PPAS and Comair pilot opinions

DO-82 driver

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I am interrested in getting the opinion from Comair pilots who are currently using the PPAS program.

What are the effects in the cockpit?
How much slower are you actually flying?
Does ATC hassle you for flying so slow and are you being penalized for it? I.e. are they having you fly lower then originally flight planned to get out of the way?
Is there a noticable fuel savings?
How much time do it add to your flight versus they way you used to do it?
What are your general thoughts on the program?

I have done a search concerning this but these questions really werren't addressed.

Thanks in advance.
 

wmuflyguy

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I am interrested in getting the opinion from Comair pilots who are currently using the PPAS program.

What are the effects in the cockpit? There is a book in teh cockpit we get our speed from, it is based on weight and wind (head or tail).

How much slower are you actually flying? With a 120kt tailwind, you can see speeds around 240-230 (in the 50 seater)...however this is dependant on your altitude. At FL360 (74k) in 70 seater the speed will vary from .76 to .80

Does ATC hassle you for flying so slow and are you being penalized for it? I.e. are they having you fly lower then originally flight planned to get out of the way? They did at first, but they seeem to expect it now if they give us a speed restriciton we just do what they say.

Is there a noticable fuel savings? supposedly, though they don't tell us pilots.

How much time do it add to your flight versus they way you used to do it? Maybe 5-10 minutes, when done correctly

What are your general thoughts on the program? The book makes it easier to determine wether or not you can make a specific altitude, I like it better than the chart that we used to use. It also give you descent angles for different speeds to put int he FMS...these can be extreme though, with a head wind sometimes you can see angles of 6.0 degrees, they aren't used a whole lot.


I have done a search concerning this but these questions really werren't addressed.

Thanks in advance.

This is an example of what the PPAS info looks like,

http://www.aasi.com/products.html
 

flyboyike

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Personally, I rather enjoy having the Pilot Pay Augmentation System.
 

JetPilot_Mike

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PPAS was great when we first started it, because the company hadn't adjusted the block times, so we were making tons of extra time each leg. Once they adjusted the block times, it became difficult to make anything extra.

WMU is right, most people fly the slower speeds, but almost nobody did the descent angles published.
 

Beaufighter

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I used it as I was paid & trained to use it except for the obvious as in ATC mandated speeds, etc. & during the descents. I (passengers too) did not like the negative G roller coaster ride descents and I did not like playing Crossing Restriction Altitude Roulette.
 

Ifly4money

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I love PPAS. Its so easy to use. Just use the +120 line no matter what the actual winds are. Yes it saves fuel, bad part is dispatch sometimes only gives you enough fuel to use PPAS and then ATC in the NE wants max forward you have to tell them you're already doing what your goin' to do. When the argue just tell them "min fuel". If the insist ask them where they would like you to divert to. Have never had a problem after that with ATC.

PPAS fuel burns are typically 2200-2400#/hr total. Or roughly 400 total per hour than what I remember we used to burn. And at $3/gallon that equates into well over $50 million savings per year.
 

captainv

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All fuel savings are passed directly to Delta, and we haven't seen anything that tells us how much it saves (especially versus the increased block times and increased labor costs).

But hey, they want me to fly 240 KIAS at cruise, sure, whatever. If I get in early, great. If I don't, and my longest break in a 12-hour duty day is 38 minutes, then we'll run late all day after I get some food.

If they ever decide to run us efficiently, I'm all for it. Until then, I'll do it their way...
 

JECKEL

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I believe the target fuel savings was 5% on the low end and 10% on the most extreme (not very likely).

5% to 6% is probably about average.

"are they having you fly lower then originally flight planned to get out of the way?"
My last four legs were either at FL360 or FL 350.
 

172driver

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PPAS fuel burns are typically 2200-2400#/hr total. Or roughly 400 total per hour than what I remember we used to burn. And at $3/gallon that equates into well over $50 million savings per year.
Ummm...yes, but you are flying more hours because you are moving slower which results in higher mx costs, more hrs on the bird, higher crew costs, misconnects, etc. There is no way for a pilot to quantiify the savings, if there are any. In fact, I am in serious doubt whether the morons that manage Comair could figure it out either.

I love PPAS. Its so easy to use. Just use the +120 line no matter what the actual winds are. Yes it saves fuel, bad part is dispatch sometimes only gives you enough fuel to use PPAS and then ATC in the NE wants max forward you have to tell them you're already doing what your goin' to do. When the argue just tell them "min fuel". If the insist ask them where they would like you to divert to. Have never had a problem after that with ATC.
What a tool. I bet you're fun to fly with. You do know there are thousands of other planes in the sky besides your mighty CRJ? Even your company tells you to comply with ATC requests, PPAS or not. You don't get paid enough to make it worthwhile to milk that extra tenth. If dispatch doesn't give you enough fuel to speed up if needed, that sounds like a problem. Who's the final authority here? You or dispatch?
 

pilotguy143

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its good unless you're JFK based. I always get as far as hoxie and then its 320/.77 or better which usually means hitting .77 after 20 minutes of slow acceleration
 
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