Preparing for CFI ride. Need advice.

[Speedtree]

One thing I forgot to mention earlier. During my CFI at a 141 school we were required to "practice" teaching students before our actual checkride. This does not mean we gave actual instruction and signed anyone's logbook. However we did grab someone who was willing to bear with us (a girlfriend, sibling, etc.) and give them two introductory flights just for fun. It helps to teach someone who's not your flight instructor and really doesn't know anything about airplanes. We also took a private pilot up and practiced demonstrating commercial maneuvers. This was not as beneficial as the private instruction in my opinion.

Keep the faith, you'll make it.

 

[Timebuilder]

I coundn't agree more: Proper Preparation Prevents Poor Performance.
Here's a case where I was bitten on the you-know-what by making an assumption. I had overprepared, and really impressed (his words) the FAA examiner who did my initial CFI. My mistake came in making a misinterpretation of the PTS for my II oral. I noted that the PTS allowed the examiner to exercise discretion on the FOI knowledge during the II oral, and I ASSUMED that since I had covered it so well during the initial CFI with this same examiner, he would note that I had demonstrated my knowledge previously, and we would go right on to the guts of instrument flying.
Au, contraire.
He jumped right on the laws of learning, and forgetting, and I quite memorably demonstrated the Law of Disuse by failing to correctly answer the first three of five questions he asked. I had convinced myself that he would go right to the "important" part, the instrument knowledge I had studied for, making a very wrong assumption about the approach he would take for this examination. I hadn't so much as looked at the FOI material. If I had done so, I probably would have had an easy time. If I had followed my motto, and Properly Prepared, I would not have Performed Poorly.

Don't assume anything. Prepare for everything. It's all fair game.

By the way, when I went to a DE for my MEI ride, this same examiner was there in his office, observing my DE's performance, and once again, mine.
I was ready, and loaded for bear. Ka-ching!

Now, steer around that pothole, II applicants.

 

[bobbysamd]

FOI questions

I'm rather surprised to hear what happened to Timebuilder, even if the FAA gave him both rides. That wasn't really cricket, even by FAA standards. Timebuilder had already proved he could instruct and understood the fundamentals of instruction. He just had to prove now that he could teach instruments. Totally uncool. However, Uncle Sam has give the FAA the power to be uncool.

It does help to go to an examiner with whom you've developed a good relationship. I will say decent examiners won't bust your balls in the way Timebuilder's balls were busted. But, be prepared.

 

[Cardinal]

Thank you guys for all the answers to Flyer's questions. I'm taking my CFI checkride a mere 16 hours from now, I'll let you know how it goes.

 

[Cardinal]

In the words of Blur "WOOHOO"! Passed the CFI practical today, the first time around, thankfully. Flew with a FSDO inspector.

4 hour oral, 2 hours in the aircraft.

Double-triple check all your historical signoffs and endorsements, the wording on my high-performance was very poor, and I could've been sent home over it. Also the Fed says he crosschecks things like the spin endorsement with the logbook entry, to make sure that the flight actually happened.

Started with a big question, let me ponder it while he took care of the paperwork. "What determines airworthiness?"

Moved right into the FOI, emphasis on CHaps 1 +2 of the AIH, the Learning Process and the Teaching Process. I came up with some mnemonics that served me well. The teaching process, for example, PREparation. Presentation. Application, Review and Eval - it spells PRE P A R E. PIM, Perceptions, Insights, Motivation. The Laws of Learning, etc. The major bulleted lists and subheadings are the key. It's stupid rote learning, but it's what they want, apparently. Only spent about 35 minutes on FOI stuff, he had my compose a lesson plan on chandelles, that was no problem closed book. Then taught the subject matter for maybe 5 minutes.

Then on to the Technical Subject Areas, things like Hypoxia, Spatial Disorientaion, Turning Tendencies, the typical stuff that isn't too strenuous. Asked me to do a CG calc for our aircraft, so I handed him the one I had prepared, so he just asked me to explain it. I discussed the basic equation and the math and why we bother. This may have been a mistake, as then he started asking about the various effects of aft CG on takeoff and we got really into the subject. In this instance i dug myself a hole. I knew enough to get out of it, but I beleive I did provoke some unnecessary questioning.

Rule #1 - Answer the question, then shut up.

Told me to plan a one checkpoint cross country. Didn't expect this at all, but had brought the dorky flight plan sheets along just in case. He thought I ought to be able to be done in 10 min, but it took me maybe 15. I did all the math with an electronic E-6B. Examiner was highly unimpressed. Had me scrounge a circular E-6B and work the math that way. I hadn't touched one of these for at least 4 years. Bigtime horror show. Had to follow step-by-step the directions on the computer itself, reteaching mysel in front of the examiner. It was probably the most horrific checkride moment of my flying career to date.

Explored the performance section of the POH, i slipped in some extraneous remark about distances varying on grass vs. pavement, and dug myself another hole. Now had to delve back into the book to find the sentence dealing with that issue.

He started pointing to things on the sectional chart, and I got roughed up. Transponder useage above/below Class C, where to look for more information about MOAs, student pilot ops at the local Class B, yea or nea, DME on this VOR? How Grid MOCAs are computed, etc. This didn't go well.

More assorted technical subjects and then off we flew. Nothing remarkable, two engine failures, chandelles, but no lazy-eights. The wind was howling so neither he or I could tell If the eights on pylons were any good. Obviously no turns around a point or rectangular course stuff aside from the traffic pattern. He did mention that it would be nice to identify and announce an emergency landing field prior to commencing a given maneuver. All of my landings basically sucked, but the wind helped my case. Other stupid pilot tricks, forgot to turn on the Transponder till about 5 minutes after takeoff. Taxied around with the flaps down and didn't realize it until holding short for takeoff. Just stupid stuff.

I used two aircraft for the check, a rented complex and the family bird. This made life very hard without much tangible benefit. You then have to know speeds, systems, on both a/c, and preflight, weight + balance etc two aircraft. Just more stress on a rough day to start with. For example I didn't spend enough time in the POH for the rented airplane, but did memorize all the speeds. Of course he never asked about any of the speeds, but did discover just how weak I was on some of the strange particulars in some of the systems.

There ya have it, in a rather large nutshell. Your mileage may vary. Hopefully it might be of help. Any further questions?

 

[Pilotadjuster]

THANKS!

Thanks Cardinal--great information! Echoed one thing my instructor has been telling me all along--answer the question, then SHUT UP! I keep digging holes in practice oral questions by interpreting him staring at me as a hint to keep going further...

 

[bobbysamd]

Cardinal

Congratulations on passing.

The Fed put you through the mill for the two hours. I realize that I've been out of the game a while, but it sounds to me that he busted your chops a bit.

Once again, folks, on ANY practical, DON'T VOLUNTEER INFORMATION!

Have fun instructing!

 

[Flyer7SA]

Congrats

Congrats, Cardinal!!!

Thanks for the fresh narrative of your checkride. That will really come in handy with me. The whole concept of riding with the feds sounds a little disconcerting, but I'm going to give it my best shot.

One more day in this cube and then I'll be able to start my new life. I have my commercial and am almost ready for the CFI ride. All of this just happened to coinside with my getting laid off from a technology company. It would have been much harder to just quit this job than to get laid off. I get a little severance and hopefully this will carry me through the doldrums of no students when I first start instructing.

Happy instructing Cardinal!

~Flyer7SA

 

[Cardinal]

Thanks guys.

bobbysamd, I looked back and the flights were .6 and .8, for a total of 1.4 in the air. The oral felt exhaustive, but we didn't waste much time in the aircraft, and I felt the whole things was handled in a just, reasonable manner.

Incidentally the examiner did have me throw on the foggles for 4-5 minutes during the climbout, just verifying some rudimentary cross-cockpit instrument skills, I guess.

 

[bobbysamd]

CFI practical

No, the flights sound about par. I've never heard of a CFI applicant having to demonstrate BAI on a practical. I thought that Practical Test Standards were supposed to eliminate such things.

I was talking about the oral. The time was about right but it sounded to me as if the ASI tweaked you a little. Great debrief on your practical. I got something out of it and couldn't have asked for better from one of my students.

The important thing is you passed and you're now a CFI. Welcome to the club! Good luck on your CFI-I and MEI.

 

[Buzo]

Congratulations!!!

I also had to wear the hood for my flight. I had the choice of me wearing it or having my examiner wear it. Since you must teach private students basic instrument skills, you have to demonstrate you can do it.