PlaneSense / Alpha Flying

[On Your Six]

No offense young buck but you're far too inexperienced in the game of life to be calling anyone who highlights the difficulties in living on 27k a year a whiner. Maybe you still live at home? With three roommates? If you end up with a girlfriend, guess how quick going out a few times a month will eat up that after-tax take home pay.

A piece of advice, you'll really know about a company after you've worked there for a year or so. Doesn't matter what company. It's probably hard for you to understand right now but someday you'll see.

Mr. I.

C'mon - let him be excited about his first professional flying job. Flying a PC-12 will be a good learning experience for him plus he'll get to see a lot of short airstrips and uncontrolled fields that his ASA buddies will miss. He's a young guy and he can always go the regional route later if needed. $27K is a lot more than his ASA buddies will be earning initially and with multiple roommates it is doable in Hotlanta. 7/7 will also give him some time to enjoy the local nightlife. Sounds like a good situation for someone just out of school - especially if you don't want to go the airline route.

 

[Mr. Irrelevant]

Ok, I do see your points. It is great that he is excited about getting out in the working world and pursuing a dream of flying for a living! Per the original posters query, 27k isn't so much obviously. Although at that age being broke is pretty much expected. The perspective of a 22 year old is far different than that of a 30, 35, or 40 year old.

Good luck Phil. Have fun.

Mr. I.

 

[dickburns]

Based on all that, I am in NO position to complain. Sorry I can't join the ever-growing club of aviation whiners.

You will be in that position soon enough, and become a whiner as well.

It may sound cliche, you are young and just getting into this industry, expect the unexpected. What ever you think will happen will be the exact opposite.

Especially when you are a year deep, you're still not upgraded, but they've been saying your so close to it for the last six months, and those jets that are supposed to show up still haven't and when they do its still going to take you another 5 years just to see the right seat of it.

So you decide you want to search for another job, with all that oh-so valuable single engine sic time, and then you realize you you were one of those fools that signed a 2 year training contract to fly a single engine plane as an sic.

Oh but you'll just pay it off, with what money, all that 27k you just made, after bills, cost of living, and taxes, unless mom and dad spot you the cash, good luck!

Do yourself a favor and stick it out til you get 135 minimums, you're very close. Yeah life might suck for a couple years after that but you'll look back on it and be glad you did it.

 

[Frozen Ronin]

Lots of help in what NOT to do, very little in what TO do. That's another thing you'll learn in aviation. There are a lot of 'can't' types and very few 'can' types.

These 'whiners' have a reason for being bitter, with broken dreams and false hopes left unfulfilled. However, know that there are cool jobs out there that make sense. There are so many jobs out there that aren't cool and DON'T make sense. A guy could waste a lot of time before learning his efforts aren't really getting him anywhere, and that's what you should be taking away from many of the comments.

You're here on this board. That's a plus. Read as much as you can concerning suggestions to young pilots. There is experience hidden within these posts that can be a benefit to you if you know what to take and what to ignore. Ignore the anger, take the knowledge.

For my part: PIC time is invaluable. SIC time is only valuable on an aircraft that REQUIRES an SIC. Reviewing those with SIC time, I'm looking for those that are on the CRJ, ERJ, -8, etc, others with a requirement to have an F/O. Those with Caravan and 402 SIC time go to the bottom.

Think about finding a company that has both singles and twins. Hiring into the 207 with upgrade into the 402 (as PIC) will make much more sense. In a year's time, you have maybe 500 hours of single pilot multi engine PIC, where the other guy has ..... 500 hours of turbine SIC in an aircraft that doesn't really need one. Is it loggable if it isn't required? Sure, under certain circumstances. But the multi PIC time is a no brainer for me. I'd rather take the guy that's developed some skills as a multi PIC decision maker over the gear monkey taking the place of the autopilot. But that's just me.

Just make sure it makes sense for YOU. And good luck!

Ronin

 

[LAFrequentflyer]

With a 7 on/7 off couldn't he CFI on his days off? Maybe even log some ME time as CFI. I would think after a few years he would be in a pretty good position to move on to bigger and better things...

Prespectives - its all about prespectives.

I would love to work for Alpha Flying as a career. Of course, I'll be a retired AF 03 with a pension and 38 years old next April when I move to aviation...

 

[jjc525]

Does anyone know how overtime flying is paid and what about the training agreement, how much and is it and is it pro rated?
looks like a good gig, if corporate of fractionals are in your future plans!

 

[Taildraggaah]

I'd take the 'pay cut' to fly something with two jet-a burning engines.

PT6 burns Jet A

 

[Geronimo4497]

I'm out of Alpha now, but on the new 7 and 7, the rumor is that OT will be paid at 1.5 times your daily rate. The FO training contract is 18 months, pro rated somehow. No contract anymore for PIC upgrades. I had a good time there over 3+ years but I got sick of many things; compound that with the lack of multi time = splitsville.

 

[jjc525]

geronimo
by the look of your avatar, are now at Avantair? in regards to Alpha can one be based in FXE in the winter and PSM in the summer??
Over all I hear good things about Alpha, the MOU is what it is; it sound like the 7/7 will happen. can you give me any insite on the interveiw??

Thanks
JJC

 

[LAFrequentflyer]

Lack of ME time is a big knock...However, for someone that isn't looking at moving on from there and can do part-time CFI work on the side the 7 on / 7 off is a good deal...

-LAFF

 

[LAFrequentflyer]

I'm out of Alpha now, but on the new 7 and 7, the rumor is that OT will be paid at 1.5 times your daily rate. The FO training contract is 18 months, pro rated somehow. No contract anymore for PIC upgrades. I had a good time there over 3+ years but I got sick of many things; compound that with the lack of multi time = splitsville.

What were some of the trips (to / from)? I tried to track on flightaware but don't know the N#s you guys use.

-LAFF

 

[Geronimo4497]

All of the tail numbers end in AF. Check PSM on flightaware and you will see the traffic. If you can find the FAA listing of approved RVSM operators, you can find a comprehensive listing of the airplanes in the fleet.

JJC, I'm not sure about switching bases between seasons. That would be a great question to ask during the interview. As far as the interview goes, I'm not the person to ask. The way the interviews are conducted nowadays is light years ahead of the way mine was conducted way back when (something along the lines of: 'You have PC-12 time? Can you start in next month's class?')

If I did not have career aspirations greater than bombing around the east coast of the US, Alpha would have been perfect for me. How does that saying go about the hot chick? There is always some dude sick of hitting it!

 

[PhilatAU]

No offense young buck...It's probably hard for you to understand right now...
Mr. I.

Thanks for all the advice, dad. Just be careful, some people won't listen to you if half of what you say to them is insulting.

Good luck Phil. Have fun.
Mr. I.

Thank you for lightening up and understanding that I get advice from lots of sources, The last of which is a message board that I've been on for all of 2 weeks.

You will be in that position soon enough, and become a whiner as well.
dickburns

I was told the same thing a few years ago when I, as a private pilot, told somebody I was looking forward to being an instructor. I've been teaching a couple years now, had to wait 6 months longer than expected to start teaching in the twin, currently make $5/hour less than full time instructors, don't get paid for an incredible amount of administrative work, and do it while being a full time student and being in charge of a couple student organizations.

And ya know what? I still love the job, the flying, the students, and 90% of who I work with. The "just wait, you'll change" argument has never really worked with me. Try again.

Do yourself a favor and stick it out til you get 135 minimums, you're very close. Yeah life might suck for a couple years after that but you'll look back on it and be glad you did it.
dickburns

So if life is going to suck anyway why not just take the job in the PC12 to build up to part 135 mins? How is it better if I "stick to" instructing?

Just make sure it makes sense for YOU. And good luck!
Ronin

Thanks!

Flying a PC-12 will be a good learning experience for him...short airstrips and uncontrolled fields that his ASA buddies will miss....can always go the regional route later if needed. $27K is a lot more than his ASA buddies...7/7 will also give him some time to enjoy the local nightlife. Sounds like a good situation for someone just out of school - especially if you don't want to go the airline route.
OnYourSix

WE HAVE A WINNER! Those are my thoughts, stated exactly as I think them. By this time next week I'll have 1,000 TT and 120 multi, I can get on with a regional in the future if I really need to. So there's my backup plan if it makes anybody feel better.

 

[dickburns]

I'm not trying to discourage you from flying, I too once upon a time enjoyed instructing, the money was ok and I was home all the time, pretty much made my own schedule.

Set your standard higher than a single engine sic job, if you work from your 900 hours to 1200 for 135 mins I would imagine youll still be under a contract with them.

Theres way better places than alpha flying to get your initial flying experiences. Nothing against alpha but it more or less sounds like a retirement job, its for a person that doesnt need time anymore but wants to keep flying.

 

[Mr. Irrelevant]

Phil,

I don't think working for Alpha is a bad job starting out. You'll probably learn quite a bit. On the other hand as dickburns pointed out, and a much older pilot once told me about a company I once worked for(not Alpha), "it's a good place to start and a good place to finish, but you don't want to spend a career here"!

There are certainly many whiners on this board and in aviation. However, many of the points it seems they are up in arms about are often quite valid points. Maybe they don't really come across that way. And yah, lots of times it's just hot air. I'm sure as time goes by you'll develop your own sense of how to discern the whiners and the ones who have these valid points. I can say I've been able to learn a good amount, both bad and good, about one company or another by paying attention to some of the concerns brought up on this and other aviation web-boards.

I have to admit, I love flight instructing as well. Still do it. Although I wouldn't do it full-time in 172's forever as you really don't expand your knowledge beyond that realm of aviation, thus the need to fly bigger, better, faster, etc. Definitely move on to Alpha, just don't limit yourself.

Mr. I.