Preferential Bidding System

[Falconjet]

I have heard a lot of talk about a Preferential Bidding System (PBS) at FedEx and that the company is really going to push for it during our contract negotiations next year. On the board here I have seen a lot of different views about whether PBS is a good thing or bad thing. I'm not sure I understand the whole concept and thought it would be an interesting thread to start. Please bear with my ignorance and try to explain how PBS works at your carrier (if you have it) and why you think its a good thing or a bad thing.

 

[jon coqtoestone]

Greetings, Falconjet. Here's my opinion on how it works at AWA. I have mixed emotions regarding PBS. On paper, I really like the idea. The major caveat seems to be whether you're a wizard with computer/math logic (and's, or's, if's, but's, etc.). Seniority is also supposed to play a huge role. I'm very junior in seat/equip., so I can fill out my bid with my dreams, and can pretty much count on not getting what I want. However, I've only been able to hold a line three bids. Of all the pairings I was assigned those three bids, only two really "flew in the face" of my "avoid" bids. So, I had a roughly 85% success rate in not getting what I really don't like, and a 23% success on getting overnights I really wanted. Being back on reserve, I'll stand by my opinion that it's a relatively useless program for reserve bidding.

Many of our guys don't like the math involved with PBS -- if there is a particular trip you want, you have to be careful that all your other bids don't mathematically cancel out your "score" for the trip you want. (You aren't really awarded a traditional line -- you're awarded trips that get thrown together in accordance with your mathematical requests that ultimately comprise your line.)

I guess, bottom line: if you're senior and understand the math and scoring "logic," it'll work out great for you. If you're junior and/or don't play the "and-or-if-but" game very well, you'll be very disappointed. If you get PBS, whatever you do, make sure you've got a couple genius types on your PBS committee who can help "build" your bid.

I could go on forever, but this is pretty much the gist of my experience with the program. "You're mileage may vary." Cheers!

 

[AA717driver]

jon...

TWA lived with PBS(Ad Opt) for several years and it was loved my most people. It seemed to improve the seniority of most people.

I didn't like it because you really do have to think like the computer. If I want something really bad, I want to put it first on my bid and forget about it. With PB, you could get blind-sided by something further down the list that had fewer preference points but had many more occurrances and therefore, scored higher.

It eliminates padding your schedule by flying through the end of the month and not bidding a conflict.

WARNING--Pref bidding will reduce the number of pilots needed to operate the same number of flights. PB avoids trip drops at the beginning of the month AND, if the union doesn't run this program as they did at TWA, there is great potential for mischief on the company's part.

Good luck.TC

 

[fox3]

I'm 100% with Mailman! I'm in the middle of a vacation with 38 days off -- I could have done better, but I gooned up the 36 hour window -- say goodbye to vacation as you know it with a preferential bidding system. I WILL fall on my sword to prevent PBS!

 

[VaB]

Hey fellas,

I think we need to be a little more open minded about this PBS thing. Now before I get blasted in the face, I know of some guys from other airlines that have PBS. Very junior guys and they like it. I personally don't know all the nuts and bolts of the thing, so I'm trying to find out. I hear people raving about keeping PBS out, and I ask them what they know about it and for the most part they don't know a whole lot. Except for the fact that they think their vacation will be screwed up.

2 points think about I guess:

1) It seems like so many people are against it ONLY because they think the company wants it so bad, and of course there are so many pilots here who don't trust the company (that's a topic for a different thread), they automatically assume that it's a bad thing and that may be true. I just heard this conversation less than a week ago between 2 captains. "I'll die before PBS" "Oh yeah? Why? Tell me what you know about it." "Well.... We lose control".


2) The most important thing to remember, for us Fedex guys, this is OUR contract. WE make PBS what we want it to be. WE put the program together and say "This is how we want it to work". If we don't like what gets created, WE don't VOTE for it.



Again, I don't know all there is to know about PBS. All I know is what I hear from the angry ranting guys at 0200. "Down with PBS and why aren't I making what a United captain makes yet?" Let's try to have an open mind and see what they want, before it's thrown out.

Just another view from the devils advocate.

 

[fr8doggie]

Skeptical of PBS

I'm very skeptical of PBS at FDX. Just look at the VTO/secondary line building system. THAT it how PBS would work here.

Bottom line... kiss those awesome vacations good bye! I just had forty days off straight. PBS is designed so that you can't conflict trips with vacation.

This thing would be a big money saver for FDX. A BIG quality of life loser for the pilots.


NO PBS.

 

[profile]

I disagree that the current VTO system is how PBS would work here. That is the worst case scenario, I will agree, but why would we vote to take PBS if we cede that kind of control to the company?

I am not for it, but not necessarily against it either. Imagine a scenario where you could use PBS to fine tune the days you want to be scheduled to work and THEN apply your vacation with all current vacation rules in place, slide, expansion, etc. Pretty much, no matter what your seniority was, you could knock out an entire month with 7 days of vacation that way, in every seat in every airplane type. Sure, if you didn't have the vacation that month it would be ugly (far uglier than the worst line out there probably), but you build it that way because you know you have the vacation. You could also, of course, choose to not touch any trips or anything inbetween. Bottom line, it could work to give you MORE control, not less.

This is the way we need to approach this. It could be OK if we, the pilots, retain control of it. If we cede control of any part of it to the company it's DOA, IMO.

 

[fr8doggie]

Profile:

What you say is true. However, I believe that pilots controlling PBS would be one of Paul Cassel's famous "deal breakers" for the company.

I trust nothing that comes from top management here as it relates to our contract.

PBS offers nothing but headaches for me. What do you think management would be willing to trade for it? Leather Jackets?
Maybe we could start wearing flight suits.

While I'm not opposed to negotiating over the issue. I'm extremely skeptical we could ever agree over how it is to be used.

 

[Spur]

I be okay with PBS if we got 12 hrs of pay each time we submitted a bid. That would only be fair since it would probably take you one day to decipher the bidpack, and another day to determine your priorities and write the 50 or so lines of code required to get something half decent...

 

[JerkyHerky]

PBS is one of those lightning rod issues at FedEx. You bring up the subject and you can get your head handed to you. It is my understanding ( feeble as it is) that companies with some of the most militant unions have it and the pilots are happy with it. As suggested previously, it gives the company a stick to beat you with so therefore significant union involvement is required - as it is at companies that have a positive expererience with it.

For it to work at Fedex I imagine a whole new batch of work rules would have to be negotiated and who knows, management would probably balk at a compromise that would be palatable for pilots.

Every senior Capt I fly with complains how bad all the lines have gotten- I would think PBS would be great for them, they would get lines they want.

In the end when it comes to contract time I'll let the union speak for me, and judging from some recent informational MEC E-mails, it sounds as if the issue will be on the table and they'll be looking at it.