Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

Politicians' corporate jet flights called wasteful

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web

sweptwingz

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 25, 2001
Posts
214
uh....oh......here come the eco-nazis, and junk scientists....
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Schwarzenegger and Feinstein preach energy efficiency but often fly fuel-gulping small jets.



By Paul Pringle, Times Staff Writer
February 28, 2007





Sen. Dianne Feinstein offers plenty of tips on how California households can combat global warming, such as carpooling and running only a full dishwasher.

But one bit of information Feinstein declines to share is the number of times that she flew last year on her husband's Gulfstream jet, which burns much more fuel per passenger-mile than commercial airliners.


Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger also has asked constituents to do their part to conserve energy — including cutting summertime power consumption — even though he takes to the skies on leased executive jets.

Aides say there is nothing contradictory between the pro-green pronouncements and the flying habits of the Democratic senator and Republican governor.

Some environmentalists aren't so sure.

"There appears to be a discrepancy between calling on people to make personal reductions and using a private jet that exacerbates the problem," Clean Air Watch President Frank O'Donnell said.

Flying on a Gulfstream rather than an airliner is like driving a sport utility vehicle instead of riding a bus, O'Donnell and others say.

A single cross-country round trip on a Gulfstream IV, or GIV, the model owned by Feinstein's husband, churns out about 83,000 to 90,000 pounds of carbon dioxide, experts say. By contrast, on a per capita basis, the average American produces 50,000 pounds from all activities in an entire year.

Nonetheless, Feinstein and Schwarzenegger intend to continue their noncommercial flying ways because their jobs demand a flexibility the airlines can't match, spokesmen say.

Schwarzenegger's office said he and a jet-leasing company are establishing a "carbon offset" program for the governor and fellow customers, retroactive to Jan. 1. Carbon offsets are bought from organizations that plant trees and support renewable energy enterprises, among other measures, to offset greenhouse gases produced by the buyers.

"This is big news," Schwarzenegger spokesman Bill Maile said of the governor's undertaking with NetJets, the leasing firm.

Feinstein, however, got the jump on Schwarzenegger. She began buying carbon offsets last year to partially cover the travel on the GIV, and will purchase enough offsets this year to compensate for all the trips, spokesman Scott Gerber said.

He added that Feinstein took "numerous" commercial flights in 2006, but flew mostly on the GIV. He balked at disclosing the tally of her Gulfstream journeys.

"We're not going to get into specifics," he said.

Noncommercial aircraft and other carbon-related indulgences have caused politicians considerable turbulence recently.

A conservative group has condemned Al Gore for racking up an average monthly electricity bill of $1,200 at his Nashville mansion last year while championing the anti-global warming cause. A Gore spokeswoman said the former vice president invests in renewable energy to offset his electricity use.

As part of an ethics push, the House and Senate are toughening restrictions on lawmakers who fly private jets, though exceptions for members and spouses who own planes are under consideration.

Earlier this month, Republicans accused House Speaker Nancy Pelosi of requesting a large military jet to fly her and family members between the capital and her San Francisco district.

Security protocols grant Pelosi occasional military flights because she is second in line to the presidency. Her office said she had only inquired about an aircraft with enough fuel capacity to make the trip nonstop, and would fly commercial if necessary.

Pelosi flew on private jets seven times in 2006, her spokesman said. "She made every effort to travel commercially whenever possible," Drew Hammill said.

Sen. Barbara Boxer says she took four trips on private aircraft last year, one with multiple stops over 2 1/2 days.

"If you can take a commercial plane to get where you need to go at the time you need to be there, you should do it," she said in an e-mail. "If not, you have to look at alternatives such as trains, fuel-efficient vehicles, buses, and in some cases, private planes."

For that last option, Feinstein reimburses her husband, Richard Blum, for use of the jet, Gerber said. Blum bought the GIV for about $23 million in 1999. The reimbursements are based on a first-class commercial fare, with more than 90% of the money coming from Feinstein's personal funds and the rest from campaign coffers, the spokesman said. Last year, the reimbursements to Blum totaled about $73,000, he said.

But a GIV's operating expenses are much higher than a first-class booking. A round-trip Los Angeles-Washington flight on the Gulfstream burns about 4,500 to 5,000 gallons of fuel at a cost of roughly $20,000, depending on local pump prices, said Jeff Beck, a veteran corporate pilot. And that doesn't include pilot fees, maintenance and parking bills.

"It's the least environmental thing that politicians can do," Beck said. He said Gulfstreams devour so much fossil fuel per passenger that "it's like they're throwing dinosaur bones out of the tailpipe."

A coast-to-coast, first-class ticket on a major airline goes for about $1,200 to $2,500, round trip, according to a sampling of three airlines' prices Tuesday.

A Boeing 767-200 airliner burns about 1,550 gallons an hour — three times as much as a GIV. But the larger plane typically can seat about 180 passengers, as opposed to a GIV's 12 to 14.

Eric Carlson, executive director of Carbonfund.org, a nonprofit that sells offsets, said it would charge $229 to cover the emissions from the GIV round trip.

Schwarzenegger flies a variety of leased jets, which cost his campaign $733,000 during the three months ending last September. Maile said the governor digs into his own pockets for some flights.

He also said Schwarzenegger has converted one of his Hummers to biodiesel fuel, and plans to install solar panels on his house. His other three Hummers remain gas hogs.

For her part, Feinstein drives a hybrid Lexus sport utility vehicle when she is home in San Francisco, Gerber said. But she drives a Lincoln Town Car in Washington.

Not that the eco-crowd is eager to criticize Feinstein and Schwarzenegger, who are generally viewed as key supporters of the growing movement to curb emissions.

Representatives of some environmental groups either would not comment on the two politicians' penchant for private jets, or suggested that allowances could be made in their circumstances.

"Given the exigencies of the campaign trail, if not the demands of governing of a large state, it may not be realistic to expect elective officials to fly commercial all the time," said Jon Coifman, spokesman for the Natural Resources Defense Council.

But O'Donnell, of Clean Air Watch, invoked a loftier ideal:

"It is fair to hope that our political leaders will lead by example."

http://www.latimes.com/news/politic...3431059,full.story?coll=la-headlines-politics
 
I wonder if the peson writting this travels by horseback.
 
I wonder if the peson writting this travels by horseback.


No, but he doesn't have the ducats or the friends to get a ride on anything better than a cattle car! See the jealousy comment by the previous poster.;)
 
Jealousy.

Yep.

Has this moron been paying attention to the news in recent years? We did have a little thing called 9/11, and private jets are a hell of a lot more secure than the airlines.

If he really wants to bitch, he needs to go after the millionaires with GIIs and GIIIs, which probably use more fuel per hour than a NG 737, who use them for flying back and forth to the ranch or fishing hole.

Regardless of what you think about Schwarzenegger's and Feinstein's politics, at least they are working for the public's interest.

C
 
I found it funny on the news the other day...
AL Gore's electric bill, over $1200 PER MONTH
his gas bill over $1000 PER MONTH
And this was at just one of his houses. Looks like hypocrisy at it's finest.
 
Myabe Al Gore can use that new golden statue as a solar collector to power his homes instead of using all of that electricity and natural gas.
 
"This is big news," Schwarzenegger spokesman Bill Maile said of the governor's undertaking with NetJets, the leasing firm.

...

Schwarzenegger flies a variety of leased jets, which cost his campaign $733,000 during the three months ending last September. Maile said the governor digs into his own pockets for some flights.

And boy, do we appreciate it. :D
 
al gore's plane burns water.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
When Gore was V.P. in 1995, he would tour the country in Air Force 2, (at the time, it was a gas guzzling, smoke spewing, 1960's vintage B-707 !) and lecture us Americans on our total selfishness, and how we need to stop wasting energy, and harming our "green mother earth". I heard him spout this hypocritical druid-speak in person on the ABQ fbo ramp. The hypocrisy of this mush-brained, eco-nazi, literally boggles the mind.

Like HE and his ilk are going to actually give up their private transport catagory jet travel, monster SUVs, and 20 bed-room mansions?

These rules will only apply to US.
 
Last edited:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
When Gore was V.P. in 1995, he would tour the country in Air Force 2, (at the time, it was a gas guzzling, smoke spewing, 1960's vintage B-707 !) and lecture us Americans on our total selfishness, and how we need to stop wasting energy, and harming our "green mother earth". I heard him spout this hypocritical druid-speak in person on the ABQ fbo ramp. The hypocrisy of this mush-brained, eco-nazi, literally boggles the mind.

Like HE and his ilk are going to actually give up their private transport catagory jet travel, monster SUVs, and 20 bed-room mansions?

These rules will only apply to US.


Long as they keep paying my a$$ to fly them around, they can SAY anything they want! I ain't gonna listen though!;)
 
The left is just trying to get votes....How big is super liberal Nancy's P airplane????? As long as the environment Hollywood flys around in Jets they will never go away....
 
Even if he is a hypocrite, it doesn't make him wrong.
I see how he has a PHD in climatology. He has no clue what he's talking about. All he's looking for is publicity. As many if not more climatologists are saying that we have nothing to do with the CO2 levels. So if that A-hole tells us that we have to do X then he better lead the way instead of telling me that I have to conserve but he doesn't. What a liar!
 
Really? Who?
Craploads, just do a search on the net. There was one petition that was signed by more climatologists that said we weren't responsible for global warming than there were that said we were responsible. The temp rise is more closely linked to periodical increases in solar activity than CO2 levels. There is a direct relationship to that as opposed to an indirect relationship to CO2 levels and temp. There are many times in the past that show increases in CO2 and DECREASES in temp and vice versa. These are just a bunch of chicken little "the sky is falling" nutjobs trying to scare us about nothing.
 
Gore actually buys green energy (ie renewable) for his homes, which is quite a bit more expensive than regular power. Could he make do with a smaller house? Probably, but he is a public figure and it would probably be difficult trying to fit meetings, offices and his family into a 2,500 sq. ft. ranch-style.

C
 
Gore actually buys green energy (ie renewable) for his homes, which is quite a bit more expensive than regular power. Could he make do with a smaller house? Probably, but he is a public figure and it would probably be difficult trying to fit meetings, offices and his family into a 2,500 sq. ft. ranch-style.
C

Ya, he buys his carbon credits from a company he ownes. The rich want to live like kings and they want us serfs to live in huts. They say it is okay for them because they have are what, "carbon neutral"!?! Screw them. He is full of crap and so is this global warming movement. Yes we are affecting the enviorment, but what they are preaching is crap. Just the flavor of the week. I am wondering when they will be coming after my handguns again.
 
Gore actually buys green energy (ie renewable) for his homes, which is quite a bit more expensive than regular power. Could he make do with a smaller house? Probably, but he is a public figure and it would probably be difficult trying to fit meetings, offices and his family into a 2,500 sq. ft. ranch-style.

C

Would you be so kind as to explain how the utility company differentiates between "green" and regular energy delivered to a particular house? Did they run separate wires and natural gas pipelines to Al's house?
 
I just talked to a buddy who is a consultant for numerous utility companies. He said that the way it's supposed to work is you pay a premium over the standard energy rate for "green energy." The utility is supposed to then purchase the amount of power you use from renewable sources (utilities typically are not the producers of electricity, they're more like distributors or retail outlets). That said, California law requires utilities to purchase all the electricity produced by renewable sources (windmills, hydroelectric, etc). So in theory if you live in California, the premium you'd pay would go toward investing in MORE renewable sources.

As for Gore, ultimately his energy comes from the Tennessee Valley Authority which (according to my friend the consultant) was originally set up after the Depression to build dams (i.e., hydroelectric power), and as such is one of the largest producers of renewable energy. However, the TVA is a producer, not a utility, so Gore is not purchasing his power direct from them, but rather through a utility (likely the Nashville Electric Source).

Here is what the NES says about their green power program:

Green Power Switch®

[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Making the Green Power Switch® is easy. This renewable energy initiative offers our customers a choice in the type of power they buy.

[/FONT] What is green power? Green power is electricity generated from clean, renewable resources such as solar, wind and methane gas.

How much does it cost? You can buy green power in 150-kilowatt-hour blocks (about 12 percent of a typical household's monthly energy use). Each block will add $4 to your monthly power bill. Green power cost more because the technology used to capture these renewable resources is more expensive than traditional power generation methods.
Sign up for Green Power Switch®.

Wind Power
Power out of thin air! Wind turbines can generate electric power anywhere the wind blows steady and strong. Large blades are attached to the shaft of an efficient electric generator. By using the momentum of moving air they create power. Eighteen turbines have been added to TVA's wind power generating site on Buffalo Mountain near Oak Ridge, TN.

Solar Power
The sun is an incredibly powerful source of energy. Photovoltaic panels harness that power and transform solar energy into usable electricity. When sun rays hit a solar panel, some of the electrons inside become charged and create an electrical current.

Methane Gas
There's treasure in your trash. Using methane gas as fuel to power an electric generator actually helps reduce air pollution. Unlike when it's released directly into the atmosphere as a potent greenhouse gas. Energy recovered from methane eliminates the consumption of more than 20,000 tons of coal per year.

Does it really make a difference?
[FONT=&quot]
Two blocks of 480 lbs. of 1,766 lbs of​
[/FONT] [FONT=&quot]
green power each = recycled aluminum or newspaper​
[/FONT] [FONT=&quot]
month for a year (15,322 cans!)​
[/FONT] The environmental impact of traditional energy sources like coal, natural gas, oil and nuclear power can be significant. Although no source of energy is impact-free, renewable resources create less waste and pollution. In fact, a green power investment of $8 per month on your electric bill is equivalent to not driving your car for four months.
 
Would you be so kind as to explain how the utility company differentiates between "green" and regular energy delivered to a particular house? Did they run separate wires and natural gas pipelines to Al's house?

Gladly.
Green power is created from renewable sources such as solar, wind, hydraulic (water) etc. Differs from non-renewables which basically are fossil fuels. Since the energy is initially more expensive to produce, it costs more if you opt for it. On the plus side, green energy does not have the price spikes that plague other sources.
Naturally the power doesn't go via different lines. All power goes into "the grid", whether it is solar, coal, hydraulic, nuclear etc, etc. Part of the greater expense can be taken to create more generating plants.
Natural gas is not renewable but is probably the most benign of carbon-based fuel sources. It burns very clean; basically just CO2 and water as by-products.
(Ultragrump did a better job of breaking down all the sources.)
Ultra Grump said:
The environmental impact of traditional energy sources like coal, natural gas, oil and nuclear power can be significant. Although no source of energy is impact-free, renewable resources create less waste and pollution. In fact, a green power investment of $8 per month on your electric bill is equivalent to not driving your car for four months.
"Impact" is the key; all power generation has impact on the environment and people. Green energy has the least.
C
 
Last edited:
The left is just trying to get votes....How big is super liberal Nancy's P airplane????? As long as the environment Hollywood flys around in Jets they will never go away....

Ridiculous.
Nancy Pelosi is third in line for the Presidency and needs a secure method of travel. She is flown around by the government, not lobbyists.

C
 
Ridiculous.
Nancy Pelosi is third in line for the Presidency and needs a secure method of travel. She is flown around by the government, not lobbyists.

C

A G5 will make it across country and so will a G4 She just wants a big plane to fly her friends and family to and from her vineyard in napa...


And as for Gore...His pool house and pool cost more per month then the average home in the US..PlS give me a f%ckin break about buying credits and what ever..How much gas did his limo cost to and from the oscars...And how did he get to LA...? I'm not doing sh&t until hollywood sells their 10000 sq foot homes and start walking the walk.....GAS... BURN BABY BURN....
 
So if W told you that burning fossil fuels is bad, that developing alternative energy sources was good, would you listen then? :rolleyes:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070309/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/bush_latin_america_40

Bush hails biofuels pact in Brazil

By DEB RIECHMANN, Associated Press Writer

AO PAULO, Brazil - At a mega fuel depot for tanker trucks, President Bush heralded a new ethanol agreement with Brazil Friday as way to boost alternative fuels production across the Americas. Demonstrators upset with Bush's visit here worry that the president and his biofuels buddy, Brazilian President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva, really have visions of an OPEC-like cartel on ethanol.

But Bush and Silva said increasing alternative fuel use will lead to more jobs, a cleaner environment and greater independence from the whims of the oil market. In Brazil, nearly eight in 10 new cars already run on fuel made from sugar cane.

"`It makes sense for us to collaborate for the sake of mankind," Bush said at Silva's side, after touring the depot. "We see the bright and real potential for our citizens being able to use alternative sources of energy that will promote the common good."

The agreement itself was signed Friday morning by Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and her Brazilian counterpart, White House spokesman Gordon Johndroe announced.

Bush's focus on energy during the first stop on his eighth trip to Latin America comes as the president's nemesis in the region, Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, is using his vast oil wealth to court allies. Bush's trip also includes visits to Uruguay, Colombia, Guatemala and Mexico.
At the fuel depot, Bush, sporting a white hard hat, fingered sunflower seeds and stalks of sugar cane and sniffed beakers of yellowish biodiesel and clear ethanol.
The depot is operated by a subsidiary of the state-owned Petrobras, where about 100 trucks come and go daily. About a half mile from the site, a large white balloon hung in the sky emblazoned with blue letters that said "Bush Out" in both English and Portuguese. The "s" in Bush was replaced by a swastika.

On his 45-minute ride from the airport to his hotel on Thursday night, Bush's motorcade sped by a dozen or so gas stations where drivers in this traffic-clogged city can pump either gasoline or ethanol.

Bystanders gawked at Bush's limousine, but only a few people waved. Anti-American sentiment runs high in Brazil, especially over the war in Iraq. Bush missed the demonstrations earlier in the day protesting his visit.

Riot police fired tear gas and beat some protesters with batons after more than 6,000 people held a largely peaceful march through the financial district of Sao Paulo. About 4,000 agents, including Brazilian troops and FBI and U.S. Secret Service officers, are working to secure Bush's stay in the city that lasts about 24 hours.

Authorities did not disclose the number of injuries in Thursday's demonstrations, but Brazilian news media said at least 18 people were hurt and news photographs showed injured people being carried away.

Undeterred by protests, Bush says he's on a goodwill tour to talk about making sure the benefits of democracy — in the form of better housing, health care and education — are available to all Latin Americans, not just the wealthy.
In Latin America, however, Bush's trip is widely viewed as a way for the president to counter the influence of Chavez, the populist ally of Cuba's Fidel Castro, who has led a leftward political shift in Venezuela, Ecuador, Bolivia and Nicaragua.

To taunt Bush, the Venezuelan leader will speak at an "anti-imperialist" rally in a soccer stadium on Saturday in Buenos Aires, Argentina, about 40 miles across the Plate River from Montevideo, where Bush will meet Uruguay's president, Tabare Vazquez.

Some protesters, carrying stalks of sugar cane, protested the ethanol agreement. The demonstrators warned that increased ethanol production could lead to social unrest because most operations are run by wealthy families or corporations that reap the profits, while the poor are left to cut the cane with machetes.

"Bush and his pals are trying to control the production of ethanol in Brazil, and that has to be stopped," said Suzanne Pereira dos Santos of Brazil's Landless Workers Movement.

The White House dismisses talk that the ethanol agreement between Bush and Silva is aimed at setting up an "OPEC of Ethanol" cartel led by Washington and Brasilia.

Bush said he wants to work with Brazil, a pioneer in ethanol production for decades, to push the development of alternative fuels in Central America and the Caribbean. He and Silva also want to see standards set in the growing industry to help turn ethanol into an internationally traded commodity.

"It's not about production-sharing, it's about encouraging development and encourage the Caribbean and Central American countries to get into the game," Bush's national security adviser, Stephen Hadley, said.

In January, Bush called on Congress to require the annual use of 35 billion gallons of ethanol and other alternative fuels such as biodiesel by 2017, a fivefold increase over current requirements. To help meet the goal, the president also is pushing research into making ethanol from material such as wood chips and switchgrass.

One roadblock in the Bush-Silva ethanol talks is a 54-cent tariff the United States has imposed on every gallon of ethanol imported from Brazil. Bush says it's not up for discussion.
W doesn't walk the walk either, reference the last paragraph. A 54 cent tariff on sugar-cane enthanol, which just happens to be much more efficient than corn ethanol.
 

Latest resources

Back
Top Bottom