]

Expirence means everything

If your profile is up to date.... you only have 1400+/- hours and there is no way that you are worth 60K for a single pilot piston C/P... I would think that you would be lucky to get 38K to be honest. I would be suprised if your company was able to fly the plane 200 hours at $450/hr. And divded by 38K it will take 85 hours just to pay your salary. You are low time.... limited expirence... and I see that you have flown some turbine equip. but I am sure that you have yet to go to flight safety or simuflight for PIC training.... Take the job... with the real salary.... go get some PIC, scare yourself to death a couple of times in weather, do a good job for the owners, and then after a year, ask for another 5K.

BTW you will be able to operate a C90 with -21 engines for less money than your duke.

LB

 

[Otter]

FAR 119

Do you meet the requirements for FAR 119, regarding experience?

 

[starvingcfi]

whoa. you've got 3 yrs of 135 experience and only 1400tt? hmm.

 

[KeroseneSnorter]

Whatever you do, make sure you read up on FAR 119 before you do anything else.

The FAA guys at the FSDO and your new employer may not see the humor in it if you fall short of the requirements. According to your profile you do not qualify for Chief pilot. It looks like you just barely make it in for single pilot 135 IFR.

 

[StaticWick]

Easy.

Whatever you do, make sure you read up on FAR 119 before you do anything else.

The FAA guys at the FSDO and your new employer may not see the humor in it if you fall short of the requirements. According to your profile you do not qualify for Chief pilot. It looks like you just barely make it in for single pilot 135 IFR.

EASY! EASY! Fella's I just needed some helpful advice not a rack whack!

OK, the talk is they wanted to apply for the certificate with deviations from the three year/experience Part 119/135 req. under chief pilot. I just wanted to know what to ask them in the areas of $$$ because they are already planning those numbers. It will not be for 6 to 9 months yet before the company is operational in that time frame I should be at 1800 TT 450 multi and 400 turbine. So are we in agreement that I am getting warmer to maybe the FSDO might say "OK". After all it's only one airplane, one pilot..."chief pilot" is only a title.

I do know of a Merlin II FO position, those requirements are 2500TT 500 multi...500 Turb. Now that burns my bacon because I can't fly it and I know I could after school. FYI~I am a realist and I am not holding my breath for this position. To be honest I think 38K is a little steep! And LongBoarder they are looking at C90 but then I will be forever in the "CFI bread-line" since I know those requirements would bump us up to multiple pilots (Insurance requirments not FAA) and me needing about 2500 TT for PIC.

This very paradox makes me want to quit on aviation and become a aviation insurance underwriter...can't beat them? Join them!

 

[Sc00ter]

Re: Easy.

I do know of a Merlin II FO position, those requirements are 2500TT 500 multi...500 Turb.

Holy crap! Those are the FO times??? I'm flying Metro III's with WAY less time than that. Heck, I'll probably upgrade before I meet those mins. I guess I should count my blessings.

Best of luck,

scoot

 

[cvsfly]

Re: Easy.

EASY! EASY! Fella's I just needed some helpful advice not a rack whack!

OK, the talk is they wanted to apply for the certificate with deviations from the three year/experience Part 119/135 req. under chief pilot. I just wanted to know what to ask them in the areas of $$$ because they are already planning those numbers. It will not be for 6 to 9 months yet before the company is operational in that time frame I should be at 1800 TT 450 multi and 400 turbine. So are we in agreement that I am getting warmer to maybe the FSDO might say "OK". After all it's only one airplane, one pilot..."chief pilot" is only a title.

..

Again you need to read Part 119 again. A Basic 135 is alot more than say a single pilot-in-command or single pilot and you can't expect to be granted the deviation for the 3 yr. experience. Deviation for combining Director of Operations and Chief Pilot is usually pretty easy if you have had some 135 experience before, but to get a deviation for experience you have to document comenserate (sp?) experience. I went through all of this when we went from single PIC to a basic. You need to show qualifiying aviation management experience to make up for the lack of 3 year PIC. When we applied for our Basic, I had 2.5 years 135 PIC and 1 year SIC. Total flight time 4200 hrs and time in type 700. The SIC time was not counted and we had to wait (the paperwork atcually delayed us enough to where it was not an issue anymore). Also don't sell yourself short. Chief Pilot is not just a title. It brings alot of responsibility with it and your a$$ whether its 1 or 50 aircraft. Then again every FSDO operates differently. Welcome to the annoying world of "non-standard" Flight Standards District Offices.

 

[FlyingSig]

I was 3 months shy of the 121/135 PIC experiance requirement (also had 3 years SIC 121 including large jet experiance at the time of the request) and the FAA denied our deviation request to make me chief pilot of our company. Waited 3 months and it was approved.

 

[StaticWick]

Re: Re: Easy.

Again you need to read Part 119 again. A Basic 135 is alot more than say a single pilot-in-command or single pilot and you can't expect to be granted the deviation for the 3 yr. experience. Deviation for combining Director of Operations and Chief Pilot is usually pretty easy if you have had some 135 experience before, but to get a deviation for experience you have to document....

... Also don't sell yourself short. Chief Pilot is not just a title. It brings alot of responsibility with it and your a$$ whether its 1 or 50 aircraft. Then again every FSDO operates differently. Welcome to the annoying world of "non-standard" Flight Standards District Offices.

Just so you know I'm not living in a dream world. These very same words I seemed to have said this to them (Owner & Manager) not much different from what you wrote and they smiled at me like they knew something I did not.

I agree whether a charter company gets something or not is (unfortunately) also FSDO specific. I’ve seen charter operations move across the US just to get away from certain FSDO’s just so they can conduct business ~ but regrettably this is another thread topic. I‘ve been talking to (future employer) them about this very issue and my friend / current part 135 boss agrees with you. We just don’t see it happening unless we factor in the “FSDO specific” factor (or your words the "non-standard" FSDO ) then they might know something all of us do not.

On the flip side of this coin (getting the certificate & charter) nothing burns my bacon more than watching “bootleg charter” service in operations when the rest of us have to go through the red tape. Kind of like security...it keeps the honest ones honest and provides a means for the dishonest ones.

 

[StaticWick]

PS.

Thank you for your input as I will keep this in mind when we talk $$$!! I will hold my head high and not sell myself short.