"please send current photo"

[propilot]

An ad for a citation pilot asks that a resume with current photo be mailed to the company....Doesn't this violate a few equal opp. laws??? If they can't ask your sex/race/etc., how can they ask for a photo?

 

[Gulfstream 200]

send them a photo of the meanest, nastiest , scumbag ACLU Lawyer you can find.....

cant believe someone would put that in an ad..

Heck, send them a photo of your a$$..

 

[getonit]

I saw a similar ad about 3 months ago for a company in Arizona. I included my passport photo (what they wanted), with all details blocked out, and told them they should probably not do it that way because some slimy lawyer would use it against them. Never heard from them, if they are too stupid to realize how dumb that is, probably don't want to work for them anyway.

 

[Timebuilder]

From what I am told, asking for a photo is perfectly legal. Soon, we will likely all have to produce a photo as a part of the hiring process, to be matched to our records and our new photo pilot's license.

No, we don't have a photo license yet, but trust me, we will.

Today, I auditioned for a commercial. First order of business? My 8x10, with the resume on the back.

And so it goes...

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Timebuilder,

I have NO idea who told you that!!!

For TV sure, the job description requires a LOOK, nothing wrong with that...a certain part may require a young white male etc..

But a pilot job? Might as well come out and say we want a black female to fill a quota....maybe they want to know your age? (they all do) 99% of people give that away by thier college graduation date on resume...or by thier military experience (vietnam)..thats fine.


But a picture?? very bad idea, cant believe they did that!

 

[Timebuilder]

I have NO idea who told you that!!!

Well, no one had to tell me. Let's look at the tea leaves:

We have heightened security concerns at all levels of aviation.

Soon, and I mean within five years, you will carry some sort of picture pilot ID, either on your pilot license itself or some other required format.

Background checks and aiport security checks will include a comparison of the image you submit to a visual file to ensure that you correspond correctly to your information.

As mentioned, there is no law that prohibits the submission of a photo. Not only would any such law be ruinous to the entertainment industry, but it could easily play havoc with security concerns.

While no one can force you to fill in a form that indicates age, gender or race, there is no law that I have heard of the prohibits a picture as a part of the pre-employment process.

Government spends a lot of time trying to take human preferances out of the employment equation, but people will always try to circumvent these restrictions. People have this odd idea that in a freee country, they should be free to hire whomever they want, for whatever reason, particularly if they own the company. This freedom of association was the first freedom we lost after WWII. There are others, but that is for another thread.

 

[Rick1128]

Timebuilder,

We as pilot must already have a picture ID. Eariler this year the FAA changed the regs to require all pilots to have a picture Drivers Licence to exercise the priviledges of their pilot certificates. I understand that it caused some problems for pilots who lived in the few states that didn't require such DLs. And as I understand were four states that didn't.

 

[Timebuilder]

You are correct, Rick.

I'm saying that we will very likely see some form of ID which is more closely linked to the fact that we are pilots than the state driver's license. This will make it more uniform, and prevent problems like the states that didn't use the photo ID.

Haven't seen Tom since I was laid off. Say hello for me.

 

[JimNtexas]

In employment it is considered very dangerous to ask for a photograph with a job application:

http://www.bc.edu/bc_org/hvp/e/job_fair/legal_guidelines_chart.html

http://bpo.indiana.edu/bpo-cgi/HRMWebsite/hrm/articles/select/legal_qu.pdf

It is legal to tell applications that if they are hired they must produce photo ID and cooperate with a background check when that's appropriate for the job in question.

This quesiton is similar to that of pre-employment physicals. In the old days airlines used to be able to administer phyiscals to applicants as part of the interview process. Now they can't give a physical until after a job offer is made.

 

[Timebuilder]

I've had this discussion before.

If you look at the BU info, it says that asking for a photo prior to employment should be avoided.

It does not say it is illegal.

All of the references mentioned on the BU site are in reference to questions that may be/should be ASKED (as in a typed question or "checkbox") on a job application.

Now, let's say that one of these wacky "9th circuit" type judges says that asking for a photo as a part of the application process is illegal.

Fine. Here is what can happen. The potential employer can mandate that all applications be filed in person, and they can digitally store an image of the applicant at that time while the forms are being filed.

More lilkely: this will be deemed a part of the security protocol (we want to know if any terrorists are APPLYING to airlines, etc...) and will pass muster.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Timebuilder:

we are talking about EQUAL OPPORTUNITY, all this is BEFORE you are hired and flying.

This has nothing to do with aviation or security, its the hiring and selection process..which has NOTHING to do with a photo.

After that, sure, we all will do background checks, ID's etc...as we already do...long before we touch the controls of a plane or have access to the ramp..

EOE will stand stronger than the current security scramble, and one will NEVER EVER have to submit a photo to apply at an airline. That airline would be broke (er, more broke than they are) in a weeks time from the lawsuits.

 

[Timebuilder]

Until a judge tells the EEOC that he has just written a decree (outside of the legislative process, as they are want to do in recent years) that makes requiring a photo illegal, there will be no basis for the lawsuits you speak of.

Current law addresses ONLY the job application and what may be ASKED, not what may be shown. If we WERE to prevent what may be shown, then we would all have to don burkas for the interview process, and use devices to disguise our voices.

Of course, then no one would be able to use "affirmative action", now would they?

 

[JimNtexas]

Timebuilder, for the sake of you employer and your job, please stay far, far, away from your employer's application and interview process.

In the United States it is unlawful to request a photograph with a job application.

Just google "preemployment photograph requirement" for hundreds of links like this one:

http://www.inc.com/articles/2000/05/19988.html

Note that "Any requirement for a photograph prior to hire" is listed in the table headed "Unlawful Pre-employment inqiuires".

 

[Timebuilder]

As I said, no one has shown me a law that specifies how a photograph requirement might be illegal.

You have not shown me a law, either federal or from any state. I'm sure there may be a state where a photo is illegal, but I have never seen such a state law.

In addition, there is no law that says that applicants cannot be photographed. So, if you DO find a state where asking an applicant for a photograph is indeed illegal, then you must also have a law that would prevent an applicant from being photographed during the application or interview process.

The proof of this happens every day. There is no "waiver" or "release" from the laws of this country that allows a casting director to demand a "head shot" of every model or actor, or to take a picture of the person who is applying to do the work. Under the law, the employer-employee relationship remains the same as any other at-will employment. The reason that this is the case is that there is no regulation that the casting director must seek relief from in order to demand the photos.

Many sources may recommend that you do not ask for a photo, but laws that prevent you from asking for one are not in evidence here.

You WILL see this become far more common as time goes on, and airlines seek to prevent potential hijackers from being hired.